Pusher Fan Between Condenser and Trans Cooler?

[Dissent]

I know you are chasing a problem and have replaced your fan clutch. But have you swapped the oil out for heavier?

I got the blue clutch, swapped out the stock 3k oil with 15k oil and advanced the engagement by maybe 1mm. This DIDN'T solve my cooling issue.... But you know what did?

FAN BELTS

The belts looked OK but they were slipping. Once I replaced them with OEM new ones and properly tensioned them the rig cooled down so well that it was actually cooling from 185 to 178 on a 10 mile climb up to 10,000 ft fully loaded at full throttle.

Check your belts.

The engine is cooling great. I modded the clutch and did the temperature tuning per @landmarks direction. It's the AC that stinks. I have all new, properly tensioned belts. The dealer charged the system last and it was fine in the shop. I have a new parallel flow condenser on the way. It should make a good sized improvement. I'd love to have 2 fans on the condenser but may not need both in the future. I can't fit any pullers, just pushers. I have a 150A Sequoia alternator so current draw issues are a thing of the past. That's what made me start looking into cramming another fan in between the trans cooler and condenser.

 

[bug616]

The trans (at least the A442F) does not need any help cooling.

This is incorrect. The A442F when worked hard is prone to overheating and benefits considerably from an auxiliary cooler.

 

[SmokingRocks]

This is incorrect. The A442F when worked hard is prone to overheating and benefits considerably from an auxiliary cooler.

This is literally the first time I've ever seen someone say this in the internet.

It also goes against every thing I've read as well as seen from experience with my; 93' trail snail, my 460,000mi 94' that I sold, my other 93' mall crawler and my original 94' cruiser.

Literally never seen my trans temps go higher than 180. My rig weighs 7,000lbs, it's on stock gears, 35" mud terrains, I live at 5,500' above sea level and constantly haul this crusher over 10,000' passes at full throttle for hours. 180 is the hottest I've ever seen... ever..

EDIT: Sounds like the issue is that the 1HD's didn't have the cooler, just the heat transfer in the bottom tank of the radiator. Everyone running an a442F with a 1FZ, that has measured their temps, laments on how cool the transmissions run.

 

[Dindu Nuffin]

The trans (at least the A442F) does not need any help cooling. If anything they need help warming up. On 100 degree days I never see above 170 degrees on the HOT line going into the cooler.

Under what conditions are you seeing those temps? I've never monitored mine so I have no idea whats normal. Is that in low range going slow on the trail with lots of torque converter slippage, or is that locked up on the highway in 4th?

*edit- Disregard. I didn't read page two before posting.

 

[SmokingRocks]

Every and all conditions. I've never seen over 180, I have bypassed the radiator heat exchanger as well, if I still had that tied in I'm sure my temps would be higher.

 

[Dindu Nuffin]

Hm... that brings up a tangent... I'm about to replace the junk CSF radiator, and had thought about disregarding the cooler/heater in the lower tank. Can I just plug the lines, or would I need to connect the ends of them to make a loop?

Thanks!

 

[SmokingRocks]

connect the lines, if you block them you will block the flow from the pump to the cooler ultimately causing a failure.

I have a mixing valve on mine, in the winter time I have it go to the radiator for help heating up and in the summer I bypass it.

One winter I ran with the radiator tank bypassed (in colorado where its sub 30 for weeks) and there were days the transmission would struggle to get above 100 degrees. Which is too cold.

Fun Fact: the 200 series have automatic mixing valve that do this exact thing based on ambient temps and trans temps.

 

[Dindu Nuffin]

Bypass valve it is, as it snows in the winter and gets upwards of 100°F in the summer here. Thanks for the advice!

 

[SmokingRocks]

I went with an electric 3 way valve with a control nob in the cab. If you go this route I highly suggest wiring a warning LED on your dash to light up if the valve is not fully seated in either position.

This was relatively easy on the valve I used because it uses limit lever switches to stop the servo motor when the valve reaches each position. Similar to this one:

So I just tied in to these switches and ran the wires to two LED's mounted in my cluster, one notes the valve is in summer position, the other notes the valve is in the winter position. If both are off it indicates the valve is in between both positions which could cause pressure to build up and may result in a bad time.

You could just as easily make it so that a light only illuminates if it detects the valve is stuck between the two limit switches.

 

[Dindu Nuffin]

What valve did you use? Funny, I was just looking at electric valves, but the stuff I was seeing is all solenoid operated and I'd rather have a motorized valve that depowers after the selected position is achieved.

 

[SmokingRocks]

Three way Valve

If you go to the description section and scroll down it shows the cut sheet and wiring diagram.
This is how mine is set up

 

[bug616]

EDIT: Sounds like the issue is that the 1HD's didn't have the cooler, just the heat transfer in the bottom tank of the radiator. Everyone running an a442F with a 1FZ, that has measured their temps, laments on how cool the transmissions run.

My apologies, I didn’t know the 1FZ had a cooler from the factory. My statement was based on the U.K. 1HD’s that as you say, only have the heat transfer. For us, overheating the A442F is common in demanding situations like climbing in high range without lockup engaging. Mountain switchbacks often result in the transmission Temp light coming on. Fitting an auxiliary cooler solves this.

