Wheel Bearing Noise

[Indiana80]

Anyone ever have wheel bearing noise that is kind of a constant “wah wah wah” low frequency noise / not quite a growl, but close, rotational based on wheel speed, drives me batty from about 10 or 15MPH up to ~ 40MPH, then it’s no longer audible. I’ve had several wheel bearings on their way out over the years and the noise always changes when changing direction / loading up one side of the vehicle on the highway. This noise only changes with speed and not with change of steering angle. I suspected tires, but changed fronts to back, road force balanced, and no change. Tires are BFG KO2 with about 25 K on them and 2 tire shops say no issue with tires. I plan to change wheel bearings next- they’re close to end of service interval, anyway. Was just curious if this sounded familiar to anyone else on this forum.

 

[kbfj621989]

I was going to suggest moving tires around but since you have done that already, how are your brakes looking? Backing plates not bent? Any noise when you lift the wheels and spin them by hand? If everything is in order, I agree with doing wheel bearings.

 

[T4R2TLC]

Wheel bearings can definitely produce rotational groans, whirs, clicks, etc.

Mine started with clicking and now have a rotational whirring sound. They'll be getting replaced as soon as the parts get here from Amayama. They would likely be ok with just a repack, but it seems prudent to have the new bearings on hand in case the races or bearings have wear. It seems like once they are noisy there has to be a degree of harmful friction going on somewhere.

Definitely test the ease of spinning them with wheels off the ground and listen closely to isolate bearings vs brakes.

 

[Indiana80]

I’m right behind

I was going to suggest moving tires around but since you have done that already, how are your brakes looking? Backing plates not bent? Any noise when you lift the wheels and spin them by hand? If everything is in order, I agree with doing wheel bearings.

Brakes are good. I’ve owned the truck for about 7 mos. Right after I got it, I jacked it up and checked for play in front wheels. Front DS had quite a bit of slop and PS a little slop. So, the wheel bearings had been run loose for a while- I’m guessing. This evening, my wife and I made a 100 mile round trip out for dinner. When we got home I felt the flange caps on both sides. Pass side was warm, but no problem keeping my hand on it. Driver side was hot, almost couldn’t keep my hand on it. Seems likely it’s time for new bearings / races. Any other possible damage / abnormal wear from running bearings loose that I should look into in front / outer axles while I’m in there?

 

[kbfj621989]

I’m probably stating the obvious, replace the oil seal and gasket, high temps may have shortened the life a little.

 

[OEMGUY0720]

Have you done the wheel bearing 9 and 3 o’clock position to wiggle the wheel when it’s up on jack stands? If not try that. Also, when you remove your wheels, try inspecting your rotors. Rotate it see if it contacts on and off on the brake pads. Check calipers as well if they are snug tight on the knuckle.

 

[Indiana80]

Have you done the wheel bearing 9 and 3 o’clock position to wiggle the wheel when it’s up on jack stands? If not try that. Also, when you remove your wheels, try inspecting your rotors. Rotate it see if it contacts on and off on the brake pads. Check calipers as well if they are snug tight on the knuckle.

When I checked for wheel bearing play right after I bought it, I adjusted both sides with the fish scale method, greased the spindles, and put everything back together. No slop now, but I’ll double check the rotors making contact and caliper mounting bolts.

 

[2001LC]

Wheel bearings, FDS CV bearings, propeller shaft spiders (u-joints) can produce sounds like you're hearing (wah wah wah). But sound of those, do tend to be present at all speeds. But may not be heard due to engine and tire noise.
Shift into N and coast down hill at 60 MPH.
Check with IR gun, for excessive heat build up.
Check for looseness/play, they shouldn't be any.

Hard one to diagnose:
Axle needle bearing, is one I've found difficult to diagnose. They do tend to quiet down over ~25 MPH and mostly heard at 5 to 15 MPH. To me, kind of a scapinging sound.

First zero in on which corner (wheel). Then pull out FDS axle. Look at axle where needle bearing rolls. If scored more than what would be normal for the miles, replace needle bearing.

Axle bearing are also required to be lubed, with every 30K miles wheel bearing service. Unfortunately they almost never are lubed/greased.

This FDS axle had less than 2K miles on it. Yet scoring where needle bearings rolls, and color (indicating excessive heat) worse than seen on some at 250k mile, that were never lubed.

 

[Indiana80]

Wheel bearings, FDS CV bearings, propeller shaft spiders (u-joints) can produce sounds like you're hearing (wah wah wah). But sound of those, do tend to be present at all speeds. But may not be heard due to engine and tire noise.
Shift into N and coast down hill at 60 MPH.
Check with IR gun, for excessive heat build up.
Check for looseness/play, they shouldn't be any.

