What Tools and Parts to Carry on the Trail

[Taco2Cruiser]

We park the trailer at a campground for a couple days and then go explore each day. My kids are 11, 9, and 5. We did some 6-8 mile hikes in Yellowstone, Badlands, and the Black Hills last year with ~2000' elevation changes, so in a pinch we could hike maybe 10 miles depending on the terrain. As the kids get older and I get more comfortable with the limits of the LC (and continue the build) we'll go father.

As far as $ goes, I expect to eventually drop $ on a winch, bumpers, lift, and lots of gear over the next couple years, but for the time being I'm trying to be "efficient" in what I pick up. Let's say my budget is $300-500. For instance, @mcgaskins just mentioned the Maxsa traction mats, which I had considered over Maxtrax as well. Since I'm unlikely to use them more than once or twice on this trip (and possibly not at all), if they're moderately sturdy and will last a few uses they might be a good compromise for someone like me who is starting out. If I spend $325 on Maxtrax, that really limits what other useful stuff I could procure.

So no snow or deep mud, and probably little deep sugar sand/silt?

A good 30' snatch strap, a couple shackles, and a small folding shovel.

Save your money for those items you talked about earlier.

 

[mattv94]

The TREDs are only $75 more. Granted that's a 62% for increase in price. I might just buy a set of each.

It's been my experience that treds are awful. In the same span of time of owning my maxtrax a few buddies have gone though 2-3 sets of treds.

 

[TonyP]

Who knows. People have circumnavigated the globe in a vehicle on far less equipment.

The best way to determine what you need is going out and finding out.

 

[mattv94]

That's true. If you plan on using them maybe 2-3 times a year then most brands will suffice.

 

[Rigger]

The best way to determine what you need is going out and finding out.

This.

 

[mcgaskins]

I was looking at those as well. I'm assuming you haven't used them yet. Do they seem fairly sturdy? (i.e. do you think you could bridge with them in a pinch?) How'd you mount them to the roof rack?

I haven't had a need to use them yet, but they seem quite nice particularly for the cost. If I was going on a long expedition style trek, I would consider the more expensive option, but for my needs considering I have lots of other recovery gear including a winch, it's not worth the added expense. To mount them to my rack, I just used the universal eye bolts from Front Runner with orange ratcheting straps. I figured it would be easier to access quickly and mount/dismount, and again I'm not particularly worried about them getting stolen because of the cost. As mentioned above, sometimes the really secure mounts make it not very easy to mount/dismount and the locking solution costs a decent bit more than eyelets and straps. Here's a zoomed in pic of the roof rack:

 

[Canyonero]

I was looking at those as well. I'm assuming you haven't used them yet. Do they seem fairly sturdy? (i.e. do you think you could bridge with them in a pinch?) How'd you mount them to the roof rack?

I've had my "buddy helpers" for a few years now and I have used them to death. Quite literally, they are toast. Part of that was probably my learning curve on not spinning my wheels on them, positioning them right, etc. But I can't really imagine MaxTrax being an order of magnitude better - I think MaxTrax just have brand recognition. The ROI probably isn't there.

In any case, check out the Amazon reviews, the buddy helpers are very good. I just bungy mine to the roof; easy on and easy off. They are one of my first "go to" pieces of recovery gear when I get stuck in the snow. I'll be grabbing a new set here shortly.

 

[Markuson]

I've had my "buddy helpers" for a few years now and I have used them to death. Quite literally, they are toast. Part of that was probably my learning curve on not spinning my wheels on them, positioning them right, etc. But I can't really imagine MaxTrax being an order of magnitude better - I think MaxTrax just have brand recognition. The ROI probably isn't there.

In any case, check out the Amazon reviews, the buddy helpers are very good. I just bungy mine to the roof; easy on and easy off. They are one of my first "go to" pieces of recovery gear when I get stuck in the snow. I'll be grabbing a new set here shortly.

I don't know about those units, but I've personally compared with Smitty tracks next to Maxtrax, and wow. No comparison. The maxtrax weigh a TON, and seem to have a grain to them--maybe containing fiber rather than just plastic(?)...where the smitty was thin, bendy, and seemed brittle. Totally different. As for other companies...I don't know.

 

[Canyonero]

I was worried about getting a cheaper brand for the same reason, but mine have held up really well and never snapped or otherwise failed me during use.

On Amazon, they have nearly the same rating (4.5 vs. 5 stars) and the "escaper buddy" product has 105 reviews vs. 20 for the Maxtrax MKII's - what gets me is the 3x price difference. I mean, it's plastic... and if the escaper buddy's work ... hard to justify spending 3x as much. Just my $.02!

