Builds 1990 LJ78 in Montana

[pradoblivious]

I got started on the manual lockers today... Bit of a struggle with the cone-washers

Everything on the drivers side looked pretty good. I sanded away some rust on the studs, and the copper contact surface ring and motor brushes were completely mired in grease. Nothing looked stripped, warped, etc.. though. all the seals seem to have held their seal.

If you squint you can see the brushes in the above photo.. they are the two grease-slathered rectangles. I assume that's not how they're supposed to be right? That doesn't seem conducive to... er conductivity.
Anyway I got everything stripped down, degreased, paper washer stripped and the spacer on...

And thats when I realized that I stupidly ordered the wrong manual hub locks. I needed aisin fht-008 and evidently ordered aisin fht-018. So the hub locks I have in hand didn't fit, and because I've had all this sitting around for several months now, it's too late to return them.. So facepalm I guess.

I went ahead and de-greased the electric hub, got the brushes and ring looking like copper again and threw it back on. Tomorrow I'll do the same to the other side and see if maybe that just fixes it. I didn't really notice anything obviously wrong in there, other than one retention screw had come loose from the hub-face (you can see it in the first pick.

I was also a little surprised by how much play there was in the axle shaft once the snap ring was off. I took a video so I could ask yall, is this normal?

 

[FJBen]

Sorry, Yes I did ask them about linear protrusion, but they just kind of shrugged at me like a customer who over-heated his truck and spends too much time on the internet.

Yeah that pretty much confirms they didn’t check it and would have me fairly concerned.

That’s basic rebuild work and measurements for something with liners.

 

[Felde]

Sorry, Yes I did ask them about linear protrusion, but they just kind of shrugged at me like a customer who over-heated his truck and spends too much time on the internet.

Uhh. So, what is their opinion on your never ending head gasket issues (other than gratefully taking your money again)? Did they actually check the protrusion at least?
Probably time for a different shop?
Good Luck Ralf

 

[pradoblivious]

Their opinion is that I overheated it. I wish I was drowning in places that are willing to rebuild 13-bt's but unfortunately not the case. Maybe I should drive it up to Ben's machinist if he's willing to take a look at another one.

 

[pradoblivious]

Ok, so I pulled the other hub off this morning to clean it, and found the problem with my e-lockers. It's in the cap. One side isn't "expanding" when you turn it.

 

[FJBen]

Their opinion is that I overheated it. I wish I was drowning in places that are willing to rebuild 13-bt's but unfortunately not the case. Maybe I should drive it up to Ben's machinist if he's willing to take a look at another one.

You definitely don’t need a special machine shop to work on these. You just need one with some attention to detail and good reviews.

They are super basic diesel engines. Basically the same as an Isuzu 4bd. Anyone that has worked on those will have zero issues

It’s literally a direct injected pushrod diesel engine with sleeves. These engines were in trucks, vans, farm equipment, generators you name it.


Again not to beat on you about it, but if those liners don’t have the right protrusion, this will happen again.

At this point if it’s back together, then just run it. If she blows again I would get that measurement at another shop and try to get some recourse.

Here’s a good video explaining some of it and why it’s so important during a rebuild.

 

[AirheadNut]

Oh man, sorry to hear about the continued engine troubles! Sounds like you might need to find another shop that is actually capable of following the factory manuals for that thing.

With regards to your electric hubs, there is definitely supposed to be grease on the slip ring and brushes, the manual specifies Toyota Castle Body Grease or something like that, but I have found that Molykote 44 Light works well for a fraction of the cost. The spline not expanding on one side might be due to the inner portion of the hub (the part that engages with the little pinion gear on the motor) spinning with the hub spline. If you hold that inner part still does the spline extend out when you rotate it?

 

[pradoblivious]

At this point if it’s back together, then just run it. If she blows again I would get that measurement at another shop and try to get some recourse.

Thank you, this is 100% the plan, I really appreciate your input.. one of these days I would really love to listen to your 13bt run heh.

The spline not expanding on one side might be due to the inner portion of the hub (the part that engages with the little pinion gear on the motor) spinning with the hub spline. If you hold that inner part still does the spline extend out when you rotate it?

With a pair of needle-nose pliers, I was able to extend the sprocket, on the spring, but there's nothing to "catch" and hold the inner spline so that it extends itself when the sprocket is turned like the working one does. It just spins forever in either direction.

I went ahead and ordered the correct asin manual hub-locks and got them on today though.

Trouble is; they don't fix my original problem with the 4x4. When I lock them and attempt to drive, there's still a gnarly *CLUNK* in the front drive-train that you can feel like you hit a bump in the road. And man it sounds terrible. Like the front diff is gonna explode. I think it sounds worse now that I have the manual hub locks on. I suspect my "snapped" electric hub-lock is a symptom of whatever the clunk is rather than its cause... like something in the front drive train is freezing up in opposition to the inertia of the wheels, and that torque snapped whatever engages with that large sprocket in my electric-locker's cap.

