Oil leaks - At what point are you better off pulling the motor/trans/tc rather than fixing them in place? (1 Viewer)

[Joe Link]

Like most 80's, the chassis on my 1996 has no lack of external lubrication, been that way for years. Hasn't been a huge deal but recently it got to the point of leaking on the ground, meaning I need to do something about it. I'm also in the process of a complete suspension upgrade and I'd hate all my nice shiny parts to get coated in crud, so I'm trying to form a plan of attack. I'm fortunate in that I have access to a nice shop with a lift. Looking it over with my dad the other day, he turned to me and asked "You're keeping this, right? Why don't we just pull it and replace all the seals?". He's been a mechanic for 40 years and at this point in his life he's usually not one to suggest such large undertakings, so I was surprised. I'm wondering if it'd be worth the hassle.

- The motor seems to be in good shape. Compression numbers from the last compression test on 03.24.2019 were 195, 190, 195, 190, 185, 195. The head gasket was replaced by the original owner at 80k, current mileage is around 260k.
- I'm slowly gathering parts for an LS swap but I won't be doing it until this motor needs to be replaced. I don't drive this much, maybe 6k/year, so that could be a very long time.
- While he's a mechanic, he's busy and doesn't have much time. While I have quite a bit of mechanical experience, I still consider myself a novice, or maybe one step past. I'd be doing most of the work, with his assistance when required.
- He doesn't know much about these motors or what's required to pull them. I've searched on here quite a bit and it seems like the components under the intake manifold make this job a pain. Last year I did purchase all new OEM hoses before realizing how difficult they are to access, so it would be nice to be able to replace those easily.
- I bought the Cruiser Parts OEM engine overhaul gasket kit from a mud member a while back, and I've been collecting a bunch of other OEM gaskets/seals, but I don't have a lot of extra cash to put toward this.
- In the pics below you can see a massive power steering leak. I have all the parts to fix that, so I'll be doing that either way.

 

[Joe Link]

Couple more pics

 

[BILT4ME]

Your leaks are essentially going to be from the following sources:
Valve Cover
Spark Plug Tube Seals
Distributor O-Ring
Oil Pump Seal
Front Main Seal
Power Steering pump Hoses
Power steering reservoir
Transmission cooler hoses

ALL of these can be easily done with the engine in the truck.

Unless you WANT to do a whole bunch of WIIT (While I'm In There) stuff, no need to pull the engine.

OTOH, you can get every vacuum hose, fuel filter, wiring harness clip, PHH, rear heater hard lines and soft lines replaced. Then may as well pull it with the T-Case and Transmission and do all the seals on those as well.

Ah hell, remove the radiator cap and drive a new one underneath it........

 

[Joe Link]

One thing I forgot to mention, I had an inspection done at a cruiser shop in 2017-2018 and they mentioned the rear main seal was starting to leak. How they determined that with all the other leaks, I'm not sure, but that's what they said.

 

[BILT4ME]

One thing I forgot to mention, I had an inspection done at a cruiser shop in 2017-2018 and they mentioned the rear main seal was starting to leak. How they determined that with all the other leaks, I'm not sure, but that's what they said.

Pull the trapezoid shaped cover on the front of the bell housing under neath and take a pic of the front side of the torque converter and post it. If it's wet and oily inside there, then, yes it's possible. Most typically, it is the oil pan seals that leak before the rear main seal.

However, if you're going to pull the transmission from the engine, replace the rear main. It's a 10 minute job. (After the transmission is out and not counting reinstalling everything.)

 

[ZackR]

Mine used to look just like that. Now it still leaks a bit but nothing compared to what it once was after doing these:

- Distributor O ring
- Valve cover gasket / spark plug seals / PCV valve
- Oil pump cover gasket / front main seal

With access to a lift I'd also recommend the oil pan gaskets (upper and lower), that's next on the list for mine.

Take your dad up on his offer to help knock these out, I know I would!

 

[Joe Link]

Pull the trapezoid shaped cover on the front of the bell housing under neath and take a pic of the front side of the torque converter and post it. If it's wet and oily inside there, then, yes it's possible. Most typically, it is the oil pan seals that leak before the rear main seal.

However, if you're going to pull the transmission from the engine, replace the rear main. It's a 10 minute job. (After the transmission is out and not counting reinstalling everything.)

Great, I'll do that this weekend. If I have to pull the transmission that might be the deciding factor as to whether I pull the drivetrain.

 

[BILT4ME]

Great, I'll do that this weekend. If I have to pull the transmission that might be the deciding factor as to whether I pull the drivetrain.

