I bought my 2013 LC about 18 months ago with 69K miles on it and have put about 35k miles on it. Since ownership I've had to replace the radiator since the previous dealer replaced it with a non-oem one (although it sounds like the original had a leak thus them replacing it anyways) and I've had the KDSS valves seized up. Other than that it has worked as it should and has been a reliable vehicle. I will say this, my 2016 Toyota 4Runner Trail ed w/o KDSS went 107k miles without a single issue. Yes it's slow, isn't as luxurious as an LC, and components not as robust but in many ways I think it's as reliable and a MUCH MUCH easier vehicle to work on. Changing the suspension on a non-KDSS vehicle is a simple and easy process. Me changing the suspension on the LC required fighting the rusted KDSS valves, dealing the the KDSS pistons and ungodly effort to get the swaybar links to line back up after lifting it. I mean it might have been that it was my first time working on the LC but I felt like the job was 5x more difficult than working on the 4Runner. So in a way, I can see what the OP was talking about. I mean if the 4Runner had a better powertrain combo in its current iteration it would be a very nice platform and easy to work on.
Help me understand the appeal.
- Thread starter AnyMal
- Start date
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- Thread starter
- #82
Eh. I don’t know about that.
When you take singular viewpoints of longevity or “dependability” sure.
But theres a lot of better out there, in many regards. But maybe you wont get your 25 years out of it. You can buy 2 though for the cost of the LC. Maybe 3.
As far as off-roading, its not my domain but there’s plenty of things that s*** all over the LC in that area.
Anywho seems like people are actually getting upset, and some don’t have any real understanding of statistical analysis anyway.
Im going to be keeping this for 20 years and report back.
Any of you smart folk out there got a total cost of ownership breakdown you can share? Im getting interested to see how much ill be ahead if any. Im not mad though, I gotta $36k discount CPO, 2% rate and I have $20k in equity in it already.
If it lasts thats great, if i get valley leak, or worse snap a valve spring and grenade s***, ill be one of the frequent anomalies that post here for halp like we have every day.
Thanks!
- Thread starter
- #83
- Thread starter
- #84
Wait didn't someone else say it was the GX?
hmmm
And GM in number 3? Holy smokes. Something seems dumb. Maybe its the entire model?
- Thread starter
- #85
My bad, I don't know where I read/saw that. Still is a point in my favor though.
The suburban will still be running at 200k, but every bit of trim, plastic, and electronics will have fallen off or stopped working.
- Thread starter
- #87
Barebones baby. Just like i like it. LOL
Like i said, there is a cost consideration, and demographics, and a lot of other things going on.
Suburban is 30% cheaper and so are its parts. The list may as well be most maintained SUVs on the road. Or most sunk cost fallacied buyers list.
Or actually, IMO and as the forum consistently demonstrates, most attached badge lickers.
Either way, im trying to objectively consider things, which i guess is straight blasphemy to some.
I did some mental math when i first bought this thing, and without real repairs, overall cost to own was something like $200/mo long term.
Thats why i didn't lease anything at the time.
Im still ahead of the game whichever way you look at it, im just wondering if those 20 years are going to be happy and worry free.
So far, ive been surprised by how much jank ive run into. And that has triggered a lot of folks apparently lol.
Im sorrryyyy
From Hotcars:
The Toyota Land Cruiser is arguably the most reliable SUV in history. It is also the longest-running series in Toyota's history. The SUV is well-rounded – it is a roomy family vehicle that also doubles as a rugged off-roader.
By Autosdeprimera
One of the biggest wins of the Land Cruiser is its ability to keep going despite the mileage on the odometer. The vehicle is designed and engineered to last over 25 years and can go for over 300,000 miles or more. It is an iconic beauty that has wowed Toyota fans for over 60 years.
From TopGear:
If we’re going to talk about machines that’ll do 300,000 miles without so much as a mechanised shrug, it’s going to be the Toyota Land Cruiser. You know how people use laps around the equator – ‘300,000 miles is 12 times around the equator!’ and other such overenthusiastic guff – to signify how far something is? The Land Cruiser scoffs at such paltry equivalencies. It’ll do 12 laps of every vaguely terrestrial portion of planet Earth before you sell it on to its next owner, who’ll do another 12.
