- Thread starter
- #61
Yeah the 235/85/16 is what comes on the 14k I looked at. It's also an 8 lug axle vs the 6. It has bigger brakes and all that jazz too.
7k or 10k trailer? (9 Viewers)
- Thread starter Sam Stewart
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Yeah the 235/85/16 is what comes on the 14k I looked at. It's also an 8 lug axle vs the 6. It has bigger brakes and all that jazz too.
after loosing several 15" trailer tires I called H&H and asked what the difference was between the 10k and 12k tilt trailers like mine, the tech guy was real cool its the same trailer the only difference is the springs brakes and tires.. axles were the same just different bolt pattern 8lug..
if you are having one built the cost differnce isn't much and if you want they can put the 10k springs on the 12k trailer.. it only adds about 200lbs in axles brakes and tires and will save you $$ down the road, for what I have in load range e 15" tires over the last 8 years I could have bought 4 nice 235/85/16 michilens and been done with it. as it is now I stop every 2 hours or so and check tires if I am loaded heavy..
here is the one I have great trailer they offer drive over fenders and alot of other options.. nice people to deal with and when I bought mine the price was real fair..
http://www.hhtrailer.com/Trailers/exSpeed/index.html
if you are having one built the cost differnce isn't much and if you want they can put the 10k springs on the 12k trailer.. it only adds about 200lbs in axles brakes and tires and will save you $$ down the road, for what I have in load range e 15" tires over the last 8 years I could have bought 4 nice 235/85/16 michilens and been done with it. as it is now I stop every 2 hours or so and check tires if I am loaded heavy..
here is the one I have great trailer they offer drive over fenders and alot of other options.. nice people to deal with and when I bought mine the price was real fair..
http://www.hhtrailer.com/Trailers/exSpeed/index.html
- Thread starter
- #63
So I emailed the guy again. I'm sure he's probably sick of answering all my questions by now. Ha!
Anyway, the breakdown of weight by trailer (in his words):
7k steel is ~2100#
10k steel is ~2400#
14k equip is ~3000#
Sound about right?
Edit: A little more detail, the steel are both flat steel deck, the equip is wood. Also, the 7k and 10k are 18' x 7' and the 14k is 20' x 7'.
Anyway, the breakdown of weight by trailer (in his words):
7k steel is ~2100#
10k steel is ~2400#
14k equip is ~3000#
Sound about right?
Edit: A little more detail, the steel are both flat steel deck, the equip is wood. Also, the 7k and 10k are 18' x 7' and the 14k is 20' x 7'.
I understand the pros and cons of the metal deck vs. wood. But how many times are you laying down on the trailer surface and walking on it (slippery surface on metal deck), and even when I do its not a big deal. I do have to basically crawl or lay on the trailer to tie my truck down on the rear but I've never found the surface of the deck to be an issue. Yeah you can bust your @$$ on the metal deck if its raining or wet for whatever reason... wood deck can be slippery too.
I would take a look at the features you want and the weight rating...then see what fits in your budget...wood deck is cheaper in price and many of these type trailers are offered in either style.
I got a good buy on the metal deck trailer I have and I like it, but others may not for various reasons.
Another thing to look at is....how low is the trailer deck surface relative to the road....are you going to have to crawl around on the ground or whatever it takes to secure the front/rear of your towed vehicle or do you have reasonable access to the undercarriage of the towed vehicle when its on the trailer deck such that you can reach the axles (if you use axle straps)... to me it makes a big difference in ease of loading. Sure the lower deck handles better but I'm not in a race when towing and the low decks generally mean you will be dragging @$$ at times.
I would take a look at the features you want and the weight rating...then see what fits in your budget...wood deck is cheaper in price and many of these type trailers are offered in either style.
I got a good buy on the metal deck trailer I have and I like it, but others may not for various reasons.
Another thing to look at is....how low is the trailer deck surface relative to the road....are you going to have to crawl around on the ground or whatever it takes to secure the front/rear of your towed vehicle or do you have reasonable access to the undercarriage of the towed vehicle when its on the trailer deck such that you can reach the axles (if you use axle straps)... to me it makes a big difference in ease of loading. Sure the lower deck handles better but I'm not in a race when towing and the low decks generally mean you will be dragging @$$ at times.
Mark W
Yep, I really don't really care that much I guess.
That brings up a related subject:
After spending the money for a brand new trailer, don't cheap out on tie downs. In the pastI have to admit to being guilty of using l;ess than ideal gear for this. "When the devil drives..." but it doesn't cost all that much for good (and enough) tiedowns. and the difference in safety is significant.
