Builds dougbert's future 350 swap: How much torque is too much? (6 Viewers)

[JohninFla]

Doug

I am really thinking of going with the electric fan on mine. As close as it is, I think even adding a shroud might not be enough for when I put the A/C back in.

And my radiator was replaced after that photo, I know the JB Weld blob is not optimal for cooling! :-D

John

PS Holler if you need any more photos or measurements, too.

 

[norsk]

Doug

I am really thinking of going with the electric fan on mine. As close as it is, I think even adding a shroud might not be enough for when I put the A/C back in.

And my radiator was replaced after that photo, I know the JB Weld blob is not optimal for cooling! :-D

John

PS Holler if you need any more photos or measurements, too.

thanks. One difference is that you are serpentine and I am V belt, and I don't think we can compare too much the two.

BTW how many blades on that fan? Do you have a clutch? The fan I linked to has the 7 bladed fan, which "they" say is an air mover.
And I would need to have a shroud made as well.

Maybe a new pic pointed from above down into the space between your fan and the radiator. A bunch of pics from different angles might help too. Thanks.

For the electric fan option look at the links I have above on the electric fan. The Contour seems to have the best thumbs up here on MUD. It fits the 60 radiator like it was made for it, etc.
I have a MEAN-GREEN alternator, which puts out 200 AMPs, so my alt is good for current loads as well as the fans, the lights and the future winch, and other items. What space I have will determine which way I go.

If you do the Contour, please take pics etc of the project as I will be right behind you if I go that way. I have asked the mechanical fan vendor for measurements on their clutch/fan combo.

dougbert

 

[norsk]

Last night I was examining the 5.9L block, getting it ready for the heads to be installed and I found an unknown (to me) oil galley plug that was open, but needs to be plugged.

It is next to the oil pressure sending unit galley, which between this "new" hole and the distributor. This oil galley is flush with the head deck, not the manifold deck. It intersects with the pressure galley and it definitely needs to be plugged

below is a picture I found from an auto magazine plugging that galley.
I am so glad I am examining each hole and questioning what it is used for. I actually noticed it as I was removing a head (mounted and used to determine pushrod length) and saw this big HOLE under the edge of the head and pondered: WTF?

The text for the pic was:

"Many engine building mistakes are realized after the fact. Here, to prevent an oily mess on the dyno or in the engine bay we installed the 1/8-inch oil gallery plug to the top of the deck. We applied ARP thread sealer before it was installed."


dougbert

 

[norsk]

Request for help here on brackets for: AC, ALT and PS

I will be using V belts, with the PS pump in the drivers lower position. I would love for others to post pics of their V belt system on where and how you mounted your AC and ALT.

Now I have a Mean-Green ALT and have not yet compared its mount points to the GM ALT, I hope it is close to the same.

On the AC, I am leaning to get a GM AC pump and then have my hoses altered on the pump end for GM pumps.

Pictures from others of these two accessories and brackets on their rigs would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

dougbert

 

[Elbert]

Its not common for the plug to be removed....so good catch. Normally that plug is not removed from what I've seen.

Last night I was examining the 5.9L block, getting it ready for the heads to be installed and I found an unknown (to me) oil galley plug that was open, but needs to be plugged.

It is next to the oil pressure sending unit galley, which between this "new" hole and the distributor. This oil galley is flush with the head deck, not the manifold deck. It intersects with the pressure galley and it definitely needs to be plugged

below is a picture I found from an auto magazine plugging that galley.
I am so glad I am examining each hole and questioning what it is used for. I actually noticed it as I was removing a head (mounted and used to determine pushrod length) and saw this big HOLE under the edge of the head and pondered: WTF?

The text for the pic was:

"Many engine building mistakes are realized after the fact. Here, to prevent an oily mess on the dyno or in the engine bay we installed the 1/8-inch oil gallery plug to the top of the deck. We applied ARP thread sealer before it was installed."


dougbert

 

[Elbert]

well I like the single belt drive as found on TBI and Vortec 5.7.

Very doubtful any non-GM components will just line up (mean green alt) and work.

You might look for a shop manual for a late 70's GM car/truck with 350 engine. For example 78 Camaro or same or similar year GM pickup. You can find manuals on ebay a lot..for simple reference.

