You guys are not going to believe this. Blew another head gasket today!

[Gumby]

I'd love to see those statistics. Seems as if everyone with a 1FZ has had a headgasket problem. I can't believe there hasn't been a factory recall. I can't believe Toyota could build such a great and complete truck and fall on their face with the powerplant. Seems to be corrected on the brand new stuff but the traded a better engine for independent suspension. Gain in one way and lose in another.





Beating the engine swap drum here. Sounds like it would be a great time for that. I've been trying to research the torque and HP numbers and the increase seems quite significant.

The surveys are in the archives for you to read. Just do a search.

It seems like everybody, but it's not. The rest of use don't post once a week and say, "I haven't blown a HG this week."

There hasn't been a factory recall because it's not a huge problem. GM 3.1L blow intake gaskets almost 100% of the time at as little as 30,000 miles. That's a problem. A straight 6 that blows a head gasket <10% of the time and almost alway well over 100,000 miles isn't a problem. Unfortunately for Toyota, we have come to expect crazy things from our trucks, like 300,000 miles worry free vehicles. That's just not realistic in the case of the LC. It's not a Camry.

I would disagree they fell on their face with the 1FZ-FE. It's a great powerplant. Every I-6 ever made has had HG issues somewhere along the line. Pretty nice trade off for perfect primary and secondary balance.

It should not be discounted that Doug tows big boats in the mountains. He has said himself he works them hard. No amount of maintenance is going to counter that completely.

 

[Gumby]

I'm not a toyota basher and yes my error on the V6 issue and not making it clear that my is that toyota is not foulable. The inline six was great for years and years and years I know but why try to make it work in this application. I don't see alot of posts about thrown rods and such with this engine and the basic design has been around for a long, long time. Isn't it a copy of a chevy design? I heard it was a ripoff of the old Iron Duke. But does anyone really think this was the best engine for a 6000 lb application. The headgasket issue isn't a deal breaker if you can fix it yourself but the power is the issue. Definate improvement over my 3fe in power but still for the fuel economy it should be more powerful. Thats my question and why I wondered why toyota came up with this solution. It was only in these trucks for how many years? I guess I am playing devils advocate a bit but I'm trying to see toyotas logic in this engine for this truck. I know they weren't going to start buying SBC's to swap in but why and how did they settle on this? I piss purists off on alot of issues from AR 15s, to DJ gear, to IH scouts because while I love 95% of what they have done the 5% that was obvious and could have been done better drives me crazy.

The Iron Duke was a 4 cylinder.

You are thinking of the Stovebolt I-6. The F was similar to that motor. The 1FZ-FE shares only the configuration

Is an I-6 the best configuration for a 6000 pound rig. No question. They used I-6s in almost every heavy truck I can think of at one time or another.

Most semi trucks use I-6s. They are incredibly durable. Jeep, GM, Ford and Chrysler have all had very durable I-6s. Pretty much says it's hard to screw one up. They are also very smooth, the reason why Lexus and BMW stuck with them for so long, dispite high and long hoods, and poor performance compared to a v-8.

The Land Cruiser was never built for American highways. At least not until the 100 series, the one truck many purists love to hate. They are built for durability, not speed. The I-6 is a fine engine for that.

 

[powderpig]

Push the 80 to 100+ miles for a couple of hours and see how the fuel guage responds.
These trucks are designed to tow stuff and do the job well in other countries. We here in the USA have a wonderful road system the allow the truck maker to design the vechicles to tow more faster and safer(not in my opinion, for another thread Maybe?). We are spoiled in soooooo many way and to compare this wonderful truck to some of the stuff made here is not right (IMHO). It is made with a different mind set and it right on the money for the period it was design for. Not only for here but in most of the rest of the world. We did not get some of the options that other got, but we did get a wonderfully over designed vechicle that will far out last other truck being produced by others auto makers.

As for doug's misfortune, I think it is just blind luck. His first HG was moslty from a crack in the head that was likely there from the PO. and was not pick up on the purchase. Now not all 93-94 blow up like dougs, most will weep more than blow. So most of the early 1fz that I have seen and worked on have weeped externally and will give some type of warning unless it is the LHH giving way to mass loss of coolant, thus a over heat.
Any how anything mechanical that is built will fail in some way or the other over time. later robbie

 

[Gumby]

I have done my share of 350 swaps. I have pulled perfectly good 2Fs to do it. I would put one in an 80 if I came across a 91-92 with a bad 3FE.

I will rebuild my 1FZ when the time comes.

A 350 is a good motor. It is cheap and easy to work on and get parts for. It has more power and it's easy to get a lot more from it. It's a good replacement in a trail rig that will probably never see 50,000 miles of driving.

It's not a 1FZ.

 

[re_guderian]

... But does anyone really think this was the best engine for a 6000 lb application. The headgasket issue isn't a deal breaker if you can fix it yourself but the power is the issue. Definate improvement over my 3fe in power but still for the fuel economy it should be more powerful. Thats my question and why I wondered why toyota came up with this solution. It was only in these trucks for how many years?

Toyota surely had access to the Lexus V8 that came out in the 1990 LS400's, yet chose to continue with the 1FZ-FE for 5 years in the LC. I'm ok with taking my chances on it. Each model has had it's issues.

 

[cruiserman]

Toyota's straight six in the supras also blew headgaskets.

Aluminum head and cast iron block means head gasket failure eventually. That is unless we want to underfill the block and head. I don't think Toyota had HG issues with full cast iron motors.

 

[Bob_Garrett]

"Did you just compare an 80 to a Jeep?".....

He said, as he retrieved the voodoo doll from behind the counter.....

 

[Beowulf]

Aluminum head and cast iron block means head gasket failure eventually.