Hard one to diagnose:
Axle needle bearing, is one I've found difficult to diagnose. They do tend to quiet down over ~25 MPH and mostly heard at 5 to 15 MPH. To me, kind of a scapinging sound.

First zero in on which corner (wheel). Then pull out FDS axle. Look at axle where needle bearing rolls. If scored more than what would be normal for the miles, replace needle bearing.

Axle bearing are also required to lubed with every 30K miles wheel bearing service. Unfortunately they almost never are greased.

This FDS axle had less than 2K miles on it. Yet scoring where it rides on needle bearings and color worse than seen on some at 250k mile, that were never lubed.
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Thank you for your advice. I didn’t realize the CVs should be pulled every 30k and the inner shaft lubed- just received my factory service manuals, so I’ll be sure to try to follow the service guidelines when I do wheel bearings + watch your YouTube tutorial on wheel bearing adjustment- which is awesome. Thankfully (I think), my wah wah wah droning noise is definitely not a scraping noise. In my mind, if tires are not causing it (which I don’t think they are since noise didn’t change when moving front tires to back), it seems like it has to be wheel bearings or drive shaft joints. I am suspect that slip yokes and u-joints were long neglected. When I bought it, all prop shaft joints look dry. When I pump the slip yokes, on the rear shaft, I couldn’t get grease to seep out from oil seal, the excess would come out on the other end. I did remove skip yoke zerks and drive around to work out excess grease. When I removed the the rear yoke grease zerk it had so much pressure it sounded like when you pop open a tube of Pillsbury cinnamon rolls. Maybe the rear yoke is running dry and making the wah wah wah sound?

 

[Indiana80]

Thank you for your advice. I didn’t realize the CVs should be pulled every 30k and the inner shaft lubed- just received my factory service manuals, so I’ll be sure to try to follow the service guidelines when I do wheel bearings + watch your YouTube tutorial on wheel bearing adjustment- which is awesome. Thankfully (I think), my wah wah wah droning noise is definitely not a scraping noise. In my mind, if tires are not causing it (which I don’t think they are since noise didn’t change when moving front tires to back), it seems like it has to be wheel bearings or drive shaft joints. I am suspect that slip yokes and u-joints were long neglected. When I bought it, all prop shaft joints look dry. When I pump the slip yokes, on the rear shaft, I couldn’t get grease to seep out from oil seal, the excess would come out on the other end. I did remove skip yoke zerks and drive around to work out excess grease. When I removed the the rear yoke grease zerk it had so much pressure it sounded like when you pop open a tube of Pillsbury cinnamon rolls. Maybe the rear yoke is running dry and making the wah wah wah sound?

Quick question on the wheel bearing job…I’m working on my parts list now. Planning on doing bearings and races- not reusing old races. I don’t have a press in my garage. That being the case, will I need to take hubs and races to a shop to have new races pressed in? Or, is there DIY way without a press? If there is a DIY way at home, is it best to just punch out old races with a brass drift?

 

[kbfj621989]

You can rent this tool from Advance Auto (I think Autozone may also have this as well).

I have not used this on my LC yet but I did front bearings on my AWD sienna (different setup) and it made the job a breeze.

 

[Indiana80]

You can rent this tool from Advance Auto (I think Autozone may also have this as well).

I have not used this on my LC yet but I did front bearings on my AWD sienna (different setup) and it made the job a breeze.

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Thanks. I’ll look into that. Actually, I’m wondering if I can find a supplier that can ship me new hub assemblies with races already pressed in and the new bearings ready to pack…I may just reach out to Cruiser Outfitters.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Thanks. I’ll look into that. Actually, I’m wondering if I can find a supplier that can ship me new hub assemblies with races already pressed in and the new bearings ready to pack…I may just reach out to Cruiser Outfitters.

We do that @ Cruiser Outfitters

 

[2001LC]

Thank you for your advice. I didn’t realize the CVs should be pulled every 30k and the inner shaft lubed- just received my factory service manuals, so I’ll be sure to try to follow the service guidelines when I do wheel bearings + watch your YouTube tutorial on wheel bearing adjustment- which is awesome. Thankfully (I think), my wah wah wah droning noise is definitely not a scraping noise. In my mind, if tires are not causing it (which I don’t think they are since noise didn’t change when moving front tires to back), it seems like it has to be wheel bearings or drive shaft joints. I am suspect that slip yokes and u-joints were long neglected. When I bought it, all prop shaft joints look dry. When I pump the slip yokes, on the rear shaft, I couldn’t get grease to seep out from oil seal, the excess would come out on the other end. I did remove skip yoke zerks and drive around to work out excess grease. When I removed the the rear yoke grease zerk it had so much pressure it sounded like when you pop open a tube of Pillsbury cinnamon rolls. Maybe the rear yoke is running dry and making the wah wah wah sound?

