Talk me out of a 4Runner TRD Pro (2 Viewers)

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I checked out the 4R Limited before purchasing the LX. Can't remember the model year, 2017?

I recall the 4R interior was incredibly cheap, plain, and nasty. Couldn't stand to pay $40k+ for a vehicle with an interior like that; my old 1991 Integra had a better interior IMHO.
Well we do have crappy looking FAKE wood trim, fake metal trim, plenty of hard plastic, and hollow plastic door handles in our $90k SUV.
 
I get that Toyota is one of the most conservative brands out there by choice but the age of the 4R drivetrain is still a surprise given how sucky it is. We just replaced my wife's RX450h. We might have looked at another one of these but the drive train is the same. And it sucks. Big time. MPG has never been near what they promised. Like 8-10 MPG off, consistently, under all conditions.

We bought an Audi Q7, and while I don't expect the same reliability or lifespan we bought the turbo 4 in hopes of some economy when we don't need the cruiser (we have a 6 hour drive between two residences and we do this drive a lot). Dang if that thing doesn't get 26 MPG hauling on the freeway and over a mountain pass. The 248 hp pulls so much better than I expected (I planned on getting the turbo 6). I was really surprised. I have a VW R with the hot version of this engine (~290 hp) and the 6 speed and I was skeptical of the lower output 4 in the Q7 (the version in the R will accelerate faster than I can shift). It also has a huge gas tank that gives it ~600 mile range.

Point being, Toyota's conservatism is costing them sales. I wanted to buy a Toyota or Lexus and there just isn't anything that made any sense for us to buy given our last 10 years of experience with the brands. They may not care about me, there are lots that will buy a 4R, but they are coasting on reputation at this point.
 
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I get that Toyota is one of the most conservative brands out there by choice but the age of the 4R drivetrain is still a surprise given how sucky it is. We just replaced my wife's RX450h. We might have looked at another one of these but the drive train is the same. And it sucks. Big time. MPG has never been near what they promised. Like 8-10 MPG off, consistently, under all conditions.

We bought an Audi Q7, and while I don't expect the same reliability or lifespan we bought the turbo 4 in hopes of some economy when we don't need the cruiser (we have a 6 hour drive between two residences and we do this drive a lot). Dang if that things doesn't get 26 MPG hauling on the freeway and over a mountain pass. The 248 hp pulls so much better than I expected (I planned on getting the turbo 6). I was really surprised. I have a VW R with the hot version of this engine (~290 hp) and the 6 speed and I was skeptical of the lower output 4 in the Q7 (the version in the R will accelerate faster than I can shift). It also has a huge gas tank that gives it ~600 mile range.

Point being, Toyota's conservatism is costing them sales. I wanted to buy a Toyota or Lexus and there just isn't anything that made any sense for us to buy given our last 10 years of experience with the brands. They may not care about me, there are lots that will buy a 4R, but they are coasting on reputation at this point.
The GTDI motors are nice. They pull so well down low. I have the Ecoboost in my F150 and it pulls like a freight train, as long as it doesnt overheat.

im excited to see what the motor in the new Tundra does
 
Today I managed to find a dealer that had a 4R in stock and allowed a test drive. They actually had two in stock. A ‘21 4R Limited and a ‘16 TRD Pro.

I drove them both. The ‘21 felt pretty solid and I liked how it was slightly smaller than the Land Cruiser. Handled the bumps well though it was a bit stiff and bouncy. The power was nowhere near the LC V8, but it didn’t feel like a total dog either. I felt the engine was just adequate, but nothing to write home about.

The biggest thing I noticed was the lack of headroom in the ‘21 4R. I’m 6’2” and fit comfortably in the LC with the seat in a somewhat high position. But in the 4R I had to put the seat pretty far down to avoid hitting my head on the roofline. Maybe I’d need to adjust the seat better, but my initial impression wasn’t too positive.

I still think the 4R is a cool truck after driving it. Does it compare to the LC? Not at all. But I can see why people like it.
 
The 200 ain’t that much bigger than a 150. It weighs nearly 1500# more. One look underneath and the difference is quite apparent.
 
The 200 ain’t that much bigger than a 150. It weighs nearly 1500# more. One look underneath and the difference is quite apparent.
The Lexus GX is 5100-5300 lbs. the land cruiser is 5700-5800 lbs. I would think the GX is a lot more comparable since it has interior options more in line with the LC than a 4Runner does.
 
I just looked up the specs of the 4R vs the LC. Interestingly the front headroom of the 4R is listed as 39” while that of the LC is listed as 38”.

So am I completely wrong about the 4R feeling more cramped in terms of roof height? Maybe I would need to play around with the seat adjustments more.
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I get that Toyota is one of the most conservative brands out there by choice but the age of the 4R drivetrain is still a surprise given how sucky it is. We just replaced my wife's RX450h. We might have looked at another one of these but the drive train is the same. And it sucks. Big time. MPG has never been near what they promised. Like 8-10 MPG off, consistently, under all conditions.