Do you have all the GM brackets for the accessories?

Request for help here on brackets for: AC, ALT and PS

I will be using V belts, with the PS pump in the drivers lower position. I would love for others to post pics of their V belt system on where and how you mounted your AC and ALT.

Now I have a Mean-Green ALT and have not yet compared its mount points to the GM ALT, I hope it is close to the same.

On the AC, I am leaning to get a GM AC pump and then have my hoses altered on the pump end for GM pumps.

Pictures from others of these two accessories and brackets on their rigs would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

dougbert

 

[JohninFla]

Doug

You can grab the accessory brackets off any 350 or even a 4.3L V6 and they fit the front of the 350, as long as you have the holes in the front of the head, (very early V8's didn't)

If you want the serpentine belt, just do that, and then yank the pulleys for it. Not a terrible job, especially when compared to laying under your cruiser in the freezing cold scraping rust!

I will snap some pictures in the next day or so, when I get home from work in the day light.

John

 

[rcmccars]

the mean green shouldn't be too far off. I had to make a Chevy one wire work on my 2f in a parking lot when my alt left me stranded. Don't remember exactly what I had to do but it worked good until I got a new alt.

 

[Bret]

http://www.coloradospeed.com/csr-digital-temperature-gaugecontroller-100°-f300°-f-p-2591.html

Alternate way to control an electric fan. You can use it with the Bosch 70A relay if desired. It is adjustable and compact.

For brackets you can check Alan Grove Brackets, they have some brackets to solve placement problems in a variety of configurations

http://www.alangrovecomponents.com/

 

[norsk]

well I like the single belt drive as found on TBI and Vortec 5.7.

Very doubtful any non-GM components will just line up (mean green alt) and work.

You might look for a shop manual for a late 70's GM car/truck with 350 engine. For example 78 Camaro or same or similar year GM pickup. You can find manuals on ebay a lot..for simple reference.

Do you have all the GM brackets for the accessories?

I am pondering about the mean green. If it doesn't work, I could sell it and get a high AMP GM alt

good reference to the manuals

and no, I DO NOT have brackets yet. I do have the WP (2 belts) and crank 3 (belts) pulleys

thanks

Doug

You can grab the accessory brackets off any 350 or even a 4.3L V6 and they fit the front of the 350, as long as you have the holes in the front of the head, (very early V8's didn't)

If you want the serpentine belt, just do that, and then yank the pulleys for it. Not a terrible job, especially when compared to laying under your cruiser in the freezing cold s****ing rust!

I will snap some pictures in the next day or so, when I get home from work in the day light.

John

yeah, I know, but I have been leaning to "shiney" - Hey Trollhole went RAINBOW!

I just need some ideas of what people have done. I decided on the V belts from day one, got the WP and Crank pulleys for that, and yes, they are shiney.

and thanks in advance for more pics focused on the fan-radiator distance, just gives me ideas

http://www.coloradospeed.com/csr-digital-temperature-gaugecontroller-100°-f300°-f-p-2591.html

Alternate way to control an electric fan. You can use it with the Bosch 70A relay if desired. It is adjustable and compact.

For brackets you can check Alan Grove Brackets, they have some brackets to solve placement problems in a variety of configurations

http://www.alangrovecomponents.com/

thanks bret, good looking links


dougbert

 

[norsk]

Oh hell yeah!! Let me know if those work well, since I'll order some too!

They work PERFECTLY my friend

I ordered 12. I used 6, 3 on each side on the slider area. Do you know of any other holes hiding out?

I now need some wire grommets that fit the 30mm holes as well.

pic 1 is the new plug installed, good tight fit
pic 2 is a new plug on the left and an old plug on the right,
still same hole size, just bigger flaps

dougbert


Doh!

I can use this blank plugs FOR the wired plugs by drilling a hole for the wire size I need and cutting an opening for inserting the wire.

two plug problems NOW SOLVED

dougbert

 

[Elbert]

might be time to go junkyard surfing to find the brackets you need. Remember it matters which AC compressor and which alternator and which ps pump.... and maybe even the water pump...so you get all the right pulleys plus the brakets etc. I would want to rob everything all the same engine to get all the right parts. There were different a/c compressors depending on what gm product and what year.... Got have the right crank pulley to match the water pump pulley to match all the others and the water pump has the be the right length ....etc.

