Think about it.
Does it matter to you if UC is a part of TLCA? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Trollhole
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My yes is qualified. I will always belong to the TLCA. They need the membership, sponsor good efforts to keep trails open, and are an international organization. Being a part of something bigger is good mojo for many events, teaming with other clubs to hold and bolster events, and generally keep us in the loop of the cruiser community.
GA Cruisers looked at this as well and the decision was to belong to and support as many cruiser clubs as possible. Without them, we wouldn't have much beyond a group of friends...
GA Cruisers looked at this as well and the decision was to belong to and support as many cruiser clubs as possible. Without them, we wouldn't have much beyond a group of friends...
Mtbcoach
Moderator
I have to agree with Dan in that I think its important to continue and support (via membership at the least) organizations who continue to work/lobby for trail access and "rights" to continue this sport/activity/hobby.
I know its a major hassle to go through all the hoops it take to maintain "club" status but it is worth it in my eyes (I guess since I'm not doing the work)...
I know its a major hassle to go through all the hoops it take to maintain "club" status but it is worth it in my eyes (I guess since I'm not doing the work)...
ClemsonCruiser
Supporting Vendor
If this is our major reason to stay with TLCA why don't we just donate our money to the Blue Ribbon Coalition as I believe they do far more for work/lobbying for land acess rights for us as offroaders
I honestly admitt I don't know the full scope of what TLCA does for us........ but from what I have seen so far I personally feel it is not neccessary that we continue to be a part of it.
Mine is not a "yes" or "no" answer. Both fellers above make a good argument for being in support of TLCA. I'm not so certain I'm in agreement anymore.
From my perspective, TLCA represents only The Trails magazine; slow to no response from staffers, and in-house bickering. Perhaps I need to read the fine print a little better? Perhaps our combined club resources could go into something a little closer to home, like STLCA?
It often appears that TLCA supports as well as some formal local governments: support in direct correlation to proximity; simply stated: we're not a western chapter and viewed as an "outpost".
With that said, STLCA satisfies more of the "what's in it for me" as a member of this club.
From my perspective, TLCA represents only The Trails magazine; slow to no response from staffers, and in-house bickering. Perhaps I need to read the fine print a little better? Perhaps our combined club resources could go into something a little closer to home, like STLCA?
It often appears that TLCA supports as well as some formal local governments: support in direct correlation to proximity; simply stated: we're not a western chapter and viewed as an "outpost".
With that said, STLCA satisfies more of the "what's in it for me" as a member of this club.
Southeast Overland
Get lost! Go explore!
Can someone list out what TLCA does for us (Toyota Trails, advocacy, etc) and what we in return have to do to be a member of TLCA (dues, activities, etc)? This might help to clear some things up and allow the UC membership base to make some informed decisions.
As far as I know, to be a chapter of the TLCA we all have to be members. Since we are already a chapter, the rest has been done. So, practically speaking, the only thing we need to do is maintain a delegate annually and keep our membership in TLCA...that's it!
TLCA will supply insurance for our TLCA sanctioned events as well, very valuable when you try to get liability insurance for a larger event.
TLCA will supply insurance for our TLCA sanctioned events as well, very valuable when you try to get liability insurance for a larger event.
- Thread starter
- #8
My opinion.
I will always be a member of TLCA. I like TT. We get out what we put in. Which until recently has been little to none. As a club we have yet to really utilize what TLCA has to offer. I don't think we ever will. I feel there is a big disconnect between UC and TLCA. I don't feel as if UC is a part of it. My reasoning behind this question is to see if there really is an interest in the club in making an effort for us to be more involved.
Other issues are that not every member of UC is a member of TLCA. Never have that I know of and as long as I'm around never will. Until we become a more important part in TLCA and TLCA becomes an important part of UC I will never make that a requirement even if it risks our status with them. We currently have somewhere around 120 members now. If UC required TLCA status we would probably cut that number in half. UC in my mind is not about exclusion. We focus on what you as members want out of a club. Rules and regulations are few and in order to join UC all you have to do is pay dues. Thats it. It is not hard to file our Club Status with TLCA that takes all of 5 min.
Other things to note: This annual meeting we will be making donations to the Blue Ribbon Coalition as well as SFWDA.
I will always be a member of TLCA. I like TT. We get out what we put in. Which until recently has been little to none. As a club we have yet to really utilize what TLCA has to offer. I don't think we ever will. I feel there is a big disconnect between UC and TLCA. I don't feel as if UC is a part of it. My reasoning behind this question is to see if there really is an interest in the club in making an effort for us to be more involved.