Amazon.com: maxtrax

But I also have a Yeti cooler and I'm pretty sure the Ozark Trail knockoff at Walmart (which in examining it, it has no discernible difference!) would have been a better purchase.

I have no problem spending money on things where I believe there is a measurable return, and recovery gear (or outdoor stuff, generally) is really an interesting domain in which to have that conversation! Do you always get what you pay for?

Side note on spending money vs. going cheap: my brother and I each bought SxS units recently - we were going to both buy Honda Pioneer 1000's. Well, he went cheap and bought a new Kawasaki Teryx instead. The first really tough trail we've done was this past weekend and it was night and day in terms of ability between the two units, with the new Honda Pioneer 1000 proving itself as having demonstrable advantages (directly related to its higher price tag), while on paper they should have both been pretty comparable in terms of ability.

Sometimes you get what you pay for!

 

[TonyP]

All plastic isn't just plastic. Many various types. But I see your point. Especially since nearly every traction mat will burn the lugs off if you spin the tires on them.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

If we are talking about traction boards and spinning, if you have the money, check out the Tred Pro. It uses two different materials, one for the board itself to be flexible and one for the knobs for the tire to grip on. Plus a lifetime warranty.

I got a couple pairs for free to test and they hold up very well to accidental wheel spin.

They weren't brittle like the older Tred 1100. They are more like Maxtrax in the flexibility side.

I know some people get really into brand loyalty and don't like hearing products they spent their hard earned money or research time on, but like all things Smittybilt, they are destined for the dumpster. I broke a pair pretty quickly, but it didn't surprise any of us, it's smittybilt.

The problem I have with these traction boards is that the cheap one only last when they are more supported, like sand. But I have found that in lose of traction situations that let these cheap boards survive, a little shovel work and slow driving frees the vehicle anyway. So I haven't found a reason to dedicate money on them outside of snow. And then, snow chains have been better for me than traction boards, purely because you can keep moving versus having to keep building your path.

 

[TonyP]

Some people have different needs, expectations and budgets. For some, Harbor Frought works, others Craftsman, others Matco. Weigh your options. For the most part, in this world, price has a direct correlation to quality. Certainly not always, but usually.

 

[Canyonero]

If we are talking about traction boards and spinning, if you have the money, check out the Tred Pro. It uses two different materials, one for the board itself to be flexible and one for the knobs for the tire to grip on. Plus a lifetime warranty.

I got a couple pairs for free to test and they hold up very well to accidental wheel spin.

They weren't brittle like the older Tred 1100. They are more like Maxtrax in the flexibility side.

I know some people get really into brand loyalty and don't like hearing products they spent their hard earned money or research time on, but like all things Smittybilt, they are destined for the dumpster. I broke a pair pretty quickly, but it didn't surprise any of us, it's smittybilt.

The problem I have with these traction boards is that the cheap one only last when they are more supported, like sand. But I have found that in lose of traction situations that let these cheap boards survive, a little shovel work and slow driving frees the vehicle anyway. So I haven't found a reason to dedicate money on them outside of snow. And then, snow chains have been better for me than traction boards, purely because you can keep moving versus having to keep building your path.

Agree with this. Snow is the one place I have ever needed/used traction boards. But chains wouldn't work in the places I've been stuck, because I'm always high-centered. The traction boards work to get the vehicle up and over the snow to a place where you have traction.

Plus, they look cool on my roof.

Reviews for the Maxtrax at $325 on Amazon also say people easily burn off the plastic nubs. Plastic is not all the same, for sure, but spinning wheels on a 7,000 lb vehicle is a pretty good equalizer.

 

[Markuson]

Plus, they look cool on my roof.

Haha! You get points for admitting that...

And ya...any board that's not metal can melt. An eBay guy sells metal replacement nubs for maxtrax, but he charges what seems like crazy $! Seems like there's gotta by a comparable, but CHEAP alternative to these. Basically short bolts with funky nubs for a head. If I find something similar at the every-screw-you-can-think-of store nearby...I may just pre-install them on my non-burned boards...

The problem is... If you every help some stranger with your boards? -There's a VERY good chance they'll melt them due to spin...

Here's that eBay link. Gotta be an alternative to these...
Maxtrax Replacement Teeth Repair Kit - 12 replacement studs; Fix your Maxtrax | eBay

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Agree with this. Snow is the one place I have ever needed/used traction boards. But chains wouldn't work in the places I've been stuck, because I'm always high-centered. The traction boards work to get the vehicle up and over the snow to a place where you have traction.

