LS3 (EROD or Connect and Cruise) Regret (2 Viewers)

[87 Land Cruiser]

I split the difference to some extent, used L76 from a G8, mild truck cam, 6l80. Runs great and dynod at 325hp at 5500ft elevation.

Looks like an LS2/3 in the engine bay, no issues at altitude with 91 octane gas

This sounds like a great way to go about it! What kind of mileage was on the L76 when you bought it?

 

[yotadude520]

I second the comments above - I bought my L59 (flex fuel LM7) for $2k from a reputable junkyard with the OG harness and computer, then bought a BP Automotive harness for $625 and had it tuned for $400, coming in a hair over $3k for everything.

For 1/3 the cost it was definitely worth it and my engine already had the truck accessories on it, which fit our 60's much better. The big benefit of the newer engines is E-ROD which makes it emissions compliant, but any LS swap is going to do better on emissions than an old 2F.

 

[RivMan]

Oh i still had my tuner go super conservative on my tune as well. Its literally named "paw paw map" on the file in HPtuners hahaha I still had him tune on 91 to give him the most flexibility on the fuel map. For example the stock tune adds way too much fuel at wot so that was adjusted My 5.3 is as conservative as it gets as far as tune and parts go. Its still got the stock cam and intake and everything on it. I wanted longevity over performance and any good tuner can easily give that to you

That makes sense.

The 5.3 is typically around 9.5:1 compression. It's much easier to run one of those on 87 than the 6.2's.

-Rob

 

[BurntToast]

This sounds like a great way to go about it! What kind of mileage was on the L76 when you bought it?

~100k, but I will echo @yotadude520 the downside is the accessories are more annoying to fit. Check my thread for my saga, but I also got unlucky with a tensioner breakage

 

[87 Land Cruiser]

I second the comments above - I bought my LM7 for $2k from a reputable junkyard with the OG harness and computer, then bought a BP Automotive harness for $625 and had it tuned for $400, coming in a hair over $3k for everything.

For 1/3 the cost it was definitely worth it and my engine already had the truck accessories on it, which fit our 60's much better. The big benefit of the newer engines is E-ROD which makes it emissions compliant, but any LS swap is going to do better on emissions than an old 2F.

I love the feedback that I am getting. I totally did not expect it, I 100% thought everyone would tell me to do the LS3.

 

[87 Land Cruiser]

~100k, but I will echo @yotadude520 the downside is the accessories are more annoying to fit. Check my thread for my saga, but I also got unlucky with a tensioner breakage

Will do!

 

[yotadude520]

dude i paid 2 grand for a 5.3 and a 4l60 from a tahoe then sold my 2f and h55f for 2k. I changed the spark plugs, wires, and oil and oil pan and its been in my truck for like 4 years with zero issues. I daily drive it, Ive driven across the country, taken it up over 130 mph, jumped rail road tracks with it, wheeled Moab, the PNW, etc.

Sure a LS3 would be cooler at the car meet, or sound better, or accelerate faster... but Insead of spending all that extra money on a fancy LS... I coil swapped my truck and put full float 80 series axles under it with ARB lockers and RCV axle shafts.

IMO if your only big project plans ever for your truck is this motor swap, then sure go out and go full bling with the motor... if you got other projects in mind, the money is better spent on more projects.

Since all out hp isnt an issue for you... get you a LM7 or even better, a LQ4 put a LS6 intake and camaro accessory drive on it and a mild cam and call it a day. Or if you want to be extra fancy do a LQ9. Gen 3 is cheaper, easier to wire, and the main downside is they make like slightly less power but gen 4 cost way more.

Also with Gen III (up to 2003) you get return-style fuel rails, and can run a cable throttle body if you don't want to deal with the drive by wire stuff.

Return-style fuel rails are great since you don't have to run an external fuel regulator or those stupid corvette style fuel filters.

130 MPH is ballsy, I got mine up to 103 and that was good enough for me. That's with a basic 87 tune and a completely stock L59 with 163k miles on it.

 

[87 Land Cruiser]

Hey glad you were able to use the write up! heck yeah! So a lot of the time the used take offs come with a factory ECU too so you wont have to go the standalone ecu route if you didnt want to.

You make a really good point about the ls3 swaps being put up for sale, i see a lot of those in my area too and ive always wondered about that. Tons of shiny newer looking engines for sale, as well as heavily modified LS based motors as well. I dont think the LS3 would hurt the everyday drivability at all. They are super smooth running engines. I do see them up for sale quite a bit though and was wondering about that myself as well.

