Rocker Rust Repair Options?

[AimCOtaco]

(started this thread in paint/body but 0 comments and 169 views after a week so here it is)

The paint/rust hiding my big problem finally fell off so ignoring it did not work.

I'm interested in what a proper professional repair would consist of and how long I could expect such a repair to last.

I'm also interested in how I could do this myself but obviously fixing it and fixing it so the rust will not quickly return are two different things. I guess I just can't see a path that won't lead to a quick re-rust of the area given the involvement of multiple sheets, multiple pinch welds, and the wheel well. Obviously I've only performed basic body work and prep, never anything rocker/wheel related.

My goal is to be able to make a decision on where to go with this and be able to interview shops where I may have the work done. My preference is to do as much work as possible and sub out almost nothing. Appearance is secondary to longevity.

So, what would you do? (pics taken while wet after a good wash to remove the evil colorado road de-ice fluid)

 

[Trunk Monkey]

That sucks to see, I was hoping that by the 80 and def. by the 100 Toyota had figured out rocker and quarter panel rust. Where it's at fortunately isn't a complex bend, a body shop should be able to cut it out and bend in new sheet steel. For the time being you could spray it with Rusto and slow it down, but I'd address it soon. Water can spray up into that cavity now and sit in the bottom seam along the whole rocker. After you've got it done I'd suggest fabbing up a simple mudflap for the front to keep rocks and such from spraying that corner. Guess there's one benefit of the OEM running boards . . .

 

[DJWUZJ]

Bummer man. Look on the bright side, if it were a Jeep it would have been like that years ago

Here is the backwoods approach... If it were my truck, I would probably employ my old Jeep trick to this as well.

1. Hop on Eastwoods and pick up some rust converter/encapsulation kit. These things have good reviews - including from the car restoration world.

2. Consider options for a plate/cladding down there along the entire rocker. Jeeps have plenty of options for diamond plate, which 90% of the time is just to cover up rust. Have someone form a strip of anodized aluminum, steel, or whatever along the entire rocker. If you use aluminium, make sure you apply something to the back of it, otherwise it will oxidize/react with the steel.

Even if you go the route of professional repair, you're talking about more money being thrown at a cancer that is very tough to get rid of.

 

[OregonLC]

OE boards and flaps can also trap salty grime...

 

[MtnAddict]

That sucks Andy. Not a good sight and something I am surprised at seeing this soon on a 100. Good luck.

 

[The Mack]

Looks as though that water was trapped inside RP for a long period of time?

 

[MJM]

WOW I am shocked to see that type of rust

My 100 lives in the salt in Ohio and I do not any rust (Yet)

 

[AimCOtaco]

That sucks to see, I was hoping that by the 80 and def. by the 100 Toyota had figured out rocker and quarter panel rust. .... Water can spray up into that cavity now and sit in the bottom seam along the whole rocker. After you've got it done I'd suggest fabbing up a simple mudflap for the front to keep rocks and such from spraying that corner. Guess there's one benefit of the OEM running boards . . .

To be fair I'm at least the third owner and from what I can tell it spent it's early years in Detroit. Yeah, not the most informed purchase I ever made ..it's a long story. Per the design water can get up in there anyway so I'm assuming it was packed with salt after long winters and the salt/dirt mix went to work from the inside out. I think the running boards probably make the area harder to clean but probably do prevent some spray on the rockers. The running boards did a lot to hide the bubbles however so without them I may have found it before I bought it.

I think some kind of fender liner at the front of the well is a good idea and will be accomplished somewhere along the way.

Bummer man. Look on the bright side, if it were a Jeep it would have been like that years ago

Here is the backwoods approach... If it were my truck, I would probably employ my old Jeep trick to this as well.

1. Hop on Eastwoods and pick up some rust converter/encapsulation kit. These things have good reviews - including from the car restoration world.

2. Consider options for a plate/cladding down there along the entire rocker. Jeeps have plenty of options for diamond plate, which 90% of the time is just to cover up rust. Have someone form a strip of anodized aluminum, steel, or whatever along the entire rocker. If you use aluminium, make sure you apply something to the back of it, otherwise it will oxidize/react with the steel.

Even if you go the route of professional repair, you're talking about more money being thrown at a cancer that is very tough to get rid of.

This is pretty much where my head is at. My original thoughts were more in line with classic metal repairs which is why I was asking about how to prevent rust as you could weld in new metal but never get to the back side of the weld to coat and protect the work so it would just rust out much worse the second time. At this point I've been reading about non-metal repair approaches where they are using high strength adhesives and such to attach replacement rockers. I like the non-metal approach because I could cut away almost all of the rust and then protect and encapsulate the metal and then perhaps just bond a small steel patch over the hole. I don't mind the hole, I just don't want it to spread into the floor, pillar, etc..