Plus, they look cool on my roof.

Reviews for the Maxtrax at $325 on Amazon also say people easily burn off the plastic nubs. Plastic is not all the same, for sure, but spinning wheels on a 7,000 lb vehicle is a pretty good equalizer.

Humm, interesting, I didn't think of the lifting the vehicle up because of being high centered. I just try and stay away from situations like that, I might be wrong in think this, but I treat snow like mud, like deep gumbo mud. And with that I'm dragging axles or frame crossmember. So winching is my go to. Maybe I need to try what you are saying.

This is where I'm at with my rear bumper, I have a plan to put traction boards by the spare tire, but then I can't think of when I have ever wanted them, so I keep going back to not adding them. Sometimes I feel products get made, and then we think we need them, instead of we need something and the market produces it. But I like your reason for popping the truck up before trying to move forward, I've only seen traction boards still not let certain components get up high enough, but that wasn't on a 200, and the 200 has a much smoother underbelly.

Now I want to go get stuck!

But back to the spare parts and recovery... @linuxgod, if you know you will have a winch, and this up coming trip is going on firmer or at least a couple rocks on the trail paths, I still think you sound save your money for future big recovery items.

Besides, isn't crawl control really good for freeing vehicle from sand? Honestly asking, I haven't used it in sand yet, just loose rock and hill climbs.

 

[Markuson]

Hey @Taco2Cruiser... here is a long thought I was gonna post when there was disagreement over skill vs. getting stuck, etc.

It includes the high center reasoning. See what you think (sorry so wordy)...


I'll have a go at a scenario ANYONE can get stuck in--whether you're mentally challenged (like me )...or an expert--and why I prefer to have multiple recovery options available. See what u think, @Taco2Cruiser and others.

First: I'm no recovery expert. Not by ANY stretch. But here goes...

California terrain can dramatically change...withing FEET...so that even on a short run, it can be unpredictable. Age-old sliding fault-lines, subduction zones, and former ocean floor deposits...along with dry, but sometimes deceivingly treacherous lake beds, river beds and even swamps can be fiendishly disguised on top as something else. These weird mixtures can pop up in the deserts and even some mountains. The water table can runs in bizarre ways here, meaning oddball areas can carry a lot of moisture for a very long time...right next to bone-dry sand or solid rock.

When out exploring (off-trail or off-road)...you are, by definition, NOT in familiar territory...so while you can sorta know your terrain, hidden stuff can lurk.

First, an example from mountain biking in coastal and inland California.

On a mountain bike... You can be flying down dirt or decomposed granite descent with traction to spare...then suddenly you find a patch of TRUE, FLUFFY, DEEP SAND...then sand/dirt...then all dirt...then solid granite...sandstone...clay...mud...roots...and everything in-between. Or...You can be gliding over sand just fine, and then you hit a patch that hides wet CLAY that's like chocolate pudding--distinctly different without discernible visual warning.

-If you happen to find this in a turn, you can easily lose control even as a skilled rider.
-If you find it in a heavy vehicle? You're going DEEP (again...ask me how I know! haha).

4-Wheel EXPLORING (not on trails/roads):
Sometimes it's fun to just go exploring--meaning you can't know the "trail" because it isn't a trail. In the local deserts near me, you can do that and there aren't always dedicated paths or roads. Some sand lies tightly together forming a nice, firmly-packed base that you can easily ride on top of. -Especially true where sand is near vegetation, and therefore mixed with dirt/organic stuff, and holds together nicely. But nearby, and sometimes without warning, there can be areas that are either suddenly hidden mud just beneath a seemingly solid surface, or true sand (no dirt/organic stuff mixed in) that stays incredibly "fluffy" and bogs super easily. Same with snow.
--Making recovery more "interesting..." -these are often found where there are no recovery anchors.
-No trees...no boulders...or other anchor points.


If you get quickly bogged to where you sink into mud or super-loose sand, be on your belly in less than a second--even without rookie tire spinning your way down deep...so that even aired-down tires have nothing to grab--because belly deep, vehicle weight is off the tires--meaning they don't spread to create more traction.

This could be called a MISTAKE...but it can happen to rookies and veterans alike.
-Poop happens, ya know? You try to avoid it, and try to be smart, but sometimes if you are breaking new ground while exploring (pun intended ), you can't always outsmart hidden "traps."

