Onboard Air - Fast filling options

[scottryana]

Terrible idea unless you are in Iceland. Ripping the lines off and losing air pressure is way too easy unless you are in the dessert or the arctic wasteland.

Do a search on this forum for the following things (separately) to see what you get. I know I had a conversation with someone up there about this exact thing.
Arctic
Iceland
Greenland

See the following link and go to the Imgur link to see pics of what I'm talking about.

My weekend in pictures Iceland

http://imgur.com/a/c2nDs#0

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[BILT4ME]

Terrible idea unless you are in Iceland. Ripping the lines off and losing air pressure is way too easy unless you are in the dessert or the arctic wasteland.

He needs to look into the Hummer auto air up/down options........

 

[Tools R Us]

Terrible idea unless you are in Iceland. Ripping the lines off and losing air pressure is way too easy unless you are in the dessert or the arctic wasteland.

Those things would get torn off in a flash, here, in the desert. Well if wheeling is in the plan, overland, touring type thing maybe not.

 

[scottryana]

I meant dunes type of dessert not dessert climate.

Those things would get torn off in a flash, here, in the desert. Well if wheeling is in the plan, overland, touring type thing maybe not.

 

[Qball]

As much as I love engineering cool stuff I hate complexity and murphy’s Law dictates that failure will always happen at the most inopportune time. So I follow the KISS method as much as I can.

I don’t have York but I do have ARB twin compressor, no tank and no regulator(too slow). I can definitely go to town with tank and such but all that expense and extra failure points what gain would I get? The answer for me is not much. I can fill up my 35 inch tires at under 2 minute each and I often over fill. I have one of those cheap clip on inflator thats hands free, I just clip on and set timer on my Apple Watch for 90 seconds and check pressure. I am always done In 10 minutes of less while shooting the breeze or enjoy the view.

Don’t really see a tank would fill up much faster due to the valve stem size. I have a quick disconnect at the compressor and light air hose and done. I do need a filter to catch all the condensation but that’s about it.

 

[alia176]

As much as I love engineering cool stuff I hate complexity and murphy’s Law dictates that failure will always happen at the most inopportune time. So I follow the KISS method as much as I can.

I don’t have York but I do have ARB twin compressor, no tank and no regulator(too slow). I can definitely go to town with tank and such but all that expense and extra failure points what gain would I get? The answer for me is not much. I can fill up my 35 inch tires at under 2 minute each and I often over fill. I have one of those cheap clip on inflator thats hands free, I just clip on and set timer on my Apple Watch for 90 seconds and check pressure. I am always done In 10 minutes of less while shooting the breeze or enjoy the view.

Don’t really see a tank would fill up much faster due to the valve stem size. I have a quick disconnect at the compressor and light air hose and done. I do need a filter to catch all the condensation but that’s about it.

You add a tank to any compressor to increase the duty cycle and to lower operating temps. Your compressor will thank you when it doesn't have to run continuously, regardless of which POS Chinese compressor rebadged as Viair/ARB/Smittybilt/etc says on the box.

 

[landcrshr]

I built a 4 way manifold with a ball valve and pressure gauge to inflate/deflate all 4 at the same time.

Is this setup actually faster than airing-up each tire one at a time?

If so, I'm guessing only because of the high capacity of the York?

 

[alia176]

Is this setup actually faster than airing-up each tire one at a time?

If so, I'm guessing only because of the high capacity of the York?

I'm not convinced it's any faster because the air flow is pinched down considerably by the regulator at each tire. As I mentioned previously, I think it *maybe* is faster just to fill each tire with full 100psi (or whatever your system is set for) vs using four regulated lines set for 45psi.

I think the novelty of this approach is the poor man's "automatic fill" ability but I could be wrong.

 

[mudgudgeon]

You add a tank to any compressor to increase the duty cycle and to lower operating temps.

Once the tank is empty, the compressor is running at full noise.
Trying to fill four tires together, the tank is going to be empty before all four chucks are on valve stems.

 

[landcrshr]

I'm not convinced it's any faster because the air flow is pinched down considerably by the regulator at each tire. As I mentioned previously, I think it *maybe* is faster just to fill each tire with full 100psi (or whatever your system is set for) vs using four regulated lines set for 45psi.

I think the novelty of this approach is the poor man's "automatic fill" ability but I could be wrong.

Right. I think the OP's concept with the regulators is self-defeating. I was asking about jon held's setup.

 

[jonheld]

Right. I think the OP's concept with the regulators is self-defeating. I was asking about jon held's setup.

It's a pretty slick setup IMO. The only drawback is during the actual fill, the manifold pressure will be higher than tire pressure due to the restrictions in the individual tire valves. To get an accurate reading, you must close the ball valve.
It's exactly the opposite when airing down all 4 tires. The manifold pressure will be lower than actual tire pressure until the valve is closed.
However, in actual use over the last 10 years or so, none of this really matters to me. I use this setup on my family cars as well, as it balances all 4 to equilibrium.

 

[scottryana]

I basically do the same thing, but I only do 1 side at a time. It works well. I too use it on my family cars.

It's a pretty slick setup IMO. The only drawback is during the actual fill, the manifold pressure will be higher than tire pressure due to the restrictions in the individual tire valves. To get an accurate reading, you must close the ball valve.
It's exactly the opposite when airing down all 4 tires. The manifold pressure will be lower than actual tire pressure until the valve is closed.
However, in actual use over the last 10 years or so, none of this really matters to me. I use this setup on my family cars as well, as it balances all 4 to equilibrium.