Personally I use heavy straps rather than chain, and short, heavy and chafe guarded straps at each end to attach to the axles and to the trailer. One at each corner. When I have a longer tow over rough roads ( Like running the Alaska Highway) I also secure each corner of the frame along with each corner of the axles). (The rig is secured above and below the suspension this way... no sway, no shift, no loading and unloading of any of the attachment points.
Each corner pulls outward as well as forward/back, with the shortest run possible. crossing to the opposite side of the trailer just increases the run of the tiedown and allows more shifting for the same amount of loading.
A single line front or rear may seem "OK for this short easy trip"... until something goes wrong and kills someone.
Mark...
After spending the money for a brand new trailer, don't cheap out on tie downs. In the pastI have to admit to being guilty of using l;ess than ideal gear for this. "When the devil drives..." but it doesn't cost all that much for good (and enough) tiedowns. and the difference in safety is significant.
Personally I use heavy straps rather than chain, and short, heavy and chafe guarded straps at each end to attach to the axles and to the trailer. One at each corner. When I have a longer tow over rough roads ( Like running the Alaska Highway) I also secure each corner of the frame along with each corner of the axles). (The rig is secured above and below the suspension this way... no sway, no shift, no loading and unloading of any of the attachment points.
Each corner pulls outward as well as forward/back, with the shortest run possible. crossing to the opposite side of the trailer just increases the run of the tiedown and allows more shifting for the same amount of loading.
A single line front or rear may seem "OK for this short easy trip"... until something goes wrong and kills someone.
Mark...
crushers
post ho
i like chains for long tows, just in case of chaffing of the straps. i like the pull handle load binders better than the ratchet type, personal preference.
if i use straps i like to stop every hour or so to do a quick walk around.
the initial lock-down, then drive 10 min, do a close review and after that, with the chains, i check everytime i need to stop for something ... with the dogs with me, that is about every couple hours.
i use the heavy 3" straps, not cheap and you can do damage if you dont pay attention when ratcheting down but they are STRONG and built well. they last years as well.
those little 1" straps are great for light loads but should be replaced every year and checked often.
that is just my experience.
if i use straps i like to stop every hour or so to do a quick walk around.
the initial lock-down, then drive 10 min, do a close review and after that, with the chains, i check everytime i need to stop for something ... with the dogs with me, that is about every couple hours.
i use the heavy 3" straps, not cheap and you can do damage if you dont pay attention when ratcheting down but they are STRONG and built well. they last years as well.
those little 1" straps are great for light loads but should be replaced every year and checked often.
that is just my experience.
^^^ I pretty much agree with Crushers. For me I become the tie-down king whenever I haul anything. I use a combo of 3" straps, engine hoist chains and ratchet cables! I've lost stuff on the highway when I was younger and now I'm always super worried about it... Never Again (insert evil laugh here). 
-Daniel
-Daniel
crushers
post ho
for me, it was 2 different occurances that made me make the decision to play safe.
in 1982, there was a utility trailer that came off a vehicle, no safety chains and it went across the medium and took out a family going the other way. the tow'r was never located.
when i heard of this i thought "damn, he will have to live with the knowledge he killed an entire family ... for the rest of his life". before this i thought, i would rather have the trailer go into the ditch than damage the back of my vehicle, after i heard this i felt i would rather have a dented tailgate than live with such an event.
the second, i had a Mits jeep and a 70 series butt to butt on my float. both were chained individually as well as to each other, i check the load a few times on the drive to the mountains with nothing amiss. then as i came to a steep hill i started to slow down, (slower over the top the better chance of stopping if somethign goes wrong on the decent) and it "seemed" the load was floating back and forth ... WTF?
i got out and checked and the rear load binder had popped open alowing about 9" of float which could also allow for the chains to come off should i hit a rough section of road ... damn!
i stopped at the local parts source in the middle of no where and asked for some "ties" to hold my chain binder closed. "get busted for unsafe load"? ... nope, i just want a safe load.
these are what i bought:
http://www.patentgenius.com/image/7458238-3.html
best $5 spent. there is no way the handle can come open and you can hook it through the holes on each end and around the handle for storage and no more cracked knuckles when moving them around...
in 1982, there was a utility trailer that came off a vehicle, no safety chains and it went across the medium and took out a family going the other way. the tow'r was never located.
when i heard of this i thought "damn, he will have to live with the knowledge he killed an entire family ... for the rest of his life". before this i thought, i would rather have the trailer go into the ditch than damage the back of my vehicle, after i heard this i felt i would rather have a dented tailgate than live with such an event.
the second, i had a Mits jeep and a 70 series butt to butt on my float. both were chained individually as well as to each other, i check the load a few times on the drive to the mountains with nothing amiss. then as i came to a steep hill i started to slow down, (slower over the top the better chance of stopping if somethign goes wrong on the decent) and it "seemed" the load was floating back and forth ... WTF?
i got out and checked and the rear load binder had popped open alowing about 9" of float which could also allow for the chains to come off should i hit a rough section of road ... damn!
i stopped at the local parts source in the middle of no where and asked for some "ties" to hold my chain binder closed. "get busted for unsafe load"? ... nope, i just want a safe load.
these are what i bought:
http://www.patentgenius.com/image/7458238-3.html
best $5 spent. there is no way the handle can come open and you can hook it through the holes on each end and around the handle for storage and no more cracked knuckles when moving them around...