Anyway... If you end up instantly belly-deep...with tires that have nothing to grab...nowhere to winch from...
...MaxTrax can be helpful. Especially if you have one for each tire, or connect them to create the floatation even aired-down tires failed to adequately create. One helpful thing about Maxtrax or other units is that you don't just create traction under the tire, but a path of traction that can give you the little bit of momentum you need to keep going beyond the track.

Soooo... Options are good in my book.

--Even the dangerous Hi-Lift can be attached to a WHEEL so that instead of lifting the entire vehicle beyond suspension droop to get crud under a tire...you simply compress the suspension to get under there. You can even use one maxtrax as a hi-lift base until you jack up enough to get an entire tax under a tire. By compressing the suspension, you aren't actually lifting the vehicle to get under it. -Just compressing on corner of your suspension at a time.


-An airbag can work to lift the entire side of a truck, but it doesn't compress the suspension like a hi-lift attached to a wheel...so you gotta lift clear past full droop before you get under the tire.


My take is...why not take options along?
-A winch...Maxtrax...hi-lift...
-Snatch and tow straps are always with me too, but only help if there's another vehicle...and sometimes buddies aren't around. Sometimes winches can't be anchored. Even experts can get caught. So options are a good thing in my thinking. Easy to carry this stuff, so why not?

Watch-u-tink, mang?"

 

[TonyP]

Metal studs in maxtrax sound like a great way to turn your KO2s into rubbery confetti.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Hey @Taco2Cruiser... here is a long thought I was gonna post when there was disagreement over skill vs. getting stuck, etc.

It includes the high center reasoning. See what you think (sorry so wordy)...


I'll have a go at a scenario ANYONE can get stuck in--whether you're mentally challenged (like me )...or an expert--and why I prefer to have multiple recovery options available. See what u think, @Taco2Cruiser and others.

First: I'm no recovery expert. Not by ANY stretch. But here goes...

California terrain can dramatically change...withing FEET...so that even on a short run, it can be unpredictable. Age-old sliding fault-lines, subduction zones, and former ocean floor deposits...along with dry, but sometimes deceivingly treacherous lake beds, river beds and even swamps can be fiendishly disguised on top as something else. These weird mixtures can pop up in the deserts and even some mountains. The water table can runs in bizarre ways here, meaning oddball areas can carry a lot of moisture for a very long time...right next to bone-dry sand or solid rock.

When out exploring (off-trail or off-road)...you are, by definition, NOT in familiar territory...so while you can sorta know your terrain, hidden stuff can lurk.

First, an example from mountain biking in coastal and inland California.

On a mountain bike... You can be flying down dirt or decomposed granite descent with traction to spare...then suddenly you find a patch of TRUE, FLUFFY, DEEP SAND...then sand/dirt...then all dirt...then solid granite...sandstone...clay...mud...roots...and everything in-between. Or...You can be gliding over sand just fine, and then you hit a patch that hides wet CLAY that's like chocolate pudding--distinctly different without discernible visual warning.

-If you happen to find this in a turn, you can easily lose control even as a skilled rider.
-If you find it in a heavy vehicle? You're going DEEP (again...ask me how I know! haha).

4-Wheel EXPLORING (not on trails/roads):
Sometimes it's fun to just go exploring--meaning you can't know the "trail" because it isn't a trail. In the local deserts near me, you can do that and there aren't always dedicated paths or roads. Some sand lies tightly together forming a nice, firmly-packed base that you can easily ride on top of. -Especially true where sand is near vegetation, and therefore mixed with dirt/organic stuff, and holds together nicely. But nearby, and sometimes without warning, there can be areas that are either suddenly hidden mud just beneath a seemingly solid surface, or true sand (no dirt/organic stuff mixed in) that stays incredibly "fluffy" and bogs super easily. Same with snow.
--Making recovery more "interesting..." -these are often found where there are no recovery anchors.
-No trees...no boulders...or other anchor points.


If you get quickly bogged to where you sink into mud or super-loose sand, be on your belly in less than a second--even without rookie tire spinning your way down deep...so that even aired-down tires have nothing to grab--because belly deep, vehicle weight is off the tires--meaning they don't spread to create more traction.

This could be called a MISTAKE...but it can happen to rookies and veterans alike.
-Poop happens, ya know? You try to avoid it, and try to be smart, but sometimes if you are breaking new ground while exploring (pun intended ), you can't always outsmart hidden "traps."

