New driveline noise after lift

[bloc]

If you spin-test the wheels and don't hear any noise, then I find it hard to believe it's a wheel bearing. I suppose it could be and just not showing itself unless it's under load of course. Maybe clip a GoPro on the fender on each corner over a few high way runs and see if it picks up any different noise depending on the side?

Based on what I've read transmission bearing or pinion bearing are possibilities, but they seem unlikely to me. A bad pinion bearing should show itself if the noise happens mainly during acceleration or deceleration, and if you tried disconnecting the front driveshaft already then it's probably not the front output bearing on the transmission. I'm not an expert though.

The wireless ChassisEar would be ideal for this.

Side note: A part-time kit would be good for towing 4-down behind an RV. I know a few folks have tried the electronic disconnect method in the manual, but given Toyota removed the instructions in later models along with changing transfer case suppliers to Borg-Warner, I'm not convinced it's really wise. Otherwise I can't see the need.

Not only did I do a spin test, I had all 4 hubs in the air on jack stands with the truck in drive, listening to each bearing with a mechanics stethoscope. All sounded great, front hubs totally silent, others just a very faint hiss. I’m not worried about the hiss as it was the majority of bearings and it is quite improbable for all of them to be failing at the same time. Did the same for the front and rear diff bearings, transfer case input bearings. Same story.

This backs up what you say about it needing to be under load.

As for no clicking, it is possible to have different failure modes as they go out. Or at least that makes sense in my head.


A chassis ears is in the next few steps.

 

[4wheelgreg]

You do know you have grease fittings on your driveshafts , wheel bearing going out right after a lift is a little weird . I have seen higher milage trucks that guys have put lifts on IFS trucks then they get noises from CV axle just be cause they are operating at a greater angle and being worn the could get noise .
Add .75 lift to the rear is not a great amount of lift to cause that big of a Phase condition , I’m one that does use adjustable links to keep my driveline angles in phase . You get more vibration than noise if it was a phase problem , I have seen a. Few guys that learned the hard way not greasing there joints go bad and they do make noise and vibration .

 

[bloc]

You do know you have grease fittings on your driveshafts , wheel bearing going out right after a lift is a little weird . I have seen higher milage trucks that guys have put lifts on IFS trucks then they get noises from CV axle just be cause they are operating at a greater angle and being worn the could get noise .
Add .75 lift to the rear is not a great amount of lift to cause that big of a Phase condition , I’m one that does use adjustable links to keep my driveline angles in phase . You get more vibration than noise if it was a phase problem , I have seen a. Few guys that learned the hard way not greasing there joints go bad and they do make noise and vibration .

Yes I’ve been greasing them every 5k since I got it. Based on grease ring under the truck the rear was done at least a few times before I got it. Based on how much grease I had to put into the front and the lack of ring I’m inferring the front wasn’t done, which isn’t surprising based on Toyota quick lube level of tech attention to detail.

I wonder if I had a bearing going out but the stock suspension was covering it up. Maybe the kings with their spherical joints are passing that noise through to the chassis much more efficiently?

I don’t have any other signs CVs are showing wear. No clicking.. do you think some throttle application in reverse with the wheel turned would expose something like this?

And I agree that isn’t much lift in the rear to cause phase issues.

 

[bloc]

Got the rear shaft out and drove it for a while on the freeway.. no change.

Rear ABS sensors pulled, both had gear oil, and perhaps worryingly, the gear oil on both was rust colored. Diff oil is not that color at all.

Got the IR gun on both rear hubs, no difference in temp. It had been a while after getting off the freeway, but they were both about 110*F

Double checked, no discernible play in either rear wheel, though I'd have to imagine the parking brake clearance would control some of it..

I'll be tracking down a pair of chassis ears soon.

 

[linuxgod]

Got the rear shaft out and drove it for a while on the freeway.. no change.

Rear ABS sensors pulled, both had gear oil, and perhaps worryingly, the gear oil on both was rust colored. Diff oil is not that color at all.

Got the IR gun on both rear hubs, no difference in temp. It had been a while after getting off the freeway, but they were both about 110*F

Double checked, no discernible play in either rear wheel, though I'd have to imagine the parking brake clearance would control some of it..

I'll be tracking down a pair of chassis ears soon.

Gear oil would make me think it’s an issue with the inner seal on the shaft. I’d need to look closely at the FSM for all the components though.

have you checked your rear gear oil level? Wondering if your noise is low fluid in the rear if you’re leaking oil?

 

[bloc]

Gear oil would make me think it’s an issue with the inner seal on the shaft. I’d need to look closely at the FSM for all the components though.

have you checked your rear gear oil level? Wondering if your noise is low fluid in the rear if you’re leaking oil?

I’ll check gear oil level but am pretty sure it’s fine given I don’t see any leaking anywhere. Just the ends of both ABS sensors, and I’m not sure they are even supposed to be dry.

Plus if the noise was from the rear diff I’d expect it to get way quieter when I remove the rear shaft. And changes of sound on drive/coast.

@TeCKis300 do you remember whether your abs sensors were dry when you pulled them for the gears/bearings? Or maybe @cruiseroutfit in your experience?

 

[TeCKis300]

Hrmm.. I don't recall them being particularly wet or dry. To @linuxgod point, gear oil should be contained in at the inner shaft seal. There is some minor grease, in the space of that ABS sensor and tone ring, but I don't recall oil.

