My WARN 8274 rebuild part 1..... (3 Viewers)

[BrianSanDiego]

Awesome thread. Thank you so much for the information.

I have a couple of questions. I took the top cover off my 8074 to check the oil level and found that the large gear on the brake shaft looks to me like its on backwards. Lots of splines showing on the shaft on the passenger side and the gear hangs off spines on the drivers side. So is it in backwards? here are some pics...

Also, if I need to remove the shaft to flip the gear, I can drive it out with a drift from that edge on the shaft near that large gear. This will in turn push out the seal near the brake correct? Will I then need to replace any of the seals or bushing, or can I simply tap them back in?

Thank you so much for your help.
Brian.

 

[flintknapper]

Awesome thread. Thank you so much for the information.

I have a couple of questions. I took the top cover off my 8074 to check the oil level and found that the large gear on the brake shaft looks to me like its on backwards. Lots of splines showing on the shaft on the passenger side and the gear hangs off spines on the drivers side. So is it in backwards? here are some pics...

Also, if I need to remove the shaft to flip the gear, I can drive it out with a drift from that edge on the shaft near that large gear. This will in turn push out the seal near the brake correct? Will I then need to replace any of the seals or bushing, or can I simply tap them back in?

Thank you so much for your help.
Brian.

Hi Brian,

It's a little hard for me to tell from the pics...but it does appear the gear is situated incorrectly. More importantly, your description of the tooth engagement suggests the same.

You are correct in the procedure to remove the gear (do remember to lift the lock plate first). The "brake shaft bushing" will come out along with the seal, but if both are undamaged and not currently leaking...you can probably reuse them.

Good luck, and don't hesitate to ask...if you have any other questions or concerns.

Flint.

 

[BrianSanDiego]

Thank you very very much for your help.
Hopefully the repair will go smoothly.


Brian.

 

[flintknapper]

Let us know how it went, your experience/input may help others.

 

[BrianSanDiego]

Hey Flint.
It went well. I took off the brake, and then tapped out the shaft with an aluminum punch. I flipped over the gear and test fit it together, and it seemed to mesh much better. It now matches the pics from the rest of your guys' rebuilds.

The brass bushing next to the brake has a pretty loose fit in the case. I'm wondering if it will be OK like that or ??? I also managed to tap the seal back in without damaging it.

I haven't yet had a chance to test the winch. The reason I tore into it originally was because it didn't have much pulling power. I tried to tug a friends truck and trailer which was stuck in the sand. The winch just bogged out and stopped. I thought it would at least drag my 40 across the surface of the sand before the winch stalled. Shouldn't it pull harder than that? I've never used a winch before so I don't know.

Maybe I need to check the brushes and solenoids?

And a couple pics. The first is coming apart, the second and third show the gear alignment after I flipped the gear over.

Thanks again! B.

 

[flintknapper]

Hey Flint.
It went well. I took off the brake, and then tapped out the shaft with an aluminum punch. I flipped over the gear and test fit it together, and it seemed to mesh much better. It now matches the pics from the rest of your guys' rebuilds.

Yup, looks good!

The brass bushing next to the brake has a pretty loose fit in the case. I'm wondering if it will be OK like that or ??? I also managed to tap the seal back in without damaging it.

The interference fit of the brass bushing seems to vary quite a bit from one unit to another. Mine was pretty tight...but I have heard others say their's were not. I see from your second pic that you correctly seated the bushing....so that it protrudes inside the case a small amount to act as a thrust washer for the gear. Good job. Your seal should be fine.

I haven't yet had a chance to test the winch. The reason I tore into it originally was because it didn't have much pulling power.

All the gears look good....so any lack of power would not be related to that.

I tried to tug a friends truck and trailer which was stuck in the sand. The winch just bogged out and stopped. I thought it would at least drag my 40 across the surface of the sand before the winch stalled. Shouldn't it pull harder than that? I've never used a winch before so I don't know.

Brian the 8274 is pretty much a workhorse, but the pulling power depends on several things.