OE boards and flaps can also trap salty grime...

Yes they sure can, they also make it unlikely that the rocker drains stay clean when washing and they can hide evil rot.

That sucks Andy. Not a good sight and something I am surprised at seeing this soon on a 100. Good luck.

Sucks is the word. It's definitely a spot to watch. This is a 15 year old truck with 200,000+ miles that was not well cared for so I don't expect this to be the norm (at least around here). That said, the amount of salt for safety that is building up on my vehicles makes me want to convert my garage to a heated car wash. Don't know if they're using more and more all the time or if it just stands out with all the cold weather but the snow is gone and everything is still salt white.

Looks as though that water was trapped inside RP for a long period of time?

That's it, or more specifically wet salty dirt was working away in there for a long time.


Thanks for all the feedback, keep it coming and I'll figure out the how, what, and when of this fun side trip.

 

[Wasatch Jay]

My original thoughts were more in line with classic metal repairs which is why I was asking about how to prevent rust as you could weld in new metal but never get to the back side of the weld to coat and protect the work so it would just rust out much worse the second time.

My impression is Fluid Film is pretty well regarded. You could drill a hole in an unobtrusive location on the rocker panel, shoot some Fluid Film in there with an appropiate wand and plug the hole with a plastic plug.

Here's a link to a company that sells all of the above stuff: http://www.kellsportproducts.com/undercoatingguns.html

You could also do the opposite rocker panel, doors, door posts, etc...

 

[DJWUZJ]

l but never get to the back side of the weld to coat and protect the work so it would just rust out much worse the second time.

Check out this stuff: http://www.eastwood.com/internal-frame-coating-w-spray-nozzle.html

According to reviews, people have had good short-term success with this.

Cover it up with some anodized aluminum and you'll never know if its rotting under it

 

[stonepa]

My 100 lives in the salt in Ohio and I do not any rust (Yet)

Mine too, and Minnesota and Alaska before that. Not a single spot on the body other than a tiny bubble at the bottom of the tailgate. Now, the chassis is a different matter altogether

 

[stonepa]

A couple of things:

A buddy in Minnesota has had the rockers on his 91 explorer replaced more times than I can count. It's not cheap but it will look like new when done. The explorers have a huge issue with rusting in this area but he wants to keep it forever - owned it 22 years and counting) so it's worth the effort.

There is a product called POR which is nasty stuff but will instantly convert iron oxide (rust) back into something strong and resembling metal. It works really well and I used it on several Land Rovers. I wouldn't necessarily use it on the body (kind of ugly) but it works extremely well on hitches, frames, etc.

 

[AimCOtaco]

At this point I'm thinking:

-Drop Sliders
-Cut away all the junk metal
-Use the dremel to selectively remove damn near 100% of the rust.
-Protect the exposed metal with top end primer/converter (I have a qt of Chasis Saver, probably use that)
-Make up some sheet metal patches that follow the lines and cover the holes (both sides of of the body are like this)
-Coat the patches both sides with Chasis Saver or similar.
-Use something like this:

http://3mcollision.com/products/adhesives/adhesives-products/3m-panel-bonding-adhesive-38315.html

to adhere the patches in place without welding, thereby preserving the inside of the rockers.

-Paint.
-Fake up some plastic wheel well liners to keep the gravel from punishing the area further.
-Re-install the sliders, try to forget the whole thing, go wheeling.

 

[Manhattan]

Admittedly, I haven't looked under my 100 to see if this will work... But a few years ago, a buddy and I replaced the sheet metal rockers with "built-in rock rails", on my Grand Wagoneer. I have no idea what a shop would've charged.

1. Cut out the outer section of the rockers
2. Notch the inner side of the rockers
3. Fab' the outrigers
4. Fab' the rockers out of box steel

Notched rockers


Outriggers and rock rails fab'ed and mounted


Painted...


They from 20', they look factory

 

[AimCOtaco]

^^^ I like that a lot! Nice Waggy! I don't think mine justify that yet though, maybe for the second time around.

 

[stonepa]

Nice rig!

 

[2001LC]

At this point I'm thinking:

-Drop Sliders
-Cut away all the junk metal
-Use the dremel to selectively remove damn near 100% of the rust.
-Protect the exposed metal with top end primer/converter (I have a qt of Chasis Saver, probably use that)
-Make up some sheet metal patches that follow the lines and cover the holes (both sides of of the body are like this)
-Coat the patches both sides with Chasis Saver or similar.
-Use something like this:

http://3mcollision.com/products/adhesives/adhesives-products/3m-panel-bonding-adhesive-38315.html

to adhere the patches in place without welding, thereby preserving the inside of the rockers.