Another True Story by Beowulf

I blew a HG on a 1965 Corvair. Not a drop of coolant in the oil though and I drove it for several months and it never overheated. Not once. That was also the first and only time I have done a HG job.

-B-

 

[Gumby]

That's amazing!

the first beetle engine I rebuilt didn't even have head gaskets in it. The PO musta left em out. It still ran and didn't leak a drop of coolant.


I had a 65 'vair for a while. I just saw it in the boneyard when I was there last.

 

[RavenTai]

I blew a HG on a 1965 Corvair. Not a drop of coolant in the oil
-B-

LOL

 

[MH_Stevens]

Did you just compare an 80 to a Jeep?.....

I love my 80 and I love my ex-Army CJ5 too. I didn't compare them 'cos they are quite different beasts but they are both superb when the going gets tough. Now with the CJ5 you always feel you are wheelin' as with the 80 it's all so easy and smooth you often forget.

Mike S

 

[tucker74]

This thread is a lot of crapola IMO - $400 worth of parts on a 150k plus engine is not a big deal. Slap a new gasket on it and go about your business man ... a hell of a lot cheaper than the 3+ transmissions you'd have gone through on a 'burban. The 1FZE is a great engine -



Tucker

BTW - didn't mean you Doug ... just the engine talk -

 

[DJForrestA]

I like the candor and open minds in this forum. Not saying my solution is the best but saying it is a solution that is used in a ton of different applications. I like to step on the gas and go and my experience is mostly limited to what I read on this board. I don't mean any of this to be a personal insult just a personal observation. I'll be there for any one of you guys should you ever be in my area and need a hand. My experience with the SBC has been outstanding. Like I said I'd never compare another SUV overall with the cruiser as they just can't compare. My opinion is the engine while reliable except the the head gasket just doesn't produce enough power for the economy. I don't mind getting 13 MPG on the highway but I would expect that from my carburated SBC scout with 37's and 4.88s. I would expect more from a 6000 dollar replacement engine produced in the mid 90's with an overdrive transmission. Power in relation to economy is my arguement.

 

[powderpig]

If power to ecomomy is your arguement, then you bought the wrong 80 series (unless you have another not in your sig line). The 3FE was a interm engine and orginally not ment for the 80 series. Yea I wish there was not head gasket issues as well, but besides the alum head to iron block thing. Toyota (as well as a lot of manifactures) were going through the same thing with gasket materials (no Asbestis(can not spell)). It is hard in the enviroment of a design facality to get age on a material and it have it age as it will in the real world.
The real power of the 1FZ come in when you wheel it, while it many not get the ecomany of a 4/runner or a mine truck , it will out distance a SBC on the trail. And have plenty of power .
A straight head gasket job on the 1FZ is 15 hours book rate, (you fill in the labor rate), about 300 in parts, oil, coolant. So for the people that can not wrench for themself. A HG job could cost around $1500.00. That is a far cry from the 5500 some one qouted some guy could do it for all the time(That would be great, but what SBC would you end up with, the mexican made ones?)
What power specs are you talking about as well? SBC comes in many power and torque combo's. What does 5500 get you, one in the 240 hp range or one n the 320 hp range. We all know that the more hp the more money it takes in fuel. Then you have figure fuel delevery. You can not just slap a carb on it and it all be fine, it need to be fuel injected. or it will not pass most state laws for a road vechicle. What fuel injection system would be included for that orginal 5500?
It all does not make sense to me to take a wonderful under stressed engine out and replace it with a SBC that is a dinosour(very simalar to the f, 1f, 2f, 3f series, they also are dino's) in the production of engines. I would rather pull the 1fz and build it then put it back in( I have with a could of engines for me as well as for customers). In each case the fuel ecomany has come up and as well as power. Some close to the 300hp level (close to 400 ftlb torque). Those numbers can be had out the 1fz and still be very realible.
Like I posted in a previous post, I have not seen here anyone's SBC conversion come out well on a 80 (that does not mean it has not). I have seen great 60-62 conversions and seen those owners move on to the 80 /1fz combo and not wish for any thing more.
It will be interesting to see what direction you go when you finally get tired of the 3fe in your truck. good luck robbie

 

[DJForrestA]

Yea thats my debate. I know I won't stay were I'm at. I realize the 1fz has more power than this 3fe and have read many a post about how the 3fe is more reliable but waaaay underpowered. There are sooooo many aftermarket FI setups for the SBC that cost has really become resonable and its a three wire hookup. I wouldn't say the design is outdated they are still using the basic design in the new trucks that have 300+ HP and nearly 400FT lbs of torque. You could get one of those out of a wreckage complete for 2500 bucks. Hell I may put a cummins 4BT turbo diesel in when that time comes. Doug good luck with your HG. Didn't mean to hijack just saw this as an opportunity to try something different for you especially where you tow all the time. I've seen torque and HP numbers on the 1fz all over the board does anyone have the factory numbers?

 

[RavenTai]

Max. Output [SAE–NET] 158 kW @ 4600 (212 HP @ 4600)
Max. Torque [SAE–NET] 373 N.m @ 3200 rpm (275 ft.lbf @ 3200 rpm)

 

[RavenTai]

its no muscle car but the 1FZ has enough for me.

 

[cruiserdan]

Add a blower and you get around 290 hp and around 390 lb-ft torque.

 

[CreeperSleeper]

the first beetle engine I rebuilt didn't even have head gaskets in it. The PO musta left em out. It still ran and didn't leak a drop of coolant.

You guys are going to confuse the living piss out of someone! I love it.

BTW: Same story with my old 914...

 

[DJForrestA]

What is redline on the 1fz if max hp is at 4600?