1. Which layer of rope you are on (nearest the drum= more power).
2. Condition of your battery and winch motor.
3. Good connections from battery to motor (especially the ground).

In the situation you described....I would have automatically used a snatch block to double the pulling power, but normally with a good battery, good winch motor... and 1st or 2nd layer of cable...yeah, it will probably skid your vehicle (mine definitely will).

Maybe I need to check the brushes and solenoids?

Always good to make sure everything is in proper working order.

And a couple pics. The first is coming apart, the second and third show the gear alignment after I flipped the gear over.

Good pics, thanks for sharing and for your participation in this thread.

Thanks again.

Da Nada!

 

[EatingSpam]

First would like to say Wicked write up.

Now to the questions, I have an 8274 and I am trying to get the main shaft out because it seems to be leaking sludge(oil). Will new bushings solve this leak? Also I am having a hard time getting it out, just use a brass punch and giver hard?

Thanks

Colin

 

[flintknapper]

First would like to say Wicked write up.

Now to the questions, I have an 8274 and I am trying to get the main shaft out because it seems to be leaking sludge(oil). Will new bushings solve this leak?

Most likely.

Also I am having a hard time getting it out, just use a brass punch and giver hard?

Yup. Make certain you have lifted up the "locking plate" though.

 

[george_tlc]

I figure I may as well add to this thread - might as well keep all the 8274 info in one place.

A few years back I converted my 24V diesel patrol to 12V and converted my 24V 8274 to 12V. Here's the write up from my website. This may help someone that wants to do the same conversion or vice versa or just to understand the wiring difference of the 24V model.

----------------------
Next the winch retrofit from 24V to 12V. I purchased a new 4.5HP 12V Warn style motor in the US and brought it back with me.

Here's the winch before I started the motor swap. NOTE: the solenoids on a 24V winch ARE 12V solenoids, each pair (cross connected) are wired in series - BUT read below! For 12V operation the control signals are rewired for parallel operation. Of course I bought 5 (4 + 1 spare) 12V solenoids thinking that Warn used 24V solenoids in their 24V winches. Guess I have 5 spare solenoids now .

There is a subtle difference in the solenoids between a true 12V winch and a 24V winch. On a 12V winch ALL 4 solenoids have a common ground path through their body, hence only a SINGLE control wire goes to each solenoid and hence each cross connected pair is in parallel (12V operation). In a 24V winch the UPPER 2 solenoids have a common ground path through the body BUT the bottom 2 solenoids are DIFFERENT in that they do NOT have a ground path through the body. This means that the bottom 2 solenoids have 2 control wires and each one is wired IN SERIES with the cross connected mate - hence 24V operation. Took a bit of head scratching to figure out this subtle difference...

You can see how NEW the old solenoids look, the winch has been on my MQ for over 20 years - having a good fitting water proof cover is the reason. It may look all macho to have the winch exposed - but I'll keep the cover on mine...

Here's some new hookup info to rewire the 24V solenoid for 12V operation (remember that the solenoids ARE 12V, regardless of 24V or 12V operation - they are just wired in series for 24V and parallel for 12V).

The following picture shows how the control box is wired for for 24V operation (as a reference). The key is to note where the Black and Green wires connect from the Control Box. Basically the Black and Green carry 24V from the hand control to energize one cross connected solenoid pair or the other cross connected solenoid pair.

The next picture shows the original wiring (that will be left EXACTLY in place). The ONLY thing that needs to be 'rewired' is the Black and Green wires from the Control Box and the addition of 2 new wires to provide Ground connection to the bottom 2 solenoids. As noted in the picture the top 2 solenoids are DIFFERENT than the bottom 2 solenoids (i.e. they have DIFFERENT part numbers).

The next picture shows where the Black and Green Control Box wires need to be rewired to. It also shows where new Ground wires need to be connected to the bottom 2 solenoids. You can wire the new bottom 2 solenoid wires to the top two solenoid coils (where there are no wires originally - since those two 'lugs' are electrically grounded through the body of those 2 solenoids).

