This is probably going to be very unliked, but this is just like my opinion man. This is my issue with the LC250 (7 Viewers)

[M1911]

In the various 200's that I have owned, I have never seen 17mpg...let alone lifted with bigger tires, etc.

I can get 17-18 mpg on the highway with highway tires, driving at a steady 70 mph. Mileage drops precipitously as you increase speed, however.

My overall average over about 70,000 miles is 14.5 mpg. I get around 12.5 mpg in the city in stop and go traffic. My fuel economy is tracked with the Fuelly app, using miles driven and gallons pumped to fill the tank.

 

[TWILLY]

What powers your electric car??

Where we are it’s coal and natural gas. Still burning fuel one way or another.

Mine, when I get one, will be powered by my roof solar.

Our house is a solar power plant; it produces more electricity than it uses (and that's without a natural gas connection; all electric).

I need to first learn whether or how an EV battery can double as a house battery to store and then use and sell back during on-peak rates. Rate structures in Arizona increasingly disfavor distributed solar; utilities seem glacially slow to deploy storage.

We purchased solar not for the economy of it, but for the energy civics of it, if you will. We live in a society that requires energy; the responsible thing to do, if one has the means, is to give more than you take.

 

[jayp2]

I don't think there's anything subjective about it. Pollution per kwh in every category is way down from 20 years ago and trending down forward looking.

The same is true for cars. They're faster, last longer, more capable, and pollute less.

The so called "green" sources of energy production are generally speaking short lived, distributed and end up in land fills more often than not vs recycling/reclamation and refitting like traditional centralized power generation. (think solar panels and windmill blades).

Cars are a lot more expensive than in years past and have a ton more plastic and electronic bits that are increasingly difficult and costly to reclaim/re-use

I havent owned a toyota truck/tundra or hilux type truck or diesel VW that hasnt gone 300k or is well on its way there and construction/amount of materials historically has been much simpler/less costly in all regards compared to new construction cars which have a lot more to break.

The new 250 is arguably the most complicated LC made to date and it remains to be seen whether it will see utility/longevity and cost to maintain numbers that even rival G5 4R let alone an early 80's truck with a 22R that could get 25MPG

 

[OSS]

Toyota kinda dug their own grave creating Landcruisers that last forever. My 60 is 38 years old and still runs fine. That’s preposterous.
You know the big wigs in Japan- said no more of that nonsense. 20 years is plenty.

 

[cruiserdan]

I just drove a production GX550. Damn, it's fast. I'd easily own one.

 

[Devils Paw 80]

Regarding the question of whether EV's are "good" for the environment, my cousin just sent me this today. She's about the most "green" person I know, besides a woman in Puna who hasn't owned a car for several years now. I don't know my cousin's source for the figures below as it wasn't included.

"This is a Tesla model Y battery. It takes up all of the space under the passenger compartment of the car. To manufacture it you need:
--12 tons of rock for Lithium (can also be extracted from sea water)
-- 5 tons of cobalt minerals (Most cobalt is made as a byproduct of processing copper and nickel ores. It is the most difficult and expensive material to obtain for a battery.)
-- 3 tons nickel ore
-- 12 tons of copper ore
You must move 250 tons of soil to obtain:
-- 26.5 pounds of Lithium
-- 30 pounds of nickel
-- 48.5 pounds of manganese
-- 15 pounds of cobalt
To manufacture the battery also requires:
-- 441 pounds of aluminum, steel and/or plastic
-- 112 pounds of graphite
The Caterpillar 994A is used to move the earth to obtain the minerals needed for this battery. The Caterpillar consumes 264 gallons of diesel in 12 hours.
The bulk of necessary minerals for manufacturing the batteries come from China or Africa. Much of the labor in Africa is done by children. When you buy an electric car, China profits most.
The 2021 Tesla Model Y OEM battery (the cheapest Tesla battery) is currently for sale on the Internet for $4,999 not including shipping or installation. The battery weighs 1,000 pounds (you can imagine the shipping cost). The cost of Tesla batteries are:
Model 3 -- $14,000+ (Car MSRP $38,990)
Model Y -- $5,000–$5,500 (Car MSRP $47,740)
Model S -- $13,000–$20,000 (Car MSRP $74,990)
Model X -- $13,000+ (Car MSRP $79,990)
It takes 7 years for an electric car to reach net-zero CO2. The life expectancy of the battery is 10 years (average). Only in the last 3 years do you start to reduce your carbon footprint, but then the batteries must be replaced and you lose all gains made.
And finally, my new friend, Michael, made some excellent points: I forgot to mention the amount of energy required to process the raw materials and the amount of energy used to haul these batteries to the U.S. sometimes back and forth a couple of times.
But by all means, get an electric car. Just don't sell me on how awesome you are for the environment. Or for human rights."

 

[krice118]

Emissions requirements are not arbitrary.

As much as I love my v8, we are losing v8's in new Toyota's due to "sane" regulations. They are being replaced with reasonably equivalent and (if not more so) capable powertrains, which in the case of LC250 vs LC200 is almost twice as emissions friendly. Demand is through the roof for Toyota's next generation of vehicles.

