Towing with a 200-series Toyota Land Cruiser (2 Viewers)

[linuxgod]

Just wanted to share our experiences towing recently. Stock 2016 which has the 8 speed transmission. We have a new 6k lbs camper and the LC is our new (to us) tow vehicle. We were in a suburban previously.

My old trailer was 5000# and was pretty low - about 9' tall including the low profile A/C. I got as low as 6.5 MPG last summer when cruising at ~72-73 on the highway through Nebraska and into Denver. Most of the time we averaged ~68-70 and got about 7.5. I have found that I typically lose about 1mpg for every 5 mph over 55, i.e.

10.5mpg @ 55
9.5mpg @ 60
8.5mpg @65
7.5mpg @ 70
6.5 mpg @ 75

We drove 1500 miles home and I did the math last year. @ 75 mph fuel cost me about $575 and it was 20 hours to get home vs $350 @ 55 mph and spending 27:15 in the car. I decided it was worth ~$225 to spend 7 hours less in the truck with 3 kids. (In the end we probably averaged 65-68 though).

I haven't got it on a scale but my new(er) Lance is probably closer to 5500# and is about 18" taller. I'm curious to see how it affects my mileage.

FWIW I agree the rear springs are soft. There are 2 solutions:

1. Install a set of helper air bags, which when inflated to the max 35psi will stiffen the rear.
2. Install heavier springs. The factory are 170#/in. There are heavier options out there available with no lift. My "light duty" rears are 240#/in with a ~1" lift and even w/o the airbags inflated they definitely improve the ride when towing.

 

[stubble88]

What are some of your temps when towing? Going up a grade at about 50mph. 4th gear Towing around 6000# my a/t temps reached 241 degrees.

 

[coleAK]

My camper is 6500-7000lbs loaded. I have to be diligent with MPG as I don’t like hauling a bunch of fuel and there are many parts of AK where there is 100-150+ miles between gas stations.
On our roads I get 8-9 mpg running 55-60 and that drops to 5-6 mpg running ~65mph. I also get ~6 mpg running 25-35mph on the “highways” when we go north of Fairbanks but when we head that way I take 30-50 gallons of fuel.

 

[linuxgod]

What are some of your temps when towing? Going up a grade at about 50mph. 4th gear Towing around 6000# my a/t temps reached 241 degrees.

what do you use to monitor? Is 241F the pan temp or the torque converter temp? The TC will get hot; I'd be primarily concerned with the pan temp.

I had a 5000# trailer last year. I've never seen 240F even in the mountains. I used to cruise at 70-75mph and the temp is about 200F (196-203) in 4th gear. Heading up to Grand Mesa, which was 10,000', revving in 1st gear I pushed 225-230F last year for a few minutes. Through the mountains west of Denver I was running in 2nd/3rd at times at 40-50mph and IIRC I was probably 210-212F.

I haven't watched my new trailer too closely since I haven't done a ton of highway driving with it, but I expect it to be similar.

 

[stubble88]

Ok. I’m using OBD Fusion. And I just noticed two a/t temp gauges. I was looking at one. I also notice the temp would quickly drop down to about 190 when leveling out. So hopefully that’s the TC temp.

 

[TeCKis300]

I'm right over 7000lbs loaded. The airstream likely has a bit less frontal area with the rounded corners. I do have solar panels up top and the trailer is lifted 3" which puts it on par with just about every other trailer out there as AS are notoriously low from the factory.

I average just over 11mpg cruising at 55mph. High 10s @60 and ~10mpg at 65mph. I don't really go much faster than that as efficiency drops precipitously.

If I'm not going particularly far, I may find a faster big rig and just set myself behind him. I can eek another ~1 mpg that way without being aggressive and following too close.

 

[linuxgod]

A/T tires are what kills MPG for me. I drove from Chicago to Baltimore and back over Memorial Day, and averaged about 12.5MPG. In fairness I *averaged* 66MPH (including the first 20 miles through the city of Chicago) and did the 720 mile trip in under 11 hours, with cruise control set at ~82MPH much of the way.

If I had OEM Bridgestone tires I likely would get 9.5-10MPG crusing around 70MPH. With the Nittos I get about 7-8MPG at the same speed, depending on terrain/wind/etc.