Other issues are that not every member of UC is a member of TLCA. Never have that I know of and as long as I'm around never will. Until we become a more important part in TLCA and TLCA becomes an important part of UC I will never make that a requirement even if it risks our status with them. We currently have somewhere around 120 members now. If UC required TLCA status we would probably cut that number in half. UC in my mind is not about exclusion. We focus on what you as members want out of a club. Rules and regulations are few and in order to join UC all you have to do is pay dues. Thats it. It is not hard to file our Club Status with TLCA that takes all of 5 min.
Other things to note: This annual meeting we will be making donations to the Blue Ribbon Coalition as well as SFWDA.
I've been an UC member for several years now and have not seen any return on investment with UC as a TLCA member...maybe insurance...but never have I signed a TLCA document or seen one that says I am covered by there insurance....and this may be a general blanket coverage for the team. So if I'm a UC team member then I'm automatically covered. And like JP said, haven't seen a whole lot on the trail rights thing with TLCA. So I say we go with Blue Ribbon. I'm not too concerened about being a member of an international organization cause we are over the 100 member mark and we are becoming a very influential group ourselves. And we can hold events and just not label them as TLCA events. If we wanna put money towards something that is going to impact us then lets give it to someone closer to home, to a group where we are making a difference and to a group that when we pay a membership fee we are called to help the organization make decisions....not just of thanks for the money we'll send ya a reminder next year when dues will be due again. Let's make our money work for us and help UC become larger and more infuential.
Just my .02 but somethin to think about
Chuck
Just my .02 but somethin to think about
Chuck
I will always be a member of TLCA. That being said, I don't really see them helping any of us in the South with much. They say they have the land use stuff going on, but now that Tellico is truely under fire, I don't see them as a National Organization, jumping in. Roger Theurer is their East representative, and of course he's involved...but more because of SFWDA than TLCA. BlueRibbon and United Four Wheel Drive have jumped in to the Tellico thing and are giving us their lawyers to help us. I haven't seen anything from TLCA...but then again, I don't know that we've asked them.
What I have used TLCA for is insurance for Beasley Bash. It's cheap, but attendees do have to be TLCA for it to be valid for them. Kinda cheesy if you ask me. There are other organizations out there that can give us the same insurance...the FJ Cruiser Summit people used another organization that I can't recall off hand. SFWDA can also do the same. BUT, like TLCA, if you want to be part of SFDWA, every member has to be current with them too. UFWDA is the same way...but you get them when you join SFWDA automatically.
A lot of TLCA chapters have very low fees for the chapter, but include the TLCA membership in their dues and sign everyone up. But then our dues go from $15-20 a year to $55 or $60 or however much it is for TLCA (or SWFDA) every year. It's really expensive to do both, that's for sure. I maintain TLCA, SFWDA, UC and Georgia Cruisers.
I think we need to put our money where it makes the most difference. Right now in our area, I think that SFWDA. That being said, if we go that route, we need to make sure we have a delegate that can be active, attend meetings, get word back to us, etc. We also need to be ready and able to pitch in when needed.
My 2 cents.
What I have used TLCA for is insurance for Beasley Bash. It's cheap, but attendees do have to be TLCA for it to be valid for them. Kinda cheesy if you ask me. There are other organizations out there that can give us the same insurance...the FJ Cruiser Summit people used another organization that I can't recall off hand. SFWDA can also do the same. BUT, like TLCA, if you want to be part of SFDWA, every member has to be current with them too. UFWDA is the same way...but you get them when you join SFWDA automatically.
A lot of TLCA chapters have very low fees for the chapter, but include the TLCA membership in their dues and sign everyone up. But then our dues go from $15-20 a year to $55 or $60 or however much it is for TLCA (or SWFDA) every year. It's really expensive to do both, that's for sure. I maintain TLCA, SFWDA, UC and Georgia Cruisers.
I think we need to put our money where it makes the most difference. Right now in our area, I think that SFWDA. That being said, if we go that route, we need to make sure we have a delegate that can be active, attend meetings, get word back to us, etc. We also need to be ready and able to pitch in when needed.
My 2 cents.
I vote no TLCA has more issues than they know what to do with and cant fix any of them. They also dont really do anything for UC. They havent been involved with any events that I can recall. I havent seen or gotten anything from them. you still have to join individually to get anything like the magazine which you are welcome to do I dont think the club has to be a part of it for that. We could donate our money to someone else who does just as much if not more good like Blue Ribbon Coalition and be in the same position we are now. The couple times we have been in TT isnt worth the hassle that Marshall and others have put up with to try and keep UC involved.