 

[ntsqd]

Having owned v-belt vintage '79 Suburban (SBC) and a serpentine belt vintage '91 Suburban (SBC) I'm mystified by the desire for v-belts. The serpentine front dress was so much easier to work on. It's true that everything is driven off that one belt, but that also means only one spare to carry and the belt install is an order of magnitude simpler. To each his own, but I think it's a step in the wrong direction.

I concur with Elbert, get everything, all of the front dress, off of one donor. Make note of that donor's vintage and configuration (2/4wd, model i.e. Z-71, Z-28, SS, etc., etc., etc.) in the vehicle's log book.

 

[norsk]

Having owned v-belt vintage '79 Suburban (SBC) and a serpentine belt vintage '91 Suburban (SBC) I'm mystified by the desire for v-belts. The serpentine front dress was so much easier to work on. It's true that everything is driven off that one belt, but that also means only one spare to carry and the belt install is an order of magnitude simpler. To each his own, but I think it's a step in the wrong direction.

I concur with Elbert, get everything, all of the front dress, off of one donor. Make note of that donor's vintage and configuration (2/4wd, model i.e. Z-71, Z-28, SS, etc., etc., etc.) in the vehicle's log book.

well my donor was a V belt and now I have Stewarts WP that turns in the normal direction. With the 1 belt, I would need to get a new one that turns water in the "wrong" direction, and maybe its because I grew up with the V belt and am intimidated by that "flat" belt thingy.

lol

I went to pick-a-part yesterday, and saw a V belt system and a 1 belt. That V belt is much simpler than the TBI truck I looked at. IMHO.


dougbert

 

[uglyoinker]

Doug, you're weird.

 

[norsk]

Doug, you're weird.

yep, yep, yep - that is one of the attributes of a frustrated software genius

 

[Elbert]

do as you wish...but single belt drive is superior in many ways...as noted single belt, the brackets etc are better and I think you could easily find some donor 5.7 engines to rob. V-belt is legacy...you end up dealing with multiple belts and pulley configurations and multiple options in regard to year model, and options.

Go find your donor in the junkyard where you can pull all the parts from the single engine.


I grew up in the v-belts days...my first car was 64 Olds Starfire... Not many pluses in v-belt land.

A single belt drive off a TBI or Vortec 5.7 if inclined to go there, otherwise you are going to need to parrot your vbelt-setup off a particular model GM car or truck so you can get the right belts/pulley/ water pump combination. Remember... it matters what length the water pump is...in relation to the pulley that it has vs the belt alignment on the other accessories.... and you'll need to know all of that down the road when one of the v-belts lets loose and you have to replace it, or something else gets damaged....pick your car/truck setup and stay with that...else you will have problem with belt alignment and pulley choice etc....even potentially a/c compressor choice. If you take a (hit and miss) approach to parts/accessories you will be chasing your proverbial "@$$" on trying to get things to work.

As noted I had a 78 Z28...w/5.7 ...of course if was v belt drive (that was the way it was..).. I had two or three engine setups in that car and had the engine out multiple times.... far easier to work on TBI and 5.7 single belt drives setups... To avoid aggravation / misery on your part...I suggest you pick your flavor of vbelt drive car/truck and stay the course with that setup. As I recall some of the v-belt drive setups also require the OEM type exhaust manifolds and some have some very aggravating mounts in regard to the power steering.

 

[ntsqd]

That '79's PS pump belt tensioning was a Royal PITA. It was right there where you could see it from the top, but you couldn't easily reach it and when you did you had no leverage to do anything about it. I think that I finally started tensioning it blind working overhead from underneath the danged thing.

 

[Elbert]

I have or had a big monster set of channel lock pliers....one of the best tools to work on those beauties...

I also recall (my mind is a dangerous place...)...some spacers on some of that stuff. between the mount/bracket and the pump or other accessories...can be a pita to setup from zero. And you need all the correct length and type of bolts.

 

[Elbert]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N38Effl0DUg

Just came across this...typical v-belt setup from the 70's...80's GM V8