New clutch throw out bearing bad after 2 weeks? (1 Viewer)

[Cgn1976]

Hi everyone. 2 weeks ago I had a local shop install a new clutch in my 73 FJ55, including new pressure plate, disc, throw out bearing, pilot bearing, rear main seal, and trans front seal. I bought the parts from Cruiser Corps. The fork and slave were in solid shape so I didn't do them. Less than a 100 miles later, what I assume is the throwout bearing is squealing as soon as you put any pressure on the clutch pedal. It squeaks all the way to the floor and increases in intensity with RPM. I've been reading all sorts of threads about throw out bearings, fork adjustement, slave cylanders and various noises to try to diagnose the issue. Some folks have squeak that goes away as the pedal is pushed, but mine is the opposite... any pressure at all and all the way to the floor it squeaks. Can anyone confirm if this is likely a bad throw out bearing? I took it to the shop this morning and had 2 different guys listen to it and they both said bad throw out bearing and to call the people who sold me the parts and see what they will do. The told me they'd help me out on the labor becasue they are decent shop and seem to be good guys.

On the other side of this, I'm waiting to hear back from Cruiser Corp. Related to this, when this shop did my install they noticed the pilot bearing from CC was binding a bit and had a dent in it. They showed me and sourced a local one for $20. I reached out to CC and told them what happened. They wouldn't even cover the $20 bearing from thier kit that was bad. I was honestly shocked. No credit. Nothing. They said thier clutch kits come sealed from another manufactuerer and passed the buck because they are just the middle man. Now, if what I suspect to be happening hear is true, the other bearing in that same kit is bad too, and now somebody...likely me is going to have eat the bill for the labor on the throw out bearing replacement!

Any advice, thoughts on things I might try (lube the bearing, adjust the slave or fork?) or confirmation/denial of my suspiciion would be greatly appreciated. Such a bummer because this thing is running and driving sooooo good after my clutch shudder is gone and I just dropped $1500 on wheels and tires yesterday!!!!!

 

[B y r o n]

At this point since the shop supplied the throw out bearing what are they willing to do to fix the problem they created?

If you've got a shop doing the work my guess is your not comfortable doing the work yourself. Check you local area and see if there is a group or few that may be willing to help you do the job yourself.

 

[Cgn1976]

At this point since the shop supplied the throw out bearing what are they willing to do to fix the problem they created?

If you've got a shop doing the work my guess is your not comfortable doing the work yourself. Check you local area and see if there is a group or few that may be willing to help you do the job yourself.

Thanks for the reply. As it turns out, the shop supplied the pilot bearing and the throw out bearing that got installed, was part of the kit. I spoke with the shop and Mike over at Cruiser Corps today and have been trying to figure out what's really going on. After a deep dive into a thread about this same issue

Is my THROW OUT BEARING THE WRONG WAY ROUND?

today I tried the new clutch and it worked except the throw out is making a noise when in engages against the fingers almost like a squeal but not that loud i----t is the front face of the bearing when the spinning fingers on the pressure plate come up against it I looked at the fingers after...

forum.ih8mud.com

I learned that the part of the bearing that spins should be facing forward toward the 3 arms on the pressure plate, and mine is NOT FACING THAT WAY! I took the flywheel cover off and can feel the spinning part of the bearing facing towards the rear. Called the shop, they said they'd fix it Monday. Has to be it, right? Sure as hell hope so. Just hope a 100 miles of driving/shifting and squeal wasn't enough to kill the TO bearing!

As for not doing the work myself, I'm new to these rigs and learing a ton about wrenching in general in the months since I bought her and while I have had quite a few success stories: Water pump, carb, electrical issues, hinges, voltag regulator, should mount seat belts, etc. I am totally a noob. I could probably make my way through the job, but I just don't have the space to do it. The only flat spot I have isn't wide enough for the truck and and a lift to go in the door to drop the trans/tansfer and don't have accesss to a lift. . I'm tight to my house and a wall, and the street isnt an option.

Anyway fingers crossed this is the deal. Also the guys at Cruiser Corps was helpful today, whci was encouraging, despite the no kickdown on the pilot bearing. He said they would have replaced it if I called the day they found it, but by then it was already long since done. Anyway...

 

[71FFJ40]

100 miles shouldn't kill the throw out bearing even if installed backwards.
As far as your pilot bearing binding and having a dent-that also sounds like the shop that installed it damaged the metal shield on the bearing while attempting to install the bearing-causing the binding.They could have simply popped the damaged shield off the bearing and used it as is.It would have been fine.They also charged you about $15 to $16 too much for a new pilot bearing.It is a 6202zz bearing-about $4-$5 retail

 

[3_puppies]

if I get this correct, the part of the bearing that spins is facing away from the preasure plate. the part that doesn't spin is facing the preasure plate. when you step on the clutch you have a spinning preasure plate pressing against the no rotating bearing causing a squeal. the bearing is most likely not bad just installed wrong. I would have them replace the bearing versus re using the existing.
they screwed up and said they would fix it, let them.

might want to check the wear on the 3 fingers also

 