My family lives near roads, we drive on roads, we walk on sidewalks right next to roads, and tailpipe emissions from -- vehicles on roads -- are an issue. (Yes, there are also much larger issues - especially overseas)

The fact is, an EV, or hybrid, or turbo'd 4cyl instead of a legacy v8, during operation produces less toxic gasses that end up in the lungs of folks located in the area

I don’t know how you can say a new 250 is twice as emissions friendly. Maybe what comes out of the tailpipe, but it undoubtedly polluted more to make and source a 250 compared to a 200.

A lot of eco warriors ignore the emissions produced to make a hybrid/ EV.

 

[rexington14]

I don’t know how you can say a new 250 is twice as emissions friendly. Maybe what comes out of the tailpipe, but it undoubtedly polluted more to make and source a 250 compared to a 200.

A lot of eco warriors ignore the emissions produced to make a hybrid/ EV.

Yup, that's exactly what I'm saying. And it's not a maybe. I posted the EPA figures earlier here in case you missed it

 

[jdam]

I need to first learn whether or how an EV battery can double as a house battery to store and then use and sell back during on-peak rates. Rate structures in Arizona increasingly disfavor distributed solar; utilities seem glacially slow to deploy storage.

I have a friend who uh, allegedly, bought a crashed Tesla Model S or two and built a pack in his back yard (in a pit of concrete) and is using it to store power/back feed his house. Allegedly.

 

[THF]

Hitting pause on the EPA thread to share a pic of my new ride..

 

[Phillyd2]

Some of us remember the cries about gobal cooling and nuclear power plants being spewed with the same volume and earnestness as the latest version of hysteria. No nukes. No coal. No fossil fuels. It's a wonder some take the risk of getting out of bed in the morning.

The only thing that's hard to believe is that anyone still listens to the nonsensical fear mongering by the latest do gooder crowd trying to control us.

 

[krice118]

Yup, that's exactly what I'm saying. And it's not a maybe. I posted the EPA figures earlier here in case you missed it

Again that’s just tailpipe emissions. That doesn’t take manufacturing emissions into account.

 

[rexington14]

Again that’s just tailpipe emissions. That doesn’t take manufacturing emissions into account.

I know. I never indicated that it did. The context of my entire post was regarding vehicle tailpipe emissions.

 

[Jetboy]

The manufacturing is undoubtedly lower emissions. Toyota has gone to great lengths to cut its manufacturing emissions in the last 20 years. Even the batteries. 1.8kwh of nimh is about 150kg of carbon upstream. Steel is about 1.5lbs of CO2 per lb. Shaving 300lbs of steel would offset the battery. Probably shaved that much weight off the rear axle alone!

Or in the alternative it takes a whopping 18 gallons of gas to break even on the 1.8kwh hybrid battery. That's what - 3rd tank of gas to break even? It's not close.

 

[TWILLY]

The manufacturing is undoubtedly lower emissions. Toyota has gone to great lengths to cut its manufacturing emissions in the last 20 years. Even the batteries. 1.8kwh of nimh is about 150kg of carbon upstream. Steel is about 1.5lbs of CO2 per lb. Shaving 300lbs of steel would offset the battery. Probably shaved that much weight off the rear axle alone!

Or in the alternative it takes a whopping 18 gallons of gas to break even on the 1.8kwh hybrid battery. That's what - 3rd tank of gas to break even? It's not close.

Huge emissions savings in the rear diff.

 

[cruiserdan]

I sorta like big rear ends....

Never mind..

 

[Rednexus]

Some of us remember the cries about gobal cooling and nuclear power plants being spewed with the same volume and earnestness as the latest version of hysteria. No nukes. No coal. No fossil fuels. It's a wonder some take the risk of getting out of bed in the morning.

The only thing that's hard to believe is that anyone still listens to the nonsensical fear mongering by the latest do gooder crowd trying to control us.

Solar, wind, and critical mineral minimg projects are commonly litigated against. With mining, it's often the same NGOs driving decarboization. We can certainly do those things in a responsible way in the US relative to the developing world, but we should have no illusion that we can have our cake and eat it too.

 

[Phillyd2]

Solar, wind, and critical mineral minimg projects are commonly litigated against. With mining, it's often the same NGOs driving decarboization. We can certainly do those things in a responsible way in the US relative to the developing world, but we should have no illusion that we can have our cake and eat it too.

We are still at the point where it’s all an inconvenience or annoyance (you can still drive a gas engine if ….) but if the zealots have their way we are not far away from a very different and I think dangerous world. California now has only one operational nuclear plant in California. EV mandates. Neutered engines. Unrealistic CAFÉ and Emissions regulations Etc….

The frog will soon really start feeling the heat but by then it will be too late.

 

[TWILLY]

Solar, wind, and critical mineral minimg projects are commonly litigated against. With mining, it's often the same NGOs driving decarboization. We can certainly do those things in a responsible way in the US relative to the developing world, but we should have no illusion that we can have our cake and eat it too.

Regardless of the type of energy, federal energy development, and federal agencies, should follow federal laws.

 

[Rednexus]

Regardless of the type of energy, federal energy development, and federal agencies, should follow federal laws.

Laws are followed, but that does not stop NGOs from filing NIMBY lawsuits that are often frivolous and kill projects where tens of millions has been invested in permitting.