You need the Land Cruiser Scheduled Maintenance guide, for your year. It's used with OM & Factory Service Manual. (FSM)

We don't pull front drive shafts (AKA: FDS. AKA CV) as a PM service. To be clear. Toyota calls it a FDS not CV. FDS have 5 components (inner & outer CV cover with boots, inner axle, center axle, outer axle) plus an outer seal and inner dust cover. The outer axle goes through the steering knuckles spindle. The needle bearing a brass bushing, reside in the back of the knuckle.

If I've know, needle bearing good and no contaimates inside spindle. I use the Slee spindle lube tool. Which I do have and extra one, if anyone needs one. Usually I use the Slee lube tool, the second service I do. First service, I pull knuckle and restore. Checking to see if bent, restoring where others beat the ball joints off with BFH, defroming the ball joint boot sealing surface and derusting. New needle bearing and bushing R&R, if needed and always a new knuckle seal.

 

[2001LC]

The first time I heard a Wah Wah Wah. Was coming down a mount HWY pass. I shifted into N at 65 MPH and coasted. Wah Wah WAH. This was due to under lubed spiders (AKA U-joints). The splines of the slip yoke of propeller shafts forward and aft (That again is what Toyota calls the AKA drive shafts) don't typically make a wah wah wah. They produce a clunk thunk at about 35 MPH, as one let of the gas and presses on gas again...

BTW: We no long lube the slip yokes, until grease passes the seals. We lube until first extension of slip yoke observed.

Quick question on the wheel bearing job…I’m working on my parts list now. Planning on doing bearings and races- not reusing old races. I don’t have a press in my garage. That being the case, will I need to take hubs and races to a shop to have new races pressed in? Or, is there DIY way without a press? If there is a DIY way at home, is it best to just punch out old races with a brass drift?

First keep bearing with their race, never mix and match.

It actually easy to use your brass dowel ever steel can be used here with care not to damage walls race fit in, to pound out races.
Then use your old race as driver, to tap in new race. Some put new race in freezer, to shrink first.

Thanks. I’ll look into that. Actually, I’m wondering if I can find a supplier that can ship me new hub assemblies with races already pressed in and the new bearings ready to pack…I may just reach out to Cruiser Outfitters.

Wheel hubs actual come loaded (with bearings and races).

But it waste of money. Unless wheel hub damaged beyond restorability.

Number one way (other than accident) wheel hubs, get damaged. Is again with BFH (Big F-in hammer) used to remove brake rotor. These kids at brake shops, beat then off by pound on hub face and or back side with steel.

Some pound on teeth, that wheel speed sensor reads. So we inspect for damage.

 

[2001LC]

I restore a lot of wheel hubs. only 1 in ~200 that I had to replace. It was the one above, where metal so beat on it ripped the steel. Which was from improper brake rotor replacement.

 

[Indiana80]

I restore a lot of wheel hubs. only 1 in ~200 that I had to replace. It was the one above, where metal so beat on it ripped the steel. Which was from improper brake rotor replacement.
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This is all very helpful information. Thank you! It is hard to find, where I live, good shops that pride themselves on working on these old trucks. So, about 6 or 7 years ago, I started doing a lot of the work myself. There is some satisfaction in repairing these trucks and getting things working like they should. If I was 30 or 35 years younger, I would have tried to make it my career.

 

[GTV]

Thanks for that @2001LC. I'm getting ready to service the front wheel bearings in the Unicorn, likely for the first time since you did them almost 90k miles ago.

 

[Indiana80]

I restore a lot of wheel hubs. only 1 in ~200 that I had to replace. It was the one above, where metal so beat on it ripped the steel. Which was from improper brake rotor replacement.
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So the inner and outer races are pretty easy to drive out with a brass drift?

Also, I know I have a buggered up hub bolt (AKA wheel stud) so I’ll probably replace that while there. Hammer the old one out and brass hammer the new one in?

 

[Patassa]

So the inner and outer races are pretty easy to drive out with a brass drift?

Also, I know I have a buggered up hub bolt (AKA wheel stud) so I’ll probably replace that while there. Hammer the old one out and brass hammer the new one in?

I've only done 2, I wouldn't say "pretty easy" but long brass drift, a good method of holding the hub steady, and some patience and they'll come out.