Brake lines

[bsevans]

I've been designing hydraulic systems for tactical missile testing for over 20 years. Swagelok fittings are extremely reliable at pressures well beyond what an automotive brake system will ever see. Having said that, the bottom line is that, Swagelok fittings are not legal to use on a vehicle driven on any public road. They are not approved by the Federal DOT for use on automotive brake systems. Will they work, if used with the proper lines, such as seamless stainless steel tubing - yes. As far as the requirements in each state, I believe that all states have to conform to the Federal DOT requirements. As stated by others, you assume the liability for non conforming brake line components if involved in an accident regardless of their contributing factor in the incident.

 

[bsmith123]

non standard installs

Yes,

You got a point on the FED DOT,--- I've spent so much time overseas I don't know how stuff works here anymore

I'm a tactical aircraft guy (I wont say how long cause it's too long). I agree that many parts could be or would be superior or as good as OEM or will be perfectly safe crossing applications---but I think the point needs to be made that you have to know what you are doing.

Nothing to do with swagelocks in particular just the gen principle

Aren't you glad your car isn't wired with KAPTON?!!

 

[bryancostanich]

just fyi, if anyone cares, i talked to a tech over at swagelock who contacted their factory and research dept. about the bundy line, and they said that their stuff swages onto it very well.

personally, i went with stainless steel seamless tubing, but it's good info. i had a really hard time finding 10mm fittings, everyone seemed to carry 8mm and 12mm. i talked to mark over at mark's off road, and he said he even had a harder time as of late sourcing 10mm. i did eventually find some, but i had already done most of my stuff with the stainless.

i got the stainless tubing at grainger.com, if anyone is interested.

-b

 

[bryancostanich]

the other nice thing about going with the stainless (besides it's resistance to corrosion) is that it doesn't stretch as much as the bundy tube, so in theory, it should give a sharper feel to your braking.

 

[Trollhole]

In my sig.

Great cruiser parts. Look for tubing brakes.

 

[Downey]

My 2 cents is probably not worth a whole lot, but here it is:
(1) Bought myself a high powered double flaring tool, and proceeded to screw-up multiple double flares; junky tubing, improper centering, who knows.
(2) Discovered Swagelocks. Determined that automotive braking systems work on 500-1,000 psi and Swagelocks are rated at 10,000 psi. Determined I would sell Swagelocks based upon their simplicity, and the fact that I would find them defendable in a court of law based upon their overkill nature.

 

[bryancostanich]

The one thing though about swagelocks, is that they're a thread seal, rather than a flare seal, so you have to put loctite (or other) and REALLY tighten them up hard, otherwise they'll leak from the threads, whereas if you're using the double flared line, that flare makes a good seal and compresses down easily.

 

[bsmith123]

Yes, but legal? Lets argue a little

. Having said that, the bottom line is that, Swagelok fittings are not legal to use on a vehicle driven on any public road. They are not approved by the Federal DOT for use on automotive brake systems.

Nor are your novelty fittings in a properly plumbed and configured brake system....

In all of the debate Bsevans and Poser's points are the relevant ones for me

Think about the difference between an engineer and technician. The engineer designs the parts for a specific application and uses the acceptable practices and safeguards of that field to back him up. Such as developmental and operational testing and risk managment analysis.

The professional technician relies on installing correct parts for their intended use IAW OEM instructions as well as industry accepted practices. Your legal safeguard as a hobbyist is also working to that kind of standard and limiting your work to the skills you have.

I dont think the law cares what works-- it cares what's legal or at least you are leaving yourself in unchartered territory

If an Engineer wants to work on an airplane he has to get a mechanics license because there are some similarities but seperate sets of practical skills and knowledge--He may have designed the part but legally he cannot install it!

The Auto Pro Mechanics/Welders etc will warn hobbyist not to attempt everything that they do and to be aware of your limits because they "get it." They understand the difference between themselves and the hobbyist. They often can't possibly explain all the reasons why in a single post so instead they just say it's wrong or right.

It's no big deal if you blow your motor, screw up your bodywork, but your steering? brakes? In a worse case scenario, do you want a foolproof position, or do you want to argue that you know better than the expert witnesses?


The name of the game is CYA even if you are a gold wielding, 5 kind of mechanic

Having said all that I am no Lawyer of course and I could be totally out there--just spouting off!