-Paint.
-Fake up some plastic wheel well liners to keep the gravel from punishing the area further.
-Re-install the sliders, try to forget the whole thing, go wheeling.

Man I hate rust, just one tiny nick in paint or rubberized coating unattended and it grows. Rust is a cancer and must be totally cut out (110%), so your definitely on right track. I use a fiberglass spot prep pen & a pocket microscope to get every speck of rust, when repairing nicks in paint. I often find that little nicks we can see on surface has spread under the paint at least three times the size of the nick.

Determining why and taking step is just as import as how to remove rust and finish body.

Unfortunately as you've pointed out, and happens at most shop; When holes drilled or heat (weld) used it leaves exposed metal on inside unattended only to rust back through. Sand/bead blasting and painting via small holes, chemicals sprays and I'm sure good shop have other ways to treat, but few shop do. Get a reasonable (lifetime in writing) warranty on work, if you use shop.

As a DIY project you may consider fiberglass, easy to work with and will not rust, then top with body filler. Just make sure moisture has escape route away from metal cavity. I've done this to fenders & rockers in past and it really came out sweet. Just take your time, work until perfect in your eyes in any shape you like.

Andy, it's been a long time since I've done body & fender work, but will be happy to help you when weather warms in the spring if you like.

?????? If this rust is from inside cavity out; how did moisture get in and what can we do to block moister form getting in cavity????

Personal I'd like to keep my truck for next 20 plus yrs, but will most likely sell if rust, just like I did last SUV.

 

[Aaron13]

(started this thread in paint/body but 0 comments and 169 views after a week so here it is)

The paint/rust hiding my big problem finally fell off so ignoring it did not work.

I'm interested in what a proper professional repair would consist of and how long I could expect such a repair to last.

I'm also interested in how I could do this myself but obviously fixing it and fixing it so the rust will not quickly return are two different things. I guess I just can't see a path that won't lead to a quick re-rust of the area given the involvement of multiple sheets, multiple pinch welds, and the wheel well. Obviously I've only performed basic body work and prep, never anything rocker/wheel related.

My goal is to be able to make a decision on where to go with this and be able to interview shops where I may have the work done. My preference is to do as much work as possible and sub out almost nothing. Appearance is secondary to longevity.

So, what would you do? (pics taken while wet after a good wash to remove the evil colorado road de-ice fluid)

I would simply cut it out. It is rust, it is cancer. BUT its not a big deal. Nothing about that is going to effect the vehicle ( unless left untreated or allowed to spread) More than likely salt and debris sat there without the ability to properly drain. Cut it out, I doubt anyone will even notice. Spray it with a good anti rust black paint and just monitor it. Its going to set you back around 600 bucks to have the rocker professionally repaired or replaced. But in the mean time it will not be spreading.

 

[AimCOtaco]

Man I hate rust....
Andy, it's been a long time since I've done body & fender work, but will be happy to help you when weather warms in the spring if you like.

?????? If this rust is from inside cavity out; how did moisture get in and what can we do to block moister form getting in cavity????

Personal I'd like to keep my truck for next 20 plus yrs, but will most likely sell if rust, just like I did last SUV.

01, Thanks a lot for the offer, much appreciated and very kind of you. Not sure exactly but I may start cutting into this here in January. I have another DD so I can move slowly in the garage and just do an hour or two here and there. The second side is not quite as bad so overall the job is starting to look easier.
I have a lot of glass and resin if I decide to use some but may just have my sheet metal buddy make me some metal patches to get the shape without having to use fillers but we'll see as I get into it. I think steel may actually be faster using the adhesive method.

That cavity is designed to get wet and drain so this should work if the insides are in good shape other than the affected area (which I will leave in good shape).

I would simply cut it out. It is rust, it is cancer. BUT its not a big deal. Nothing about that is going to effect the vehicle ( unless left untreated or allowed to spread) More than likely salt and debris sat there without the ability to properly drain. Cut it out, I doubt anyone will even notice. Spray it with a good anti rust black paint and just monitor it. Its going to set you back around 600 bucks to have the rocker professionally repaired or replaced. But in the mean time it will not be spreading.

Thanks for your vote, I think the pros are out (too much $$ for too little return), this is going to be an at home DIY job because I want it to last and I don't care much about how it looks. Black is easy to match anyway.

 

[SupraTuRD]

Not to hijack this thread, but I am about to have some body work done on my LC (due to a collision). The body shop feels that the damage isn't worth replacing the rocker, but instead, they want to "pull" the dents by welding studs to pull the dents. Would the heat from the welding burn off the factory corrosion protection "layer" on the inside of the rocker panel? I intend to keep this thing for a while so I need a good repair that's going to last. They mentioned something about stuffing a hose into the cavity and spraying some product with a 360-degree spray head to coat the inside. Does such a thing exist?