Today, when I drove it to the end of the block to check it out, I heard the clunk, stopped the truck, got out and disengaged the hublocks, and saw fluid dripping down through the wheel well, popped the hood, and it's power-steering fluid. Either it was an amazing coincidence, or whatever this is popped the power-steering hose right at the interface with the pump.

 

[AirheadNut]

That doesn't sound good at all. Can you feel the clunk if you rotate the front driveshaft by hand with the hubs unlocked and the transfer in 2WD? What about with the wheels in the air and the hubs locked? Wondering if you might have a failed birfield joint or if something has let loose in the front differential.

I have to imagine that a power steering hose letting loose is a coincidence, unless the clunk is actually somehow related to the steering system and not the front axle.

Edit: just a thought, have you checked the front driveshaft u-joints and slip joint for play? I was convinced there was a busted front hub on my dad's old Dodge but it turned out one of the front u-joints was completely shot (to the point that all the needle bearings had fallen out of the bearing cups). It made some really nasty pops and bangs with the hubs locked in.

 

[FJBen]

Thank you, this is 100% the plan, I really appreciate your input.. one of these days I would really love to listen to your 13bt run heh.

All I’ve got is some idle and rev video i suppose I could record some driving.
But hey, come closer this way and drive it.

 

[pradoblivious]

just a thought, have you checked the front driveshaft u-joints and slip joint for play? I was convinced there was a busted front hub on my dad's old Dodge but it turned out one of the front u-joints was completely shot (to the point that all the needle bearings had fallen out of the bearing cups). It made some really nasty pops and bangs with the hubs locked in.

I checked the wheel bearings for play before installing the manual hublocks per those instructions.. I (of course) need to do some work travel, so it'll have to sit for a few weeks. I might take this opportunity to just rebuild the entire front axle.. both shafts, knuckles etc..

 

[pradoblivious]

Alright yall time for a long-overdue update. The truck's been at the mechanic for months, and we've done a ton, but unfortunately the "clunk" is still there. I'll quote myself as a reminder of the problem:

there's a gnarly *CLUNK* in the front drive-train that you can feel like you hit a bump in the road. And man it sounds terrible. Like the front diff is gonna explode. I think it sounds worse now that I have the manual hub locks on.... like something in the front drive train is freezing up in opposition to the inertia of the wheels,

The clunk happens in 2wd and 4wd with the hubs locked. When the hubs are not locked, there is no clunk in 2wd or 4wd. At this point the entire front-end is re-built. What we did so far:

• Replace elocks with manual hublocks (ASIN, via the rad-cruiser kit)
• Knuckle rebuild on both sides
• Birfields replaced
• Front and rear Diff rebuilds and re-geared to 5:29 for hopefully a little more oomf up the mountain passes in MT (4:88's now in a box)
• Front Drive-Shaft replace with a Tom Woods custom driveshaft
• Transfer case rebuild, also replaced the output shaft

A few pics:
The new front-diff housing..

Shiny new knuckles.

new forward drive shaft

Birfields

 

[pradoblivious]

Transfer case rebuild

 

[pradoblivious]

and the front diff

 

[pradoblivious]

Any other guesses as to where the "clunk" could be coming from would be super-appreciated heh. Everything in blue in the diagram below is rebuilt or new. The current working hypothesis is that there is a problem with the transfer vacuum actuator, which is allowing something? to "pop out", while the hubs are locked. Mechanic (whose done an awesome job so far) wants to delete the vacuum system altogether and replace it with a manual pushrod/linkage setup. Open to opinions about that too.. this is an a440f trans with tcase off a bj74.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Any better pics of the splines on the output shaft of the trans? Which output shaft was replaced? The t-case or the trans?

This is a very common wear spot and produces a clunk

We offer a great solution for that!

T-Case Long Spline Input Gear - Fits 4/1986 & Newer 19 Spline (32 Tooth)

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[pradoblivious]

It was the transfer case output shaft we replaced (not the one pictured). I don't have better pics of it unfortunately, but I thought the "clunk" associated with that output shaft happened when shifting into reverse?

 

[pradoblivious]

This is the shaft that got replaced

 

[cruiseroutfit]

View attachment 3828880

This is the shaft that got replaced

That is a t-case front output shaft, not typically associated with a clunk, particularly in 2WD as it's static.

 

[pradoblivious]

Sorry that was a poorly worded response on my part.

* The truck had it's t-case output shaft replaced. (not the transmission output shaft)
* I do not have better pictures of the transmission output shaft
* I have read that the clunk caused by the transmission output shaft, for which you sell the long spline input gears, only happens when you shift the truck into reverse, rather than just constant periodic clunk when the hubs are locked like I have. Eg.. I thought that was a different flavor of clunk