 

[coleAK]

I have KO2s and got noticibly better MPG when I had the stock tires as well. And here in AK there are very few stretches of road Straight or flat enough to set the cruse control.

 

[LALC]

Yep, at 65mph average with flat road, I was getting

OEM
No tow: 18mpg
Tow 2k small luggage trailer: 15mpg

After getting KO2's in OEM size
No tow: 17mpg
Tow 2k small luggage trailer: 14mpg

After adding Frontrunner Roof Rack
No tow: 16.5mpg
Tow 2k small luggage trailer: 13.5mpg

These "mods" or small changes to the vehicle are costing much more than the initial up-front purchase/install costs. I'm not excited to see what my mpg is going to be when I get a bull bar and winch.

 

[linuxgod]

FWIW as @Taco2Cruiser is quick to point out, regearing may very well he’ll mileage, especially if you’ve upsized your tires. I will say that running 75mph last weekend on a long trip I was getting the same or slightly better (by a couple tenths) in 4th or 5th hear than in 6th (on heavy 34s mind you) and that was going through the Ohio and Indiana flatlands.

I’m not ready to regear yet but I suspect my mileage will improve a bit when I do. I think the reason mileage is better is that with stock gears you have to lay into the throttle to keep the truck at speed, and that more than offsets the additional fuel used at higher rpms

 

[cru1s3r]

I’ve read through the entire thread, but wanted to know if my LC would be able to safely tow a 5,700 Lb GVWR trailer (~23’ in length), with only an anti-sway, WD hitch (BlueOx) and Tekonsha brake controller...and no other “adds” (i.e. upgraded suspension, air bags, etc). The trailer I’m looking at is the Lance 1985 Lance 1985 Travel Trailer - Your private oasis features full width aft bathroom. and the only non-stock item on my LC thus far are 285/65R18 K02’s. I know the towing capacity of my LC is considerably higher than this number, but there’s the safety element to consider. Yes, I’ll get the mirror extenders mentioned earlier, but that’ll likely be all. Or, am I concerned about nothing, and am good to go? Would it have any trouble with mountain passes? Thanks for any advice you can pass along!

 

[stubble88]

I’ve read through the entire thread, but wanted to know if my LC would be able to safely tow a 5,700 Lb GVWR trailer (~23’ in length), with only an anti-sway, WD hitch (BlueOx) and Tekonsha brake controller...and no other “adds” (i.e. upgraded suspension, air bags, etc). The trailer I’m looking at is the Lance 1985 Lance 1985 Travel Trailer - Your private oasis features full width aft bathroom. and the only non-stock item on my LC thus far are 285/65R18 K02’s. I know the towing capacity of my LC is considerably higher than this number, but there’s the safety element to consider. Yes, I’ll get the mirror extenders mentioned earlier, but that’ll likely be all. Or, am I concerned about nothing, and am good to go? Would it have any trouble with mountain passes? Thanks for any advice you can pass along!

I hope so. We just bought a 29' about 6500# GVWR. WD hitch, no other mods. But I am wanting a 2" lift possible heavy duty. But not sure yet.

 

[coleAK]

If you read throigh it all the general consensious is yes. I tow a 22’ GVW 6800 lbs with my stock 13’ LX570. 5-10k miles a summer all over Alaska. I use a Curt break controller and a husky round bar WD hitch. Did my 3/4 ton diesel pull it better? of course it did. But the LX does just fine.

 

[Dan Higgins]

I tow a Lance 2285. Same KO2s as you. ProPride hitch. Upgraded suspension/lift. I stay at 65mph or less. I drive a lot in the mountains of Colorado. And when descending I goes as slow as I need to to control the speed with engine braking. I use the Tekonsha brake controller. My hitch weight is borderline and heavier than the 1985. I read recently about a Lance 1995 owner who had sway issues - he loaded his trailer too light in the front. You may want to check out the Lance Owners of America forum.

 

[coleAK]

While I have never had sway problems I notice a trend toward sway when I have ~160 lbs (4 bikes+rack) or 200+ lbs of cooler and fish on the rear bumper and if I don’t have the front compartment loaded. That is fairly rare though, I’m pretty much at capacity every time we go out. I also have KO2s but in 275/55 r20.