[Cgn1976]

if I get this correct, the part of the bearing that spins is facing away from the preasure plate. the part that doesn't spin is facing the preasure plate. when you step on the clutch you have a spinning preasure plate pressing against the no rotating bearing causing a squeal. the bearing is most likely not bad just installed wrong. I would have them replace the bearing versus re using the existing.
they screwed up and said they would fix it, let them.

might want to check the wear on the 3 fingers also

Like where your head's at 3pups

 

[Cgn1976]

Took the truck to the shop at 7:30 today. Got a call 45 min later asking me to come down. They said it's installed right. I'm so damn confused. I know I felt the part of the bearing that spins is facing backwards. Looking at the pics from the thread about this, there are clearly different types of these bearings and based on what I can see in those pictures about what are supposedly installed correctly, I just can't make sense of the conficting information and the images. The bearing from the website gives only 1 angle so that's not helpful either however the side they show is facing rear. I'm posting the pics from mine as installed and the the ones from the thread about what is supposed to be right, wrong etc... the first one is mine as installed, 2nd one is a slightly later model with the spinning side facing backwards and which the thread says is wrong, 3rd is a poster saying which is front and back of wjhat looks to be a slightly different bearing, and last is the website screen shot of the same bearing I have from Cruiser Corps showing the side that is facing rear in my truck. The shop is saying they isntalled it based on what was in there before, which is an old bearing that;s appanrtly seized up. Starting to think the old one was installed wrong from the PO and these guys are going off of that!

 

[1969FJ]

I do not know if this will help, but, at 17 minutes you maybe can see something. ?

 

[3_puppies]

Took the truck to the shop at 7:30 today. Got a call 45 min later asking me to come down. They said it's installed right. I'm so damn confused. I know I felt the part of the bearing that spins is facing backwards. Looking at the pics from the thread about this, there are clearly different types of these bearings and based on what I can see in those pictures about what are supposedly installed correctly, I just can't make sense of the conficting information and the images. The bearing from the website gives only 1 angle so that's not helpful either however the side they show is facing rear. I'm posting the pics from mine as installed and the the ones from the thread about what is supposed to be right, wrong etc... the first one is mine as installed, 2nd one is a slightly later model with the spinning side facing backwards and which the thread says is wrong, 3rd is a poster saying which is front and back of wjhat looks to be a slightly different bearing, and last is the website screen shot of the same bearing I have from Cruiser Corps showing the side that is facing rear in my truck. The shop is saying they isntalled it based on what was in there before, which is an old bearing that;s appanrtly seized up. Starting to think the old one was installed wrong from the PO and these guys are going off of that! View attachment 2504425View attachment 2504428

View attachment 2504434

View attachment 2504436

are they not doing anything about this?
either way something is wrong, it should be smooth and silent, with no noises,
it makes no cense that the rear of the bearing spins, what does it rotate against?
the 3 finger bearing is different than the diaphram bearing

 

[Cgn1976]

are they not doing anything about this?
either way something is wrong, it should be smooth and silent, with no noises,
it makes no cense that the rear of the bearing spins, what does it rotate against?
the 3 finger bearing is different than the diaphram bearing

All I know is it felt like the back spun and the front didn't, but maybe some oil on it tricked me that the back was moving, or maybe the bearing is damaged and only the back spins now, or now I'm wondering if it's facing the right way, but the slave is adjusted so it's touching the fingers when the pedal isn't pressed and thus has been spinning the whole time because when I tried to spin the whole bearing, it wouldn't move and I even put some channel locks lightly so I could get a grip. That case would be like I rode the clutch for 100 miles and maybe wore though the internal lube of the bearing in 2 weeks. It didn't spin freely when I tried last Friday, only the back surface spun. The oddness with that one is that it only makes noise when I touch the pedal, but maybe that extra pressure on the bearing is causing the noise but it's still too close to the pressure plate causing it to always spin but with out enough extra pressure to squeal?

I can't wait to head down there with it on the lift in a hour with these guys. It has to be one of these issues. A bearing designed to go 100k plus miles isn't gonna just fail after 2 weeks which is essentially the shops position. Cruiser Corps take is the shop messed up the install and there's no way thier bearing could go bad that fast, which puts me in just a great spot!

 

[Cgn1976]

All I know is it felt like the back spun and the front didn't, but maybe some oil on it tricked me that the back was moving, or maybe the bearing is damaged and only the back spins now, or now I'm wondering if it's facing the right way, but the slave is adjusted so it's touching the fingers when the pedal isn't pressed and thus has been spinning the whole time because when I tried to spin the whole bearing, it wouldn't move and I even put some channel locks lightly so I could get a grip. That case would be like I rode the clutch for 100 miles and maybe wore though the internal lube of the bearing in 2 weeks. It didn't spin freely when I tried last Friday, only the back surface spun. The oddness with that one is that it only makes noise when I touch the pedal, but maybe that extra pressure on the bearing is causing the noise but it's still too close to the pressure plate causing it to always spin but with out enough extra pressure to squeal?