 

[Qball]

You add a tank to any compressor to increase the duty cycle and to lower operating temps. Your compressor will thank you when it doesn't have to run continuously, regardless of which POS Chinese compressor rebadged as Viair/ARB/Smittybilt/etc says on the box.

I see what you are saying about the tank and it makes sense. However, I am ashamed to admit I hardly use my compressor now and days with 2 small kids. Also the compressor is really fast so it really doesn't run more than 2 minutes at a time, my clip-on inflator is closed when not inflating so the ARB TC will reach 110 psi and automatically shut off when I switch between tires and checking pressure. More than duty cycle, what kills compressor more is high temperature which is why I will always mount it inside the car vs hot engine bay like a lot of people do. With the builtin fan I can put my hand on the heat shield of the ARB without getting burned after filling 4 35 inch tires. I even talked to ARB support and they said just about all the bad compressors that came back as defective were mounted in the engine bay.



Yes, just about everything is made in china however not all things made in china are not equal. ARB first and foremost has very good warranty so in case of anything breaks they usually send me the parts before I know it(used it on a couple of small things before). Second ARB quality is pretty good/better than most compressors out there.

 

[landcrshr]

It's a pretty slick setup IMO. The only drawback is during the actual fill, the manifold pressure will be higher than tire pressure due to the restrictions in the individual tire valves. To get an accurate reading, you must close the ball valve.
It's exactly the opposite when airing down all 4 tires. The manifold pressure will be lower than actual tire pressure until the valve is closed.
However, in actual use over the last 10 years or so, none of this really matters to me. I use this setup on my family cars as well, as it balances all 4 to equilibrium.

Thanks, I agree it is slick.
I was wondering if it is any faster. Not that I'm ever in a hurry, just wondering if this is one advantage of the York.

 

[rolliges]

Hand throttle gave me a faster compressor.

 

[jonheld]

Thanks, I agree it is slick.
I was wondering if it is any faster. Not that I'm ever in a hurry, just wondering if this is one advantage of the York.

Is it any faster than what?
The York puts out move volume at higher pressure than anything on the market. I usually keep the engine at idle, but if I'm in a hurry or filling multiple trucks (which always happens when you're the guy with an OBA setup) I'll bump the idle to around 1200. Any higher and it'll spit too much oil. That will keep the pressure up around 70 or 80 PSI during tire filling. The compressor will run continuously at that point because my tank is small.
If I run the engine up around 1800, it'll really move some air.

 

[jonheld]

I also like to run from the compressor to the tank and then to a filter. This gives the air a chance to cool a bit and allow any water vapor to condense and any particles to fall out. I have a drain at the bottom that needs to get serviced about once a year, depending on use.

 

[landcrshr]

Is it any faster than what?

This was my question:

Is this setup actually faster than airing-up each tire one at a time?

If so, I'm guessing only because of the high capacity of the York?

I was asking because I would do the 4-up system if it would shave off any significant air-up time, but thinking that's only possible if I stepped up to the York. I mean, my Air-Zenith is fast, but I doubt it will outrun the max flow of just one shrader valve.

Edit: What I mean to ask is, is the CFM of the York so great that you can fill four tires at once faster than one at a time?

 

[Tools R Us]

In the perspective of portable compressors, a tank is helpful for high demand, short burst loads, like an impact, makes the output more even. For a continuous demand, close to or exceeding the pump output, it is very little help, or in most cases extends air up time. What happens; the first bit of fill is faster, as soon as the tank equalizes to the tire (ish) the pump has to fill the tank and the tire, so the same as filling a larger tire. The larger the tank, the bigger the effect.

That is the theory, the tests were done with Puma compressors, the most common pump used locally. They come with a 1.5gal tank, some convert to portable by stripping the pump off of the tank. So same type pump, with and without tank, same tires and pressures. The first tire, the tank unit wins by 15 seconds (ish), overall 4 tires, the tank-less wins by a minute (ish), consistent, repeatable.

So if the main/only use is airing tires a tank isn't likely to be helpful. I occasionally run tools with it, and the 1.5gal is well matched to the Pump, so mine has the tank, for my use adding more tank isn't going to be helpful. For me, doesn't really matter, wheeling is social, not a competition, spend the time BSing with the wheeling buddies.

As Jon mentioned, if your running a old school pump that puts oil into the air, a tank is helpful in the battle to remove it. Oil is very bad for rubber, so best to remove all of it, not allow any into the tires.

 

[jonheld]

This was my question:

I was asking because I would do the 4-up system if it would shave off any significant air-up time, but thinking that's only possible if I stepped up to the York. I mean, my Air-Zenith is fast, but I doubt it will outrun the max flow of just one shrader valve.

Edit: What I mean to ask is, is the CFM of the York so great that you can fill four tires at once faster than one at a time?

The overall limiting factor in filling tires is the Schrader valve. The actual air passage is much smaller than the valve stem. So I suppose in the grand scheme of life the time saved is minimal, but it is less effort. I'm not crouching down on my old man knees filling individual tires. I pop the hoses on all 4, hook up my air line under the hood, and relax on the tailgate or whatever.
The same goes for airing down. Pop all 4 on, open the valve, and Bob's your uncle.
What I really like is that all 4 tires are exactly the same pressure. No guessing, no double checking.