Anyway... If you end up instantly belly-deep...with tires that have nothing to grab...nowhere to winch from...
...MaxTrax can be helpful. Especially if you have one for each tire, or connect them to create the floatation even aired-down tires failed to adequately create. One helpful thing about Maxtrax or other units is that you don't just create traction under the tire, but a path of traction that can give you the little bit of momentum you need to keep going beyond the track.

Soooo... Options are good in my book.

--Even the dangerous Hi-Lift can be attached to a WHEEL so that instead of lifting the entire vehicle beyond suspension droop to get crud under a tire...you simply compress the suspension to get under there. You can even use one maxtrax as a hi-lift base until you jack up enough to get an entire tax under a tire. By compressing the suspension, you aren't actually lifting the vehicle to get under it. -Just compressing on corner of your suspension at a time.


-An airbag can work to lift the entire side of a truck, but it doesn't compress the suspension like a hi-lift attached to a wheel...so you gotta lift clear past full droop before you get under the tire.


My take is...why not take options along?
-A winch...Maxtrax...hi-lift...
-Snatch and tow straps are always with me too, but only help if there's another vehicle...and sometimes buddies aren't around. Sometimes winches can't be anchored. Even experts can get caught. So options are a good thing in my thinking. Easy to carry this stuff, so why not?

Watch-u-tink, mang?"

Man... how 'bout them Cubs!

No it makes a lot of sense, I totally get where you are coming from, but I just haven't seen someone instantly get buried in sand, there has always been some excessive tire spinning to burry the vehicle.

With vegitation growing in the desert, creating silty pockets, I found that lining up your wheel strait and planning your track can keep you moving. I don't want to come off as a know it all, so when I use an example, it's because I saw it happen, but I admit that variables can always change.

So when running armored gun trucks of 15,000 lbs plus more gear than any off us can think off, we could still maintain movement under the softest, silty tall dunes I've ever seen. We just had to get out and test the terrain.

Even in my Ford Transit 2wd work van, we are always taking that where most of us wouldn't take a 200, but getting out, studying your path, then taking the straitest way to the next firm spot and doing it again works.

I don't know man, but at the end of the day, this is supposed to be fun, I'm sorry if I come off harsh sometimes, I'm working on that. I just wish I could wheel with all you guys, pretty great group here, and regardless of equipment bought/used, getting stuck or not, it sure would be fun to hang out with you guys, that goes for everyone.

 

[Markuson]

Man... how 'bout them Cubs!

No it makes a lot of sense, I totally get where you are coming from, but I just haven't seen someone instantly get buried in sand, there has always been some excessive tire spinning to burry the vehicle.

With vegitation growing in the desert, creating silty pockets, I found that lining up your wheel strait and planning your track can keep you moving. I don't want to come off as a know it all, so when I use an example, it's because I saw it happen, but I admit that variables can always change.

So when running armored gun trucks of 15,000 lbs plus more gear than any off us can think off, we could still maintain movement under the softest, silty tall dunes I've ever seen. We just had to get out and test the terrain.

Even in my Ford Transit 2wd work van, we are always taking that where most of us wouldn't take a 200, but getting out, studying your path, then taking the straitest way to the next firm spot and doing it again works.

I don't know man, but at the end of the day, this is supposed to be fun, I'm sorry if I come off harsh sometimes, I'm working on that. I just wish I could wheel with all you guys, pretty great group here, and regardless of equipment bought/used, getting stuck or not, it sure would be fun to hang out with you guys, that goes for everyone.

Oh ya! Go Cubs!

When this happened? It was literally INSTANT.

No spin...just down I went until my belly was touching. Obviously, attempts to get out only caked more endless chocolate... and frankly, this one was so bad that I doubt trax would have done it (didn't have them at the time).

But something just shy of this bad...has happened to me before where I used several dead wood branches to get out...which are like nature's maxtrax.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

When this happened? It was literally INSTANT.

No spin...just down I went. But frankly, this one was so bad that I doubt tracks would have done it (didn't have them at the time).

View attachment 1457479

But something just shy of this bad...has happened to me before where I used several dead wood branches to get out...which are like nature's maxtrax.

I always love it when you post that picture. You sir win, I agree that traction board wouldn't have helped, but the other instance you talked about, yea maybe the traction board is the best tool, very interesting stuff, makes me rethink mounting some boards to my rear bumper.

But seriously man, stop wheeling in quicksand! But I totally want you to take me to where you wheel, because it looks awesome, and looks like nothing I've seen either, which is cool. I love the unknown.