 

[Dan Higgins]

You may be interested in checking this out. It is a "test" of the 2016 LC towing a 5700# trailer. The "hill" they are using is on I70 west of Denver where it goes through the Eisenhower Tunnel and drops into Summit County. I'll be driving this road in a couple of weeks as we move our trailer to Grand Junction, CO for its new permanent storage location. A couple comments:

• I am far more interested in the downhill test. Downhill is where things can go sideways real fast. Uphill is primarily about pulling power. Mostly a matter of engine and transmission. But downhill is about a 6000# vehicle being held back by another 6,000# vehicle and controlled in the process.
• In the opening part of the video they do the downhill test. Their metric is sort of weird. Interesting but weird the way they do it. What they test is how many times you need to use the brake (LC and trailer I hope as you should never tow a trailer this heavy without trailer brakes. Braking is a BIG deal in the mountains. This is because of the potential for the brakes overheating. This is why you see all the warnings for trucks to check their brakes. In this test they start with a speed of 50mph which is more than enough down this 7 mile, 7% grade. 3 lanes. Plenty of traffic. Gentle curves. When the weight of trailer and LC bring the combination up to 60mph they use the brakes to bring it back down to 50mph.
• The big FAIL! The big mistake on this demo will be clear if you watch the information display in the console. They are keeping the LC in Drive! Drive with a D! What? You expect an 8-speed transmission with overdrive to apply effective engine braking in D? They didn't even read the owners manual which clearly states that you should use S mode set no higher than S6 when towing. And that you should lower that as required to use engine braking to manage the speed. I have gone down a number of 7% grades and I can do so with almost no towing by setting the transmission to S3 or even S2 if necessary. On this grade I will also probably keep it around 35-40 (the speed limit is 65) simply due to the amount of traffic and the length of the grade. Bottom line is that these guys didn't know how to drive an LC!
• That said, it was encouraging to see someone who didn't know what they were doing and in fact were doing it wrong still get down this pretty significant grade.

Here is the link:

 

[Dan Higgins]

BTW, for those of you who may be towing beyond the flatlands I have found the following book very useful for planning routes. It was written by a former trucker who almost lost it many years ago as he descended the grade from Flagstaff to Phoenix. His brakes overheated. So he created this book that describes a huge number of passes throughout the western US. They are arranged by state with a decent map to show the general location of each "pass". Then there is a description of the pass, first with the descent from one side and then with the other. Some of the information on signage may get out of date but the information about the roads themselves will not change. % grades, length of grades (and sections of grades), location of curves, location of emergency bail outs for truckers, etc.

Mountain Directory West for Truckers, RV and Motorhome Drivers. R & R Publishing.
Mountain Directory for Truckers, RV, and Motorhome Drivers

 

[linuxgod]

I’ve read through the entire thread, but wanted to know if my LC would be able to safely tow a 5,700 Lb GVWR trailer (~23’ in length), with only an anti-sway, WD hitch (BlueOx) and Tekonsha brake controller...and no other “adds” (i.e. upgraded suspension, air bags, etc). The trailer I’m looking at is the Lance 1985 Lance 1985 Travel Trailer - Your private oasis features full width aft bathroom. and the only non-stock item on my LC thus far are 285/65R18 K02’s. I know the towing capacity of my LC is considerably higher than this number, but there’s the safety element to consider. Yes, I’ll get the mirror extenders mentioned earlier, but that’ll likely be all. Or, am I concerned about nothing, and am good to go? Would it have any trouble with mountain passes? Thanks for any advice you can pass along!

Yes you’ll be fine on stock suspension if you have a properly set up WD hitch.

 

[Dan Higgins]

I agree with Geoff. There is no reason for you to have tongue/hitch weight that exceeds the 850# "limit". You don't need anything near that to have a well balanced trailer. And the weight distribution is going to help offset that. As Geoff says, get at good hitch and get it set up right. Just remember that no matter what your setup is - drive smart. Most trailer issues I hear about are people going to fast or suddenly braking (especially on a descent) loading their trailer with too little weight in the front.

 

[cru1s3r]

Guys,

Thanks for the HUGE amount of useful information. I have lots of homework to do... BTW - just ordered a Sherline scale as a start.