I can't wait to head down there with it on the lift in a hour with these guys. It has to be one of these issues. A bearing designed to go 100k plus miles isn't gonna just fail after 2 weeks which is essentially the shops position. Cruiser Corps take is the shop messed up the install and there's no way thier bearing could go bad that fast, which puts me in just a great spot!

That was it! Fingers touching the bearing face. Wouldn't spin freely by hand, so it was spinning with every revolution of the motor for weeks. Had them back the slave off and it broke about 80% free, but still touching. Will need to adjust the tips on the pressure plate fingers about a turn each. They hemmed and hawed but ultimately owned it and agreed to replace it on their dime! I win. You lose. Suck it! Lol. I need a drink!

 

[Cgn1976]

Took the truck to the shop at 7:30 today. Got a call 45 min later asking me to come down. They said it's installed right. I'm so damn confused. I know I felt the part of the bearing that spins is facing backwards. Looking at the pics from the thread about this, there are clearly different types of these bearings and based on what I can see in those pictures about what are supposedly installed correctly, I just can't make sense of the conficting information and the images. The bearing from the website gives only 1 angle so that's not helpful either however the side they show is facing rear. I'm posting the pics from mine as installed and the the ones from the thread about what is supposed to be right, wrong etc... the first one is mine as installed, 2nd one is a slightly later model with the spinning side facing backwards and which the thread says is wrong, 3rd is a poster saying which is front and back of wjhat looks to be a slightly different bearing, and last is the website screen shot of the same bearing I have from Cruiser Corps showing the side that is facing rear in my truck. The shop is saying they isntalled it based on what was in there before, which is an old bearing that;s appanrtly seized up. Starting to think the old one was installed wrong from the PO and these guys are going off of that! View attachment 2504425View attachment 2504428

View attachment 2504434

View attachment 2504436

Wanted to clarify this for future reference, the flat side faces the pressure plate and that's what spins. Mine was installed the right way and what I thought I felt spinning on the back side was due to oil on it and the whole thing not spinning so it tricked me into thinking the back was. Again, it was the fingers pressing on the bearing not allowing it to spin that caused the issue.

 

[Hugh Heifer]

Sounds like you need to keep that shop's number. They owned it. That is reputable in my book.

 

[Cgn1976]

Sounds like you need to keep that shop's number. They owned it. That is reputable in my book.

I was just down at the shop. They wanted me to supervise the finger adjustment because it's not something they do. We threaded them in evenly, enough to create the space needed to let the bearing spin freely after it all goes back together. They want me to come back down later as they adjust the pivot arm to make sure things spin freely and everyone is good with the outcome. Little of my time, but worth it if ends up right!

 

[B y r o n]

I was just down at the shop. They wanted me to supervise the finger adjustment because it's not something they do. We threaded them in evenly, enough to create the space needed to let the bearing spin freely after it all goes back together. They want me to come back down later as they adjust the pivot arm to make sure things spin freely and everyone is good with the outcome. Little of my time, but worth it if ends up right!

You shouldn't have to adjust the finger height as they are generally set by the manufacture/rebuilder for even pressure plate to clutch pressure engagement. What you need to check is the air gap between the clutch and pressure plate when the clutch is at full travel. Borg & Beck air gap should be between 0.040" - 0.050". If you don't have this then adjusting the pivot may correct the problem. If you don't have enough travel to get this than you may need to change your master or slave to get additional travel.

 

[Cgn1976]

You shouldn't have to adjust the finger height as they are generally set by the manufacture/rebuilder for even pressure plate to clutch pressure engagement. What you need to check is the air gap between the clutch and pressure plate when the clutch is at full travel. Borg & Beck air gap should be between 0.040" - 0.050". If you don't have this then adjusting the pivot may correct the problem. If you don't have enough travel to get this than you may need to change your master or slave to get additional travel.

We moved the pivot all the way back and got it soooo close to freeing up the bearing, but not quite...just needed the tiniest bit of extra clearance, so I figured the easiest thing would be a 1/2 turn on each finger tip. I'll know soon enough! I was reading anther thread on it earlier.

Clutch "Finger" adjustment.

Clutch "Pressure Lever Height"... Clutch finger... I evidently didn't get this right during clutch assembly. So now I need to adjust the clutch finger lever height adjustment bolts. With everything assembled back into the vehicle, it's not easy! I pulled the cover, and got in there...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[Dizzy]

What is the needed distance that the step on the flywheel's clutch bolting surface is relative to the disc friction surface?

 

[Cgn1976]

What is the needed distance that the step on the flywheel's clutch bolting surface is relative to the disc friction surface?

Not sure about that Dizzy. Got the truck back last night though and it's smooth as silk...no squeal! I ran down and checked it before they closed it all back up and while we didn't measure the gap, it's real close but has clearence. The clutch action and feel is great. I am missing the spring on the pivot arm, so I'm gonna throw one on there later today, as there is now a tiny bit of play there due to the gap created between the TOB and the fingers. Should have this anyway!

 

[wngrog]

I put an F throw out bearing on backwards once. It did not make it out of the stall without freezing up. Was a terrible lesson learned.