If you decide to, replace the hard steel lines for your rear heater. The transmission MUST be removed to do that and in Oregon, it gets cold. Replace all cooling system rubber with OEM or Gates Green Stripe (absolutely no silicone hose)

 

[Joe Link]

If you decide to, replace the hard steel lines for your rear heater. The transmission MUST be removed to do that and in Oregon, it gets cold. Replace all cooling system rubber with OEM or Gates Green Stripe (absolutely no silicone hose)

Will do. I always forget I have a rear heater, I don't think I've turned it on but a couple times over the years, but I don't want to delete it. This is probably terrible for the seals/gaskets/hoses/etc.

 

[BILT4ME]

Will do. I always forget I have a rear heater, I don't think I've turned it on but a couple times over the years, but I don't want to delete it. This is probably terrible for the seals/gaskets/hoses/etc.

It circulates coolant any time the heater slide is on the hot position. You just don't get "heat" because the fan hasn't been turned on.

But the hard lines rust out and are exposed to all the heat from the cats and all the road grime. You cannot replace them without removing the transmission and maybe the cats.

 

[bhsdriller]

Usually a rear main leak is nothing to worry about. If they mentioned it's just starting i'd forget about it.

 

[Joe Link]

It circulates coolant any time the heater slide is on the hot position. You just don't get "heat" because the fan hasn't been turned on.

But the hard lines rust out and are exposed to all the heat from the cats and all the road grime. You cannot replace them without removing the transmission and maybe the cats.

Good to hear I haven't been doing it a disservice by not flipping that switch.

Usually a rear main leak is nothing to worry about. If they mentioned it's just starting i'd forget about it.

That was my strategy three years ago when they told me

 

[Dissent]

I'd pull it and reseal it, especially given the hard to reach heater hoses and all the emission hoses on the intake. We grew up with a fleet of Chevy trucks (3x pickups, 2x suburbans and 2x blazers). My brother and I became so efficient at pulling the motors, it was the first thing we did in new acquisitions and didn't think twice for those we weren't completely overhauling, more for leaky stuff like this.

There's lots of cleanup and WYIT stuff that rots after 24 years that you'll kick yourself for not fixing next year. Speaking from experience, go ahead and reseal/rebuild the steering gearbox with the rest of the power steering work, I opened mine 7 times and dealt with the mess everytime. Next Cruiser gets all new/rebuilt PS stuff FIRST! RedHead Steering Gears did mine and I love it.

Since you'll have the pan off, I'd hit up @NLXTACY for a weld in oil return bung in case you chase that LS dream away and end up with a Wit's End Turbo. If you do go LS, the next owner will thank you for your bung work.

 

[Joe Link]

go ahead and reseal/rebuild the steering gearbox

What could one expect to pay for this, using the OEM kit?

 

[REKCUT]

Almost everyone I know with a land cruiser has been told they have a rear main seal leak. Its the catch all for most shops. Have yet to run across one actually leaking there. Its almost always the valve cover. Difficult to get on correctly. Helps to take hood off. Valve cover, distributor o ring and oil pump cover.

 

[PZLCruiser]

Do it!

 

[Joe Link]

Thanks for the encouragement guys.

Honestly, now I'm thinking of pulling it, inspecting everything, replacing the gaskets/seals, having the head gone through, and keeping the 1FZ-FE (at least for the next couple years).

I know it's crazy, but I've never really felt it was that underpowered, and I've only ever driven it with 33's and stock gears (which I just got back from the shop with 4.88's now).

 

[flintknapper]

Thanks for the encouragement guys.

Honestly, now I'm thinking of pulling it, inspecting everything, replacing the gaskets/seals, having the head gone through, and keeping the 1FZ-FE (at least for the next couple years).

I know it's crazy, but I've never really felt it was that underpowered, and I've only ever driven it with 33's and stock gears (which I just got back from the shop with 4.88's now).

I think that would be smart. Pull it...fix all leaks, freshen up the head and drive it. Like you, I haven't found the 1FZ-FE to be terribly under-powered, but I don't live in a mountainous region where it would tend to show more. I run 33's on mine also.

I've found that the L/C simply requires some 'driver input' when loaded, negotiating hills or pulling a trailer.

But that is easily done since we can select to run in ECT mode (which holds the transmission shift points to a higher rpm). We can control to some degree when overdrive is engaged (and torque converter locked) and we can manually shift through (or hold certain gears). So while control isn't 'infinite' we do have the ability keep the engine in its power band and the transmission in the most favorable gear.

The 1FZ-FE will run happily at 3500 rpm (or more) all day if needed....so don't be afraid to go there. Fuel consumption will increase of course, but they suck at gas mileage anyway.

 

[White Stripe]

260k? I would pull the motor for sure. I'd have the cylinder head freshened up too while at it.

 

[bigredmachine]

dont forget to change the hoses and heater valve on the firewall, the valve will get brittle over time due to the plastic getting old