That's freaking awful and that kind of thing is pretty much my fear and why I go crazy with all my loads! I find it amazing when people always give me grief for super securing a load down and then I think I hope I'm never behind them hauling something!
-Daniel
I use (I think I recall seeing a tag on the straps that says 10,000lbs rated) ratchet tie down straps front and back, one end to large d-ring on the deck and the other to an axle strap. Two on the front and two on the rear. I also use a chain with a safety clasp on each end from a d-ring to one of my bumper d-rings both front and back, to function as a safety chain. These chains are cut to length and are not tensioned down, they function as a saefty and would only allow maybe 2-3 inches of movement front to rear if for some reason I had a strap failure.
When I stop for gas I'll walk around the trailer to check strap tension and sometimes I may get one more ratchet notch pull due to the vehicles movement. I also make sure the straps are not frayed or rotted. I never put the strap up for storage until they dry out if it rained.
Given my trailer design I pull straight down on the front two straps (towed vehicle engine forward), I cross the straps at the rear. THere is some distance between the axle on the rear of the towed vehicle and the tie down dring at the rear of the trailer/deck. on my setup. I think the arrangement helps control potential movement of the towed vehicle side to side. Plus the angle is different as opposed to pulling down on say the bumper.
I find that once you go through a brief period where the towed vehicle settles you may be able to tighten down on one or two of the straps by a small margin and then thats it....I tighten the straps down as hard as I can pull without using a cheater bar.
Like others...I try to play it safe, I use good ratchet tie down straps that are load rated and made for that purpose, same for the axle straps, I use proper rated chain with safety clasps on the hooks, and the d-rings on the trailer are overkill and also the ones on my bumper are as well.
You will need a brake controller too...if your truck does not have one and the associated wiring for the 7 pin trailer hitch. My truck has that built in but some don't. I like the built in version as it works very well..I adjusted it one time and I've never had to screw with it again.
When I stop for gas I'll walk around the trailer to check strap tension and sometimes I may get one more ratchet notch pull due to the vehicles movement. I also make sure the straps are not frayed or rotted. I never put the strap up for storage until they dry out if it rained.
Given my trailer design I pull straight down on the front two straps (towed vehicle engine forward), I cross the straps at the rear. THere is some distance between the axle on the rear of the towed vehicle and the tie down dring at the rear of the trailer/deck. on my setup. I think the arrangement helps control potential movement of the towed vehicle side to side. Plus the angle is different as opposed to pulling down on say the bumper.
I find that once you go through a brief period where the towed vehicle settles you may be able to tighten down on one or two of the straps by a small margin and then thats it....I tighten the straps down as hard as I can pull without using a cheater bar.
Like others...I try to play it safe, I use good ratchet tie down straps that are load rated and made for that purpose, same for the axle straps, I use proper rated chain with safety clasps on the hooks, and the d-rings on the trailer are overkill and also the ones on my bumper are as well.
You will need a brake controller too...if your truck does not have one and the associated wiring for the 7 pin trailer hitch. My truck has that built in but some don't. I like the built in version as it works very well..I adjusted it one time and I've never had to screw with it again.
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ntsqd
technerd
When using straps or chains at an angle relative to the direction of the force keep in mind that the angle reduces the effective max of the strap or chain. I'm continually surprised by how many experienced folks don't realize how significant this can be, particularly when the angle is high.
Qwik googling pulled up these pages:
http://sbcslingsandbinders.com/sling-to-load-angle-efficiency/
http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/resources/pdfs/guide-for-doggers.pdf (pg 5 is the meat of it)
http://www.fdlake.com/rig-slng.html
http://halosupply.net/Files/Press/RiggingInformation-AnglesHitches.pdf
Qwik googling pulled up these pages:
http://sbcslingsandbinders.com/sling-to-load-angle-efficiency/
http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/resources/pdfs/guide-for-doggers.pdf (pg 5 is the meat of it)
http://www.fdlake.com/rig-slng.html
http://halosupply.net/Files/Press/RiggingInformation-AnglesHitches.pdf
- Thread starter
- #72
I've already bought some good straps. I have the 3" wide heavy duty straps that are rated for 10,000# each. I'm extremely cautious when I tow. I always keep an eye on my load and check straps any time I stop. I only have 3 straps right now but the last time I towed I had a strap come loose so I'm going to go ahead an get another one. I also already have a brake controller. My Tundra (all Toyotas that come with 7 pin plugs) are pre-wired for the brake control so it was super easy to hook up.
please expand on this .... are you saying I or someone else here is taking some unusual risk or something? or is this just a general observation?