Does it matter if UC is part of TLCA?
Short answer: yes, but in negative way.
IH8MUD renders TLCA insignificant, intrusive, and obstructionist.
MUD has done what TLCA should have, but wouldn't.
So, why bother? TLCA is last month's milk!
Short answer: yes, but in negative way.
IH8MUD renders TLCA insignificant, intrusive, and obstructionist.
MUD has done what TLCA should have, but wouldn't.
So, why bother? TLCA is last month's milk!
Well, here's an interesting link. Go to the top of this page and click on Land Use in the TLCA banner...
http://www.tlca.org/landuse.html
If given a choice for UC dues, I say put the money closer to home. Tellico is an important fixture in the SE region and we need to rally up for that.
I plan to keep up with my TLCA dues for the reason that they are the biggest (membership-wise), if not the most active voice for LC owners. I still dig the mag too.
I have to plea ignorance when it comes to the diff between STLCA, SFWDA & Blue Ribbon. If anyone in this forum can enlighten a fairly new participant to this sport, I'd appreciate it.
MOAB Rocks! Woot! Woot!
http://www.tlca.org/landuse.html
If given a choice for UC dues, I say put the money closer to home. Tellico is an important fixture in the SE region and we need to rally up for that.
I plan to keep up with my TLCA dues for the reason that they are the biggest (membership-wise), if not the most active voice for LC owners. I still dig the mag too.
I have to plea ignorance when it comes to the diff between STLCA, SFWDA & Blue Ribbon. If anyone in this forum can enlighten a fairly new participant to this sport, I'd appreciate it.
MOAB Rocks! Woot! Woot!
STLCA is just a TLCA chapter like any other. They are just more high-profile because of their link to Tellico.
SFWDA is a club of members and other clubs that represent all 4WD enthusiasts in the Southeast. Again, high profile because they do a lot with Tellico (and are the driving force behind what STLCA does - they are member club). But they also do a lot with other areas we use for our sport. They do have people that monitor legislation, lobby, etc. That being said, I do think they need an influx of "new blood" to get them moving. Most of these folks are jeepers, but Landy's and LC's do have some representation. These folks are the most active in our area.
BlueRibbon Coalition is dedicated to land use issues. The President is the one that writes all the land use stuff for TT and TLCA's website. These folks are jumping in with United Four Wheel Drive to help with Tellico by providing legal guidance and strategy support.
Honestly, if we want to keep our money local, I'd say SFWDA because that trickles up to UFWDA. But....you get into the same situation with they as you do TLCA...if we want to be a member club, everyone has to join.
SFWDA is a club of members and other clubs that represent all 4WD enthusiasts in the Southeast. Again, high profile because they do a lot with Tellico (and are the driving force behind what STLCA does - they are member club). But they also do a lot with other areas we use for our sport. They do have people that monitor legislation, lobby, etc. That being said, I do think they need an influx of "new blood" to get them moving. Most of these folks are jeepers, but Landy's and LC's do have some representation. These folks are the most active in our area.
BlueRibbon Coalition is dedicated to land use issues. The President is the one that writes all the land use stuff for TT and TLCA's website. These folks are jumping in with United Four Wheel Drive to help with Tellico by providing legal guidance and strategy support.
Honestly, if we want to keep our money local, I'd say SFWDA because that trickles up to UFWDA. But....you get into the same situation with they as you do TLCA...if we want to be a member club, everyone has to join.
At the end of the day, if action is what you want, keep your money and your decision making close to home.
The key question is in Marshall's second post; "More involved" with TLCA.
My answer is unequivocally no.
We have great talent, leadership, participation, youth and enthusiasm in our club. Why should that be wasted 'getting daddy (TLCA) to say okay' to action we know should be taken. This club is rolling, TLCA should be coming to us, not the reverse.
If members of UC want to be TLCA members that is fine, but UC shouldn't waste time and energy just to make "Daddy" happy.
The key question is in Marshall's second post; "More involved" with TLCA.
My answer is unequivocally no.
We have great talent, leadership, participation, youth and enthusiasm in our club. Why should that be wasted 'getting daddy (TLCA) to say okay' to action we know should be taken. This club is rolling, TLCA should be coming to us, not the reverse.
If members of UC want to be TLCA members that is fine, but UC shouldn't waste time and energy just to make "Daddy" happy.
Ken sums it up pretty well for me in the above post.