Once you have added in the new ground wires for the bottom two solenoids AND moved the Black and Green Control box wires to the new positions what you have done is wired the solenoids in Parallel (for 12V operation) rather than in Series (for 24V operation). So, for 12V operation Solenoid #2 and #3 coils are in parallel and Solenoid #1 and #4 coils are in parallel. (Originally, for 24V operation, Solenoid #2 and #3 coils are in series and Solenoid #1 and #4 coils are in series).

That's all there is to it. Of course you ALSO need to change the motor to a 12V unit as below...

The new 12V winch motor installed into the top of the gear box. Anyone need a good running 24V Winch motor? Once the back plate is removed off the motor the brushes will be exposed and they will slide off the commutator. that allows the motor to be pulled clear of the housing and installed onto the gear box.

Close up of the motor installed in the box. I chose the original style keyway motor from the supplier I bought the motor from. I had to clean off the old sealant and then applied some new non-hardening gasket forming material. Pretty simple looking in there eh? The knob on the left just slides the gear on the motor shaft clear of the large gear - that disengages the motor and allows the cable to be easily pulled off the drum.

cheers,
george.

 

[flintknapper]

Cool!

Thanks for the 24v info.

Flint.

 

[EatingSpam]

This is a small question but one that I haven't found the anwer too. What gauge of wire is recommended for wiring the winch too the battery?

 

[flintknapper]

This is a small question but one that I haven't found the anwer too. What gauge of wire is recommended for wiring the winch too the battery?

Depends on the distance from the battery to the winch....but a typical installation (battery leads less than 72") should be a minimum of #2 gauge.

Slightly heavier would be better.

 

[Awl_TEQ]

How about 15' ? 8274 receiver mount in rear bumper with a quick coupler (like an electric forklift battery plug - don't know what they are called). Wires (cables I guess is a better term) run permanent down the frame.

 

[flintknapper]

How about 15' ? 8274 receiver mount in rear bumper with a quick coupler (like an electric forklift battery plug - don't know what they are called). Wires (cables I guess is a better term) run permanent down the frame.

Maybe something similar to this:

Ramsey Battery Power Lead — 20ft., Model# 251021 | Battery Cables + Wiring | Northern Tool + Equipment

 

[Awl_TEQ]

Yup - that's exactly what I was gonna do. It even has a cap which is cool. The link doesn't state the Gauge of wire but it looks big enough. I like the plug idea because I can run one to each bumper and make up a set of booster cables that I can plug in either end of the truck. No more trying to jockey your rig around to help a guy out, just plug and play.

 

[EatingSpam]

The brake disk material in my 8274 seems VERY SMOOTH(almost like glass), is it suppose to be that smooth or is it suppose to be rough?

 

[flintknapper]

The brake disk material in my 8274 seems VERY SMOOTH(almost like glass), is it suppose to be that smooth or is it suppose to be rough?

New friction disc's have a little bit of texture to them but not much. Mine were maybe an 1/8" thick (or so) and were not "smooth", but didn't have a rough finish either.

The old ones I took off were definitely smooth...but were still working very well.

 

[Awl_TEQ]

Some of mine were oily and very smooth so I hit them real quick in the glass bead blaster. Roughed them up and cleaned them too. Might be an option if you have a blast cabinet. Just be gentle!

 

[EatingSpam]

Thanks guys, I think I am just going to order new ones. Just in case.

 

[EatingSpam]

OK.... now I was looking at #2 wire at princess auto today, they only had 2 kinds of #2 wire(both for welders) they were based on amps. What amp is the winch going too pull?

Also wanted to thank you both. Both of your write-up were insturmental in allowing me to rebuild my 8274(flint and AWL). Thank you

Colin

PS. it is almost done. Just have to bite the bullet in either do the zerk grease nipples for right side or not.
PPS. what tap did you use for the zerk fittings and is their really enough thread on a zerk to hold the cover in place?