We bought an Audi Q7, and while I don't expect the same reliability or lifespan we bought the turbo 4 in hopes of some economy when we don't need the cruiser (we have a 6 hour drive between two residences and we do this drive a lot). Dang if that thing doesn't get 26 MPG hauling on the freeway and over a mountain pass. The 248 hp pulls so much better than I expected (I planned on getting the turbo 6). I was really surprised. I have a VW R with the hot version of this engine (~290 hp) and the 6 speed and I was skeptical of the lower output 4 in the Q7 (the version in the R will accelerate faster than I can shift). It also has a huge gas tank that gives it ~600 mile range.

Point being, Toyota's conservatism is costing them sales. I wanted to buy a Toyota or Lexus and there just isn't anything that made any sense for us to buy given our last 10 years of experience with the brands. They may not care about me, there are lots that will buy a 4R, but they are coasting on reputation at this point.

Toyota reliability is in large part due to their conservative design philosophy.

Short of something that rewrites the rules like a Prius I see it as having either cutting edge (or even competitive) efficiency, OR legendary reliability, but you can’t have both.
 
Toyota reliability is in large part due to their conservative design philosophy.

Short of something that rewrites the rules like a Prius I see it as having either cutting edge (or even competitive) efficiency, OR legendary reliability, but you can’t have both.
That’s the question, what do most consumers want today, updated features/ technology or reliability?

In the past Lexus used to be innovative and ultra reliable, for some reason they are not quite the same today.

I am of the opinion, that the timeframe between refreshes or full redesigns is too long at Toyota. The Tundra, Sequoia, Landcruiser and 4Runner should have had full redesigns by now. No new Landcruiser for the US market, but the others are coming. Eventually.........
 
That’s the question, what do most consumers want today, updated features/ technology or reliability?

In the past Lexus used to be innovative and ultra reliable, for some reason they are not quite the same today.

I am of the opinion, that the timeframe between refreshes or full redesigns is too long at Toyota. The Tundra, Sequoia, Landcruiser and 4Runner should have had full redesigns by now. No new Landcruiser for the US market, but the others are coming. Eventually.........
But they can’t keep any of them on the lot……???
 
But they can’t keep any of them on the lot……???
Nobody can at the moment. This is a question of sales, would Toyota sell more units if they updated their lineup more frequently? Or do more people only concern themselves about reliability?

Why can’t be have both more frequent updates and reliability? I have a feeling that long term, technology will not be reliable, but mechanical items will be.

I can’t wait to see the all new Tundra, Sequoia and LX. We’ve waited long enough........
 
But they can’t keep any of them on the lot……???
That doesn’t mean much currently. Heck, just drive by Range Rover and try and find a Range Rover. Sold out! People don’t always make the right decision. 🤣😜
 
I just looked up the specs of the 4R vs the LC. Interestingly the front headroom of the 4R is listed as 39” while that of the LC is listed as 38”.

So am I completely wrong about the 4R feeling more cramped in terms of roof height? Maybe I would need to play around with the seat adjustments more.
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Apparently the extra 3” here and there the LC provides makes a huge difference. When I sit in the grandparents 4Runner I feel cramped, then I get in my LC and feel a little more relaxed. Best thing to do, go sit in a 4Runner for a couple minutes and then jump back into your LC. Numbers on paper don’t tell the whole story. My take is, if you want a runner, go buy one. Asking folks who own 200’s are more likely going to tell you why the 4Runner sucks and if you go on the 4Runner forum section they are going to talk you into one, hoping you’ll buy the one they are trying to get rid of to buy an LC. 🤣😜
 
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Expectations have changed a lot in the last 10 years. The current 4 runner is running on an ancient engine platform that to be honest, is way behind the time.

Most newer cars have gone forced induction, and it makes a huge difference. Better power, better low end, better mpg. Less reliable? Maybe :) but the expectation in 2007 was a v6 with 300hp or a v8 with 400hp.

now pretty much anything over $50k today has a smooth 300-350hp WITH 350-400ftlb torque due to a turbo/sc. Pair that with modern transmissions and timing, and you've got a completely different driving experience.

fortunately for LC owners, the 5.7L v8 is still a tried and true route that matches customer expectations - a big meaty 400hp motor is still being placed in most GM cars today, and it has the right drivability in mind. TBH, it will soon also feel ancient

To me that is the biggest difference. I love toyota. I love the reliability. but damn, they should really find a reliable forced induction platform to keep up with modern expectations
 
Would the 4runner be for fun/beating or just for driving/like the look of it?
 
Would the 4runner be for fun/beating or just for driving/like the look of it?
Great question. It would be for fun, casual driving, occasional off-roading, and just because I like the look of it. Maybe a family suv sometimes, if my wife winds up liking it.
 
Land Cruiser
Hp 371, curb weight 5715; 371/5715=.065
0-60 6.6 secs

4runner
Hp 270, curb weight 4400; 270/4400=.061
0-60 7.7 secs
That is interesting. So, does the 4runner have bad gearing?? I know that the transmission is ancient…isn’t it a 5-speed auto or something? Final/axle ratio is what?
 

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