I think the big thing about finding a used motor is finding a good wrecking yard that sells the used "swaps" (aka engine/trans/harness/ecu/ gas pedal) as a package or finding a good running wrecked donor vehicle. Id be weary of buying a used motor by itself from some random dude on fb marketplace

Can you expand on the factory ECU part? I must be misunderstanding how to incorporate all of those pieces you would recieve from a junk yard. I thought you needed to dump them in the trash and buy a controller.

 

[onemanarmy]

what do you mean by 'controller'?

Some junkyards and reputable engine suppliers will sell you the takeout engine/trans/ecu/harness (and DBW pedal if equipped) all as one package

If you want to run your Toyota manual trans, you will need to buy an adapter, regardless of any engine package

Then you pay $150 to 'tune' out all the stuff you don't want from the factory ECU

Or, buy a cheap "ls swap" harness/computer from Ebay with just the minimal circuits needed to run

Or go buy a wrecked tahoe or whatever and pull it all yourself

 

[yotadude520]

Can you expand on the factory ECU part? I must be misunderstanding how to incorporate all of those pieces you would recieve from a junk yard. I thought you needed to dump them in the trash and buy a controller.

No need to buy a controller. You're going to buy a standalone wiring harness that will replace the engine harness on whatever donor motor you buy. You will have your stock computer flashed with a base tune to remove the anti theft features the factory has on them, then after you get your swap done and the truck running you will have a professional tuner tune it.

I highly, highly recommend BP Automotive harnesses as they're easy to wire up and really well made, and they offer a base tune service for $75. I do not recommend keeping the BP base tune for a long time as it does run pretty lean, but it works.

Stumbling my way through an LS Swap

Easily navigate this thread for tech info

forum.ih8mud.com

In my swap thread you can see all the wiring information on integrating the standalone harness with the FJ60 body (mine is a 1986)

 

[yotadude520]

what do you mean by 'controller'?

Some junkyards and reputable engine suppliers will sell you the takeout engine/trans/ecu/harness (and DBW pedal if equipped) all as one package

If you want to run your Toyota manual trans, you will need to buy an adapter, regardless of any engine package

Then you pay $150 to 'tune' out all the stuff you don't want from the factory ECU

Or, buy a cheap "ls swap" harness/computer from Ebay with just the minimal circuits needed to run

Or go buy a wrecked tahoe or whatever and pull it all yourself

I think he's referencing the Holley terminator setup or something like that. Just ask a junkyard for a complete takeout LS and you should get all the accessories, DBW control module, and original wiring harness.

 

[onemanarmy]

I bought a running/driving 5.3 truck to verify everything and then did the swap. Had a shop 'tune' the factory ECU and off to the races

 

[dbbowen]

Also with Gen III (up to 2003) you get return-style fuel rails, and can run a cable throttle body if you don't want to deal with the drive by wire stuff.

Return-style fuel rails are great since you don't have to run an external fuel regulator or those stupid corvette style fuel filters.

130 MPH is ballsy, I got mine up to 103 and that was good enough for me. That's with a basic 87 tune and a completely stock L59 with 163k miles on it.

It was one of those did it once things and im good things. 0-100 is pretty ok. 100-130 is a little absurd

Can you expand on the factory ECU part? I must be misunderstanding how to incorporate all of those pieces you would recieve from a junk yard. I thought you needed to dump them in the trash and buy a controller.

I was going to explain but the others explained it pretty well. You basically just reflash the GM computer that came with the motor. For what youre doing a standalone computer would be a little overkill and the GM computer would be just fine.

 

[87 Land Cruiser]

I think he's referencing the Holley terminator setup or something like that. Just ask a junkyard for a complete takeout LS and you should get all the accessories, DBW control module, and original wiring harness.

This is exactly right. I didn't realize these parts were reusable because I have been looking at new crate engines I assumed the used engine would also need a controller and didn't realize all that stuff comes with it if you buy it right and is re-usable.

In the case of the L96 since the GM controller is still available new, is there an advantage to purchasing that vs using the one that comes with it from the junk yard?

 

[yotadude520]

This is exactly right. I didn't realize these parts were reusable because I have been looking at new crate engines I assumed the used engine would also need a controller and didn't realize all that stuff comes with it if you buy it right and is re-usable.

In the case of the L96 since the GM controller is still available new, is there an advantage to purchasing that vs using the one that comes with it from the junk yard?

Yup, you can reuse the factory wiring harness too and there are some guys on here who have done that. It is quite a bit of work though and I just opted for a standalone harness that replaces it.

 

[87 Land Cruiser]

@onemanarmy and @yotadude520 are y'all happy with the H55 and the 5.3? Did you use the Marks Adapter?