 

[Dindu Nuffin]

Awesome. I really appreciate that. Ordered, and added to the list!

 

[flintknapper]

Having a 30-40 amp draw because of a aux fan does no favors for the 80 series alternator that puts out maybe 80 amps above 1200 rpms and less at idle.

The OP has an upgraded alternator (150 amp I believe) but you certainly make a valid point for those with a stock 80 amp unit. IF anyone were to add TWO Aux fans....I would want to wire one of them for manual control. Personally....I think one Aux fan is enough and that additional cooling can be had other ways.

I'd wire the fans to click on when the compressor does, with a thermostat mounted somewhere outside of the engine bay.

There are several ways to wire an Aux fan depending upon your wants/needs. It can be wired such that fan initiation is automatic, manual or a combination of both. Pro's and Con's for each method. An easy way for many folks to wire it...is to let the trinary switch bring in the fan.

This will occur at upper mid-pressure (roughly 220-230 psi). That way... the fan comes on only when needed. One possible draw back to that method (unless you also wire for manual shut off) is that the fan will 'run on' for a bit after the ignition is shut off (I like that feature). Not an issue for the vast majority...BUT if live you in a climate where the ambient temps get high enough to create a static pressure of about 180 psi...(after equalization) the fan would continue to run. But it would have to be mighty darn hot to do that (upwards of 130°F ambient).

^^^^^^ Expand for replies

 

[ZackR]

It's the AC that stinks. I have all new, properly tensioned belts. The dealer charged the system last and it was fine in the shop. I have a new parallel flow condenser on the way. .

I'd say standby for now until the new condenser is installed. At that time be sure to pull and clean the evaporator and blower, install a new expansion valve + drier and before filling pull vacuum on the system for an hour to make sure all of the moisture is out and there are no leaks. During the fill phase purge the lines in the manifold so that no air is reintroduced. If once the AC system is dialed if you aren't seeing the temps you like then revisit the aux fan options.

 

[Dissent]

I'd say standby for now until the new condenser is installed. At that time be sure to pull and clean the evaporator and blower, install a new expansion valve + drier and before filling pull vacuum on the system for an hour to make sure all of the moisture is out and there are no leaks. During the fill phase purge the lines in the manifold so that no air is reintroduced. If once the AC system is dialed if you aren't seeing the temps you like then revisit the aux fan options.

Totally agree. I have all those parts on order. I'll be pressure/leak testing using nitrogen as well prior to vacuum. The more I learn, the more I see the add-on fans may be a Band-Aid for some folks while some have done the research to determine they truly need it. It's been enlightening learning about how refrigeration works!

 

[ZackR]

Totally agree. I have all those parts on order. I'll be pressure/leak testing using nitrogen as well prior to vacuum. The more I learn, the more I see the add-on fans may be a Band-Aid for some folks while some have done the research to determine they truly need it. It's been enlightening learning about how refrigeration works!

Before opening up the system I'd recommend injecting some dye and leaving it in there until the new parts arrive. That will give it time to highlight any leaks which you can then correct once the system is opened up.

Although not as hot as AZ it can get into the upper 90's here (very dry) and after refreshing my AC system I've been happy with the performance. On the highway I can't run it full cold for too long otherwise it'll freeze me out. The evaporator cleanout if it hasn't been done will be a huge help in itself. Mine was clogged with 20 years of pine needles, crap from trees, etc....

 

[Dissent]

Before opening up the system I'd recommend injecting some dye and leaving it in there until the new parts arrive. That will give it time to highlight any leaks which you can then correct once the system is opened up.

Although not as hot as AZ it can get into the upper 90's here (very dry) and after refreshing my AC system I've been happy with the performance. On the highway I can't run it full cold for too long otherwise it'll freeze me out. The evaporator cleanout if it hasn't been done will be a huge help in itself. Mine was clogged with 20 years of pine needles, crap from trees, etc....

Good tip. Mine already has dye in it and I've run a freon leak detector sensor around the system too. No leaks. I cleaned my evaporator using the foaming cleaner and remove what I could see (very little) through the resister hole. This time, the whole suitcase is coming out and the evap will get a thorough cleaning along with a new TXV. I'm replacing every o-ring in the system too and considering draining the compressor to ensure I don't have too much oil in the system. I know that new parallel flow condenser will make a big improvement though.

 

[Dissent]

I'm not at the truck right now but can someone tell me where the Trinary switch is located on a 97 LX? I don't recall seeing anything by the drier. Is it possible I have a Binary switch, not a Trinary? If so, I could swap it while I have the system open right?

 

[Dissent]

I finally found the post that I 'thought I saw' a few days ago. @sea bass did this on his!
JDM aux fan
"I bought 2 12" fans off Amazon for 100 bucks each don't know the name but they have a 2000 cfm rating I tied them into my rear defogger relay since I don't need that here in Arizona the relay is located in the driver side kick panel"
https://forum.ih8mud.com/attachments/1464826164501-2073075432-jpg.1267990/