80 or 100 brake pads? (1 Viewer)

[Yotazealot]

I had the work done at an extremely well respected shop that specializes in Toyota LC repair . The parts were OEM and supplied by the shop. Never mind the shop's identity. I know better; They know better; You know better than to do this sort of monkey business on your truck.

I realize that many (some are even big dogs on this forum) have performed this experiment with favorable results. If this be you,fall on your knees and give thanks to Toyota(who doth reside in Olympus) for overlooking your transgression. Ya got lucky. He b*tch slapped me for my impertinence.

 

[Nay]

You should never install parts that fit on your truck.

 

[-Spike-]

I installed 100 series pads once, saw zero improvement or difference, went back to 80 pads and shims.

If you want improved braking, there are pads available with different compositions, such as EBC Green or Yellow.

 

[Outsane]

You should never install parts that fit on your truck.

huh?

 

[sunrk]

100 pads on the 80 rotor (front only). No modification needed.

That's only true for later 8/92 upgrade bigger front brakes. If the front brakes haven't been upgraded on a pre-8/92 80 then 105 series pads cannot be fitted. Also the 105 series pads require not using any shims otherwise they will not fit.

The issue of slotted vs non-slotted rotors depends how hard you are on the brakes. Slotted rotors help dissipate the gas layer between pad and rotor, but in almost all cases there is no reason to use anything other than regular 80 series front pads.

As for shims, I see no reason to use them when running normal 80 series front pads. Why use multiple layers of 'stuff' between the back of each pad and the outer face of each piston pair?

 

[Tools R Us]

...
As for shims, I see no reason to use them when running normal 80 series front pads. Why use multiple layers of 'stuff' between the back of each pad and the outer face of each piston pair?

They are pretty effective at reducing/eliminating the squealing that can be caused by the pad moving/vibrating against the pistons. So it depends how you feel about noisy brakes?

 

[Nay]

huh?

Was responding to the “monkey business” comment above.

100 series pads fit. Install them if you want to. They are thicker. They will stop your truck.

You will be removing the shims. I run them and it would be impossible to tell. Because they fit.

I am sure they are going to last longer. Because they are thicker.

I’m sure my rears will not last longer. Because they are not thicker.

I will probably run my rears down to metal again. Because I am prone to doing that.

I will probably look at the fronts when that happens. They will probably still have plenty of material. This will be good.

 

[COYS]

I like to keep it stupid simple where possible.

I had my brakes recently refreshed with all new OEM 80 series rotors and pads.

How long do the factory brakes generally last?

 

[Proven]

Depends.

Brakes are a very YMMV wear item. This is influenced by speed, weight and how hard you brake. Also by condition of the rotors and calipers.

 

[Sc0-]

Rears wear faster than my fronts, 80 or 100 series fronts. Adjusted LSPV and that made a little difference.

Will be rebuilding the calipers and installing stainless pistons in the next few days, rebuilt them 3yrs ago and the chrome plating was flaking off and rust was starting. Recently I noticed the piston seals looked wet, indicating fluid seepage.

A thread on here mentioned using GX rotors and calipers on the front of an FZJ80, will upgrade to that when the adapters are available.

 

[sunrk]

Remember too that most aftermarket brake pads are now made with a 'squealer' designed to make you replace the pads sooner that later. I'm waiting on new genuine calipers and rotors to arrive for the upgraded front brakes on my 80 and I'm probably going back to std 80 series pads but really don't know if I want to bother with shims. I might stick with the 105 series pads I've got and wear them down. Still currently running RDA extreme 80 series rear and 105 series front pads. I've never upgraded the rear disk brakes - they do so little anyway.

At least my 80 has rear disk brakes ex-factory - but the park brake is always pathetic and it's impossible to keep it working correctly so I'd rather have it looser and I just park in gear and try to avoid hills.

 

[ceylonfj40nut]

One non OEM part I buy shamelessly. Autozone 80 pads lifetime warranty. Cheap and good. Take used ones back for a new free set.

 

[Yotazealot]