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ntsqd
technerd
General observation triggered by some mention of how folks tie down vehicles and equipment. Most important is to recognize that a 10k rated strap pulling at a very shallow angle relative to the direction of force needs to be de-rated significantly. According to one of my links above if that angle is 45° then the strap should be de-rated by 30% and if it is the max allowable angle of 30° (for rigging) then the strap's rating should de-rated by 50% As speculation a 10° angle has a de-rating that is probably in the 85%+ range. Suddenly that 10k rated strap isn't all that strong. Good thing that there is more than one of them.
Without pictures it's too hard to say what is good or bad, and there will have to be compromises depending on the priority for any particular strap.
A strap used in the rear is primarily there to keep the vehicle in place during a panic stop and secondarily there to locate it on the trailer. The more horizontal they can be, as viewed from the side, the better they'll the primary job, but the worse they'll do the secondary job. And the secondary job is important too, so it's a juggling act.
A strap at the front is primarily there to locate the vehicle on the trailer since it is the extremely rare tow rig that can accelerate fast enough to seriously strain the straps. Some angle, as viewed from the front or back helps in lateral location, but usually this means that vertical tension is lost.
This could easily be a whole separate thread...
Without pictures it's too hard to say what is good or bad, and there will have to be compromises depending on the priority for any particular strap.
A strap used in the rear is primarily there to keep the vehicle in place during a panic stop and secondarily there to locate it on the trailer. The more horizontal they can be, as viewed from the side, the better they'll the primary job, but the worse they'll do the secondary job. And the secondary job is important too, so it's a juggling act.
A strap at the front is primarily there to locate the vehicle on the trailer since it is the extremely rare tow rig that can accelerate fast enough to seriously strain the straps. Some angle, as viewed from the front or back helps in lateral location, but usually this means that vertical tension is lost.
This could easily be a whole separate thread...
Bogo
FOOF
Featherlites are built to lite.
Eby knows how to make a good solid AL trailer. They have both 10k and 14k AL rear hitch type equipment trailers in both low and above the wheel decks, and a low deck 7k car one. http://www.mheby.com/flatbed/ET-10KStandard.php
If you have the choice, towing with a pickup, go with a gooseneck. Much easier to tow and maneuver.
I also like wood decked trailers, but they do weigh more. For care, treat the wood with a wood preservative like you would a house deck. I've replaced a couple boards on mine, but it is an early '80s vintage gooseneck trailer, and I don't think the original owner did any deck treatment.
The longer the trailer you have, the taller the frame members have to be to have it properly stiff end to end. This is the biggest problem with the trailer I have. If I put a heavy load on it, it can get some flex which you feel as a fore aft push pull in the cab. I try to keep the load fully over the rear axles if at all possible.
I've been told I use to many straps, but then I've never had a load shift or lost a load either. On each side I go from the frame to the trailer both front and rear with ratchet straps. These don't have any fore/aft angling. To the front and rear I also use shallow angled Grade 70 or 80 load binder chains to secure for fore aft motion. If I don't have to put a pipe on the chain binder to get it set, it isn't tight enough. I keep the chain binders from opening with two independent wrappings of wire. I thread the wire through the holes in the chain, and the holes in the chain binder's handle. If I was buying chain binders now, I'd get the ratchet type.
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fj40charles
SILVER Star
Lots of good recommendations so far. I would spend the extra $$ and get what you want. Sometimes, it will mean ordering a custom trailer which can be even more $$$.
I have a 16' tilt bed 14k with pintle and wood deck. I tow it with my 08 tundra. I bought it from someone who towed it with a Tundra.
I disagree with the buy too much trailer theory. It is hard to maneuver when not hitched. I do live on a hill so that is part.
Heavier trailers cost more to register also. the tilt bed seems to be heavier but much nicer than ramps.
I do agree with getting the highest rating axles for the trailer though.
I disagree with the buy too much trailer theory. It is hard to maneuver when not hitched. I do live on a hill so that is part.
Heavier trailers cost more to register also. the tilt bed seems to be heavier but much nicer than ramps.
I do agree with getting the highest rating axles for the trailer though.
