How Does a 1HZ Compare to a 2F? (2 Viewers)

[roscoFJ73]

I was under the impression that a SC would add power & torque across the band, since it is belt driven and does not have to spool up.
In theory wouldn't the SC surpass a turbo simply because it has the ability to push and pull and is not limited by use of the exhaust movement?

I agree ,the mechanical attachment between engine and compressor is a huge advantage and you dont get the heat transfer from the exhaust gases.
In Australia its the only engine enhancement used widely in workplace vehicles.
Drilling rigs mounted on 75 series run all day 40 c heat off the PTO.

So, how much is it?

$5990AUD or $4700USD for the complete 1HZ kit. Fitting is a days work.
Different size pulleys avaliable to alter the engine to S/C drive ratio
I think there is a US dealer in Florida

 

[kevinmrowland]

Well that's not to bad. Considering that a new turbo would be half that.
But combined with the price of an engine in addition, it would make a whole JDM truck suddenly seem affordable. ;p

 

[rapovt]

Does a supercharger give more power than a turbo? how does fuel mileage compare to a turbo?

 

[roscoFJ73]

Does a supercharger give more power than a turbo?

You cant answer that unless you know the size of the SC or turbo and a whole pile of other factors.
Basically you would blow the engine before you found out.
Both turbos and superchargers are compressors ,one runs off the exhaust gases exiting the engine,the other runs off the crank

how does fuel mileage compare to a turbo?

Neither give drastically better fuel economy ,sometimes its worse ,sometimes its better

 

[hks3sgte]

Also another thing to account for on supercharged engines is parasitic loss from using a belt to drive the supercharger. Whereas a turbo uses otherwise useless exhaust to power the turbo.

 

[roscoFJ73]

Also another thing to account for on supercharged engines is parasitic loss from using a belt to drive the supercharger. Whereas a turbo uses otherwise useless exhaust to power the turbo.

No such thing as a free lunch. The engine still has to push the exhaust out and the turbo is an obstruction which is also "parasitic"
The supercharger returns the loss(0.4 of a second in this case) almost immediately which is why its used almost universally in drag racing.
Ive heard of turbo lag but never Supercharger lag

 

[crushers]

the only concern i have with the supercharger is the sudden boost of power which will find each and every weak spot in the drivetrain...
the turbo will come on smoother (unless of course you rev it up and dump the clutch, not that i would ever do that...)

 

[roscoFJ73]

the only concern i have with the supercharger is the sudden boost of power which will find each and every weak spot in the drivetrain...
the turbo will come on smoother (unless of course you rev it up and dump the clutch, not that i would ever do that...)

Its not a sudden uncontrolled boost,the power just comes on smooth like driving a V8 in a cruiser.
As long as you dont floor it,no problems.
You can still damage the drivetrain with a stock engine if your not careful

 

[bad_religion_au]

No such thing as a free lunch. The engine still has to push the exhaust out and the turbo is an obstruction which is also "parasitic"
The supercharger returns the loss(0.4 of a second in this case) almost immediately which is why its used almost universally in drag racing.
Ive heard of turbo lag but never Supercharger lag

no there is no such thing as a free lunch, but the losses of the engine pushing the gasses out can be rectified by going to a bigger exaust pipe/ free flow muffler to make up for the extra drag of the turbo. supercharger parasitic losses can't be "made up for" like this.

 

[kevinmrowland]

Its not a sudden uncontrolled boost,the power just comes on smooth like driving a V8 in a cruiser.
As long as you dont floor it,no problems.
You can still damage the drivetrain with a stock engine if your not careful

As you stated...........
The few times I have driven supercharged vehicles, the power just flows very smooth, and noticeably builds, almost exponentially as the RPMs increase.
The turbos I have driven on the other hand all have that certain point where they kick in, some almost uncontrollably if you are unfamiliar with the car and are driving aggressively.

That drag from the belt seems to be immediately compensated for by the incredibly smooth boost in available power.

(key word here, "seems")

 

[roscoFJ73]

no there is no such thing as a free lunch, but the losses of the engine pushing the gasses out can be rectified by going to a bigger exaust pipe/ free flow muffler
.

You can put a bigger exhaust on any vehicle and make it breathe easier,but you still need pressure between combustion chamber and turbo vanes ,otherwise the turbo will not spool up.
Its the pistons pushing the gases out that makes the pressure and also causes heat build up.
Also,because the turbo is in contact with the heated exhaust gas,the turbo can pass some of that heat back into the engine

A supercharged engine blows its gases straight out the back,no restriction,no heat build up.
It also compresses the air physically separated from the engine ,bar a few brackets,nuts and bolts so its not passing as much heat back to the engine, which means there is no need to run an intercooler on a supercharged engine.
This is why they are used on 75 series drilling rigs in stationary positions all day in 40c heat

 

[kenji4life]

http://www.ststurbo.com/home


These folks make a 'remote' mounted turbo system. The turbo can be located away from the engine and further down the exhaust system which results in cooler intake charges and higher power increases.


VW makes a hatch with a supercharged and turbocharged 1.4 l engine. Awesome gas mileage of 30 mpg city 48 highway.

Other companies have tried with the sc+tc.

The key to successfully turbocharging is in making sure that both the correct turbo is selected for your system as well as the proper steps to ensure that the turbo is functioning efficiently. As previously stated, Maximum Boost by Corky Bell is an excellent read.

Another thing to keep in mind is that as a general rule, car companies do not install turbos with full efficiency and power in mind. An exception would be Porsche and a few others.

 

[hks3sgte]

Remote mounting a turbo sounds like it would just create more lag... more mm's of piping to move air through...

 

[Tapage]

Remote mounting a turbo sounds like it would just create more lag... more mm's of piping through move air through...

I thought the turbo lag was a concer .. no doubt, but you can minimize that .. just wondering. In the FAQ they claim about uses the turbo systems ( well fitted and sized ) over 3k rpms ( that are a lots arpm for my 2H engine for example )

And they include a very interesting concept on the oil return system ( with electric pump )

 

[BlueHZT60]

1HZ vs 2f. Without turbo the 2f is more peppy, less torque, better mileage. With turbo - hold on, we're getting close to V-8 and still getting 20+mpg. My 60 is 7100lbs, I now have to let off on the throttle - I'm learning all new driving habits - it's not idle or floored, it's mid-throttle. Offroad is even that much more amazing.

If I had it to do all over again (Oh, I will be, the 2nd HZ will be going into the 45).

Bob

 

[hks3sgte]

Do you have any build-up pictures of your swap?

 

[Tapage]

Do you have any build-up pictures of your swap?

Ditto !

 

[Japan4X4]

ho hum......

Glad you are happy Bob

 

[VTCruiser]

never drove my 60 with a 2F, but i've been driving it with a 1HZ for three years and love it. It's no race car but I can cruise 80+mph on the highway without difficulty (33"s, 3.70's, h55f). I averge around 21mpg city, and 25mpg on the highway easy. A turbo would be sweet, maybe soon.

 

[Tapage]

never drove my 60 with a 2F, but i've been driving it with a 1HZ for three years and love it. It's no race car but I can cruise 80+mph on the highway without difficulty (33"s, 3.70's, h55f). I averge around 21mpg city, and 25mpg on the highway easy. A turbo would be sweet, maybe soon.

I thought ( and only IMOP ) upgrade to 4.11 would be great !