Not sure if this will help but here's what the axle end looked like. The outer o-ring seal wasn't really coated with anything.

 

[bloc]

Hrmm.. I don't recall them being particularly wet or dry. To @linuxgod point, gear oil should be contained in at the inner shaft seal. There is some minor grease, in the space of that ABS sensor and tone ring, but I don't recall oil.

Not sure if this will help but here's what the axle end looked like. The outer o-ring seal wasn't really coated with anything.
View attachment 2561095

Interesting. I’m trying to wrap my head around the odds that both of my rear bearings would start failing at the same time.. improbable to say the least.

I’m starting to consider just putting all new bearings on the thing since people occasionally seem to have problems with both the front and rear

 

[TeCKis300]

From your observations, none of it sounds concerning or symptomatic enough to warrant changing wheel bearings proactively to me at least. I can understand that the new sound you're hearing may be annoying, but like you, I doubt it's either or both wheel bearings. You obviously care for your rig well and it's still pretty low mileage.

I say run her as is. If anything progresses, it'll be more obvious at that point, and I'm sure you'll be on top of it before it becomes anywhere near a safety or critical issue.

 

[bloc]

From your observations, none of it sounds concerning or symptomatic enough to warrant changing wheel bearings proactively to me at least. I can understand that the new sound you're hearing may be annoying, but like you, I doubt it's either or both wheel bearings. You obviously care for your rig well and it's still pretty low mileage.

I say run her as is. If anything progresses, it'll be more obvious at that point, and I'm sure you'll be on top of it before it becomes anywhere near a safety or critical issue.

I’ve been driving it more lately while my DD is down with a big hole in the oil pan, and waiting on a weather window to fix it. Outside of situations like this the bulk of my mileage is on trips, some of which are quite long. A 5k mile trip isn’t uncommon. That is what concerns me about this.. these trips are long enough for a noise to progress into a problem.
Looking into the price of bearings shot down my idea of just doing them proactively..
I’ll soon swap tires with stock stuff off a LX to see if this is somehow worn tire noise transmitting through the suspension.

 

[bloc]

Swapped with stock tires/wheels off a 13 LX today, and the noise was actually worse! Especially over 79 where my tires must cause some harmonic that makes it quieter.. with the road-tires it got noticeably louder up to the 83 or 84 I saw on my test drive..

So that rules out all of this being caused by tires.

Still no increased ability to tell which end or side of the vehicle it was coming from.

@CharlieS I might try to track down those chassis ears soon.

 

[CharlieS]

Just drop me a pm when you want them.

 

[bloc]

Right rear bearing.

HUGE props and thank you to @CharlieS for sending me his Chassis Ears.. this is a seriously powerful tool.

I added clamp mics from the kit to each hub/knuckle, and routed the wires. After learning the hard way (seriously painful) not to have the volume up when you hit the brakes due to brake squeak getting amplfied directly into your ears... as soon as I was on the road it was very obvious the right rear was the issue.

I got this video doing about 75mph, with a pretty bad attempt to hold the phone mic to the headphone speaker.. I'm sure this can be improved upon to get the video/audio, but trust me, by ear it is impressive what this tool can capture.



In it you'll hear my front left is a little more noisy than front right, but nothing I'd worry about. The Right rear though.. wow. I actually believe that since they are both on the same housing the right rear is the source of the noise on the left rear.. plan is to get the bearing installed then check again how noisy things are with a brand new bearing back there.

Currently checking with local shops about pressing the bearing.. press adapter tool price has gone up to $220 which makes it a bit more difficult to justify buying one to have sitting around.

Will post more as I get a look at things. Also tagging @linuxgod as I think this could be very useful for his current issue.

 

[linuxgod]

Thanks @bloc. I replied in the other thread.

Maybe buy the adapter, use it, and then re-sell it on ebay? Or even better if you can find it used on ebay first. I've done that before and sometimes it ultimately ends up being ~free when all is said and done.

 

[unclemat]

Can you gents share the link to the press adapter tool you're talking about?

 

[bloc]

Can you gents share the link to the press adapter tool you're talking about?

 

[bloc]

Note that I haven’t used the above but if it works for a tundra it should work for us based on the similarities.

 

[04UZJ100]

Pretty cool. Is the issue audible on a lift spinning the wheels by hand?

 

[bloc]

Pretty cool. Is the issue audible on a lift spinning the wheels by hand?

Nope. I had it on jack stands, tires off, and truck in drive with the hubs spinning. With a mechanic’s stethoscope on the rear bearing housing it was nearly silent. Apparently there is a huge difference with the weight of the truck on it.

 

[bloc]

Ah, the joys of no rust. Took me about 30 minutes to get the axle shaft out today.. yes, that bearing is bad.

First.. this evidence would have been good to notice early. Note the small notch on the ABS sensor that seems to be from the axle moving around slightly.

Here it is wet with the brown gear oil in the void between the axle seal and bearing seals.

The void as I got the axle out. Note the color. The brown goo is perfectly liquid.. not gritty at all, just gear oil and grease turned brown.

The concerning thing to me is the state of the o-ring. That thing seals the void between the axle seal and bearing seals from outside contamination. My truck has practically zero rust anywhere, but corrosion had worked its way mostly around that o-ring, sticking it to the axle tube. I know my rig had been used for towing by the PO, but I don't know what. With the other side sensor also being brown, I'm wondering whether they towed a boat and launching it got the rear axle wet consistently.

Seal seemed fine.