 

[Kleatus]

If you don't need the power of the gen4+, a gen 3 5.3 or 6.0 is for me the peak of performance + simplicity + easy of swap. I did a 5.3 in mine. Bought a new USA made harness so I had all new wire. The way my swap worked out, the cost of the engine itself was for all intents and purposes negligible. About $7k all in. Harness, fuel system, buying HP tuners, adapters, new clutch and flywheel, rebuilding the NV4500, resealing the 5.3, new cooling system, adding a little bigger cam and new lifters, timing chain, etc. I have put very minimal effort into tuning it and while I know it has more power that can be extracted I also know I can beat on it with any fuel in any climate and it will just chug along.
An Erod package would have added quite of cost to my swap and at the end of the day most of the reliability of any swap is in the execution anyway IMHO. I just wanted reliability, serviceability, parts availability, highway performance, ability to load up and tow without going 25 mph up grades, etc. All accomplished easily with a used 140k mile 5.3 and some elbow grease.

 

[NCFJ]

Woah! haha! I imagine your opinion of the LS3 is very high in an FJ-60 application?

I install a lot of C&C LS3 crate packages and they push a 60 or 80 around well without issue. My view is not for over the top HP but for reliability and ease of maintenance. They are built to serve daily driver duty. 2 year warranty is important to my customers

My personal favorite truck had a 6.0L with a Tremec 4050 5 speed manual. A complete pleasure to drive. I have done the NV4500 swap along with the Toyota 5 speed and the Tremec puts them to shame.

If you are looking for really nice front drive assembly take a look at Wegner. Their stuff is as tight as it gets and beautiful to look at. Assembling OEM and Holly front drive systems is all "wiggle and fit" assembly. Wegner parts are precision fit and literally fall together when exactly lined up. A very noticeable difference.

No matter the platform you choose, the amount of work is about the same. A little more on a used motor for clean up and replacing sensors and gaskets.

 

[dbbowen]

If you don't need the power of the gen4+, a gen 3 5.3 or 6.0 is for me the peak of performance + simplicity + easy of swap. I did a 5.3 in mine. Bought a new USA made harness so I had all new wire. The way my swap worked out, the cost of the engine itself was for all intents and purposes negligible. About $7k all in. Harness, fuel system, buying HP tuners, adapters, new clutch and flywheel, rebuilding the NV4500, resealing the 5.3, new cooling system, adding a little bigger cam and new lifters, timing chain, etc. I have put very minimal effort into tuning it and while I know it has more power that can be extracted I also know I can beat on it with any fuel in any climate and it will just chug along.
An Erod package would have added quite of cost to my swap and at the end of the day most of the reliability of any swap is in the execution anyway IMHO. I just wanted reliability, serviceability, parts availability, highway performance, ability to load up and tow without going 25 mph up grades, etc. All accomplished easily with a used 140k mile 5.3 and some elbow grease.

Couldnt agree more. Gen 3 is the hill i will die on with the LS swaps haha they're just so simple. and the wiring is very simple compared to gen4 as well. Like cruise control isnt even in the computer on gen4 its in the body computer so you have to run a separate module to have cruise control and stuff like that.

I install a lot of C&C LS3 crate packages and they push a 60 or 80 around well without issue. My view is not for over the top HP but for reliability and ease of maintenance. They are built to serve daily driver duty. 2 year warranty is important to my customers

My personal favorite truck had a 6.0L with a Tremec 4050 5 speed manual. A complete pleasure to drive. I have done the NV4500 swap along with the Toyota 5 speed and the Tremec puts them to shame.

If you are looking for really nice front drive assembly take a look at Wegner. Their stuff is as tight as it gets and beautiful to look at. Assembling OEM and Holly front drive systems is all "wiggle and fit" assembly. Wegner parts are precision fit and literally fall together when exactly lined up. A very noticeable difference.

No matter the platform you choose, the amount of work is about the same. A little more on a used motor for clean up and replacing sensors and gaskets.

Totally agree on the wegner, i installed a complete 2,500 dollar holley accessory drive kit on a swap and the fit up wasnt the greatest.

 

[yotadude520]

@onemanarmy and @yotadude520 are y'all happy with the H55 and the 5.3? Did you use the Marks Adapter?

I'm very happy with my LS and H55F. I used the Mark's Adapter and would definitely use it again.

Going with a NV4500 or a Tremec would be nice since it bolts right up to the LS but I was trying to keep my swap as simple as possible and the Mark's adapter keeps the drivetrain stock from the transmission back. This is nice since you don't have to build a custom crossmember, cut the trans tunnel cover and have custom driveshafts built. It also helps position the engine in the engine bay quite nicely with plenty of room between the back of the intake and the firewall.