UC has become a large, active club due to the fine leadership and members involved.
I am a TLCA member personally but don't see the need to waste time, energy, cash and other resources jockeying for their approval and support for the club's benefit.
Seems like we should be popping up on their radar, not the other way around.
UC has become a large, active club due to the fine leadership and members involved.
I am a TLCA member personally but don't see the need to waste time, energy, cash and other resources jockeying for their approval and support for the club's benefit.
Seems like we should be popping up on their radar, not the other way around.
Not based on the information contained herein to date.
What is the cost? What are the benefits. As a former FLCA board member, I recollect insurance being the biggest advantage, but has anyone priced event insurance separate from TLCA - and if so, does it outweigh the other benefits.
Membership: Hypothetically speaking, you must maintain the requisite percentage of TLCA memberships annually - you must track this - and the TCLA membership chair is supposed to check - least they did when I was a board member. If there is lax enforcement now - I'll guess that is either due to management issues or a desire to maintain chapter status as an image issue - not slamming here, just surmising - correct me if I'm wrong. We used to encourage membership to try and keep up with requirements.
Toyota Trails: The magazine has not had much to offer me of late, other than Mark Whatley's writings (and especially his occasional rants which I love) I just skim the pics and what not. I've even subscribed to that new Toyota Owners mag as a replacement for my Cruiser cravings. The magazine is doing a good job of covering the new FJ (helps encourage new members), is still an excellent forum for club members to write their own articles (as noted with recent UC contributions), and is still an incredible value. Only real reason I've maintained membership for last few years - prolly won't re-up unless I see Al McBride's article on our visit to Tellico in May - assuming that politics has come into play on the editorial board.
I'm an out of state member - best of luck in making a decision - I think if it's cheap - the benefits far outweight the negatives.
What is the cost? What are the benefits. As a former FLCA board member, I recollect insurance being the biggest advantage, but has anyone priced event insurance separate from TLCA - and if so, does it outweigh the other benefits.
Membership: Hypothetically speaking, you must maintain the requisite percentage of TLCA memberships annually - you must track this - and the TCLA membership chair is supposed to check - least they did when I was a board member. If there is lax enforcement now - I'll guess that is either due to management issues or a desire to maintain chapter status as an image issue - not slamming here, just surmising - correct me if I'm wrong. We used to encourage membership to try and keep up with requirements.
Toyota Trails: The magazine has not had much to offer me of late, other than Mark Whatley's writings (and especially his occasional rants which I love) I just skim the pics and what not. I've even subscribed to that new Toyota Owners mag as a replacement for my Cruiser cravings. The magazine is doing a good job of covering the new FJ (helps encourage new members), is still an excellent forum for club members to write their own articles (as noted with recent UC contributions), and is still an incredible value. Only real reason I've maintained membership for last few years - prolly won't re-up unless I see Al McBride's article on our visit to Tellico in May - assuming that politics has come into play on the editorial board.
I'm an out of state member - best of luck in making a decision - I think if it's cheap - the benefits far outweight the negatives.
- Thread starter
- #18
Bill good response. Yes I will agree that the most important part of of being a member of TLCA is the insurance side. In the past this has never been an issue with UC. Basically because we are all grown adults who just like to get together to have fun. If we started charging for our get togethers then I could understand needing it. But we don't. We are in the process of securing UC and it's members from this potential issue legally. And with two lawyers in our ranks I don't think this will be an issue.
As far as the image of the club being a part of TLCA I could see this as being more important while we were growing in the past than in the future. I really don't think people join UC because we are a TLCA club. If so then they are really missing what we are truly about. We want to have fun, be around friends, and be free of restraints. UC is what you want it to be. That and the fact we have so many events a year are the main reason we are as big as we are today.
My reason for asking the original question was to see where we stand on getting the club more involved in TLCA. I don't ever see it as a bad thing to be a part of something like TLCA. But if members feel we should pursue our time elsewhere then that is the direction we will go. It's your club. I just collect your opinions and run on it.
One other thing to consider...if you participate in orgainzed TLCA events (GSMTR for example) you need to be a current member of TLCA. Again, this is on an individual basis, and frankly, I don't think it's well enforced. Just a thought to add to the discussion.
I believe in what TLCA does for the cruiser community and I enjoy TT so I would agree that it is important to support TLCA on an individual level, but that is not the point of this discussion. As a club, I don't know enough about how TLCA operates or what they require to provide any input as to whether or not it is a benfit to UC. can anyone list the pros/cons or costs/benefits?