Allow me to define what I mean here by "monkey business": Violating my own longstanding practice of using OEM mechanical parts on any Toyota that I own. In this case it was an OEM part put on a truck not designed for it. The reason I did it was because a number of Mud pundits said it was a good idea. I chose to ignore my 40 years of experience owning and driving Toyota products because I wanted to make my truck "Better than OEM". It is easy to forget that "Better than OEM" is invariably an experiment. Experiments can and do fail. In retrospect, it would seem that since I could not afford to have the experiment fail, I would have been better off not attempting it in the first place. Further, had I considered the matter carefully to begin with, it would have been apparent that the potential gain from this experiment was too meager to be worth the risk of failure. None of this is meant to disparage the afore-mentioned Mud pundits as most of what they have to impart is pure gold. I am sure this experiment worked for them. I do assert, however, that their experiments succeeded not due to skill or experience, but to dumb luck.
Near as I can tell the mod failed because the tolerances of the various parts stacked in the wrong direction on my truck. Maybe the calipers were a little tight and the pads a little fat. Mechanically speaking, I have no idea what caused the failure. What I do know is that had I the sense to adhere to my own established policy of "OEM only", I would at this moment be a much happier camper.
As to the shop that did the work participating in the monkey business, I must say in their defense that customers bring them all kinds of parts to install and ideas to execute. Not all of those parts are worth installing, nor the ideas worth executing. None of that is covered by any warranty and turning away work from a steady customer is a poor idea. The proprietor didn't know if this mod would work and told me he would check with a buddy who is also a top notch LC mechanic. The buddy said the pads would fit and all would be well. The pads sort of fit, but not all was well. I would have rather these guys had a strict policy of saying "no" to non-OEM, but what would they then say to installing proven aftermarket parts like say OME suspension and Marlin Crawler gears?
As to you, the general reader participating in monkey business, I would point out that the prevailing opinion on the forum seems to be that OEM is better. That quality gear is worth the extra expense. That modifications are to be undertaken with extreme care and attention to detail. That just because something sounds like a good thing doesn't mean that it is. We all make mistakes, and are usually the cause of our own misfortunes. That is the essence of monkey business.
I submit to all that this "100 series pads in the 80" idea needs to be viewed with far more skepticism than it is. That these pads can be stuffed in the calipers without the shims and still stop the truck does not, in retrospect, seem a valid argument for risking damage to the rotors. Assuming the experiment works for you,how much extra pad life do you really expect to get out of this mod? How much money will you really save? Do you really want to risk having to listen to your truck squeal in protest at every stop sign?
I SAY, AND I SPEAK FROM BITTER EXPERIENCE, TAKE THIS BONE TO ANOTHER DOG!
IN PROBABLY MISSPELLED SPANISH, A OTRA PERRO CON ESE HUESO!

 

[sunrk]

All good points. I am still unable to figure out why a huge 'shim pack' is required with regular 80 series pads.

 

[cruiserhound]

Most people running 100 pads on their 80's in this thread probably have 16" wheels. Does anyone know if the 100 pads fit the 15" wheels used on the vulnerable '91 and '92? I could definitely use more stopping power.

 

[Tools R Us]

Most people running 100 pads on their 80's in this thread probably have 16" wheels. Does anyone know if the 100 pads fit the 15" wheels used on the vulnerable '91 and '92? I could definitely use more stopping power.

The rotors and calipers on the 3FE rigs are smaller, so the 100 pads will not fit. Changing from '80 to '100 pads does not improve brake power, only life. Putting later 1FZ rotors (~1" larger) and calipers is a brake power increasing upgrade for the 3FE rigs, and is a bolt on deal.

 

[Tools R Us]

...
Near as I can tell the mod failed because the tolerances of the various parts stacked in the wrong direction on my truck. ...

Squealing can be from not and/or improper greasing the pad edges/pins and shims not being there, but often pad compound. On a rig like the '80 it's just about impossible to warp rotors, In all cases we have seen, brake judder is from uneven pad buildup on the rotors. In our experience the OEM pads are not well matched to how most use them, are susceptible to both problems. Pads are one of the parts that our first choice is aftermarket.

 

[sunrk]

Before I switched to RDA Extreme 105 series pads last year (the left side siezed up twice during the bed-in drive!) I had been running Bendix 4wd 105 series pads and they were fine but because I was doing a fair bit of heavy trailer towing I opted to try the RDA's. To be honest I have not found the RDA extremes actually do much (except look pretty because they are painted gold).

My 80 being 3/92 build came ex-factory with smaller front brakes (but also rear disk not rear drum brakes). I've had slotted rotors (RDA's) since I did the brake upgrade but the pedal shudder wasn't occuring (I didn't notice it) with the previous pads, so I'm going to replace the calipers and go back to 80 series pads (probably Bendix's) and assess what difference that makes as I'm unable to determine if a rotor is warped or has too much runout.

I dumped the shims very early on in owning the 80 and never got more. To have a sandwich of thin bits of metal between piston and pad just seems dumb, but I'm sure there are vehicle engineers out there who would swear by shims to solve all brake noise issues.

I've never used EBC pads on the 80 or with any of my Saab cars so really cannot comment on what those products are like.

 

[nukegoat]

I really dont understand why people act like replacing brake pads is so inconvenient. Id rather do it than an oil change

 

[Tools R Us]

I really dont understand why people act like replacing brake pads is so inconvenient. Id rather do it than an oil change

Yep, a way simple, quick job.