Another list from iseecars:
These are the cars and trucks that are most likely to make it past 300,000 based on statistics.
The Toyota Land Cruiser is arguably the most reliable SUV in history. It is also the longest-running series in Toyota's history. The SUV is well-rounded – it is a roomy family vehicle that also doubles as a rugged off-roader.
By Autosdeprimera
One of the biggest wins of the Land Cruiser is its ability to keep going despite the mileage on the odometer. The vehicle is designed and engineered to last over 25 years and can go for over 300,000 miles or more. It is an iconic beauty that has wowed Toyota fans for over 60 years.
From TopGear:
If we’re going to talk about machines that’ll do 300,000 miles without so much as a mechanised shrug, it’s going to be the Toyota Land Cruiser. You know how people use laps around the equator – ‘300,000 miles is 12 times around the equator!’ and other such overenthusiastic guff – to signify how far something is? The Land Cruiser scoffs at such paltry equivalencies. It’ll do 12 laps of every vaguely terrestrial portion of planet Earth before you sell it on to its next owner, who’ll do another 12.
Another list from iseecars:
These are the cars and trucks that are most likely to make it past 300,000 based on statistics.
Toyota Tundra – .2%
Toyota 4Runner – .2%
GMC Yukon XL – .2%
Chevy Suburban – .2%
Ford Expedition – .2%
Toyota Sequoia – .4%
Toyota Land Cruiser – 1.5%
Enough said.
This is probably where the disconnect is. If you have no interest in going to remote places and getting back to civilization unscathed, you are paying a huge premium in the form of cost and performance compromises.
I do data analysis for a living
What available that is better?
What sh*t's all over an LC offroad?
To be in the conversation it has to:
carry 5 people
a boatload of gear (1500 lbs payload)
be safe as anything
have all wheel drive and 4-lo
reputation of reliability
international platform
Quiet on the road
be mod-able
have good resale value
etc
etc
etc
I do data analysis for a living
What available that is better?
What sh*t's all over an LC offroad?
To be in the conversation it has to:
carry 5 people
a boatload of gear (1500 lbs payload)
be safe as anything
have all wheel drive and 4-lo
reputation of reliability
international platform
Quiet on the road
be mod-able
have good resale value
etc
etc
etc
Sir, here are your options:
Land Cruiser
- Thread starter
- #92
You forgot LX.
Can badge lickers also clean trail grime? Is it a general purpose skill?
YellowJacket
SILVER Star
Funny to find this post after gushing all over my buddy earlier in the day about how at times I wish I could be an A to B guy. (Don't care about anything other than a vehicle that just gets me from A to B) My point to him was how much I just absolutely LOVE my TLC. This is my third. I loved my 80, loved my 100, but now, the 200? Geez man. Sometimes when I get in a dark place, I think to myself, "All I need is a 200, money for fuel, and an unlimited car wash pass and nothing else." I'd survive on that. It makes me less surprised finding people who don't mind selling their house to have a killer TLC and live out of it on a life long adventure.
I live for adventure. Part of it is sentimental. I grew up going camping with my family and in my Grandpa's FJ60, then LX450. The other part is that at times, I use all 8 seatbelts with a blended family. I also truly believe the hype about these cars being the most reliable thing on the road. I won't own anything other than Toyota. I also believe it because I've lived it.
Decades ago, I spent a few years at a local Toyota dealership. All these Toyotas coming in needing work. Just like here, in the forums. But that's the thing, we post about problems. The dealership? We only saw the problems. Of course there was preventative maintenance. But as I'm sure others have said by now, this, like a dealership is, in large part, it's a place to discuss issues. So it's not looking at things accurately. PLUS, what percentage of us here modify our rides and CAUSE problems?
I live for adventure. Part of it is sentimental. I grew up going camping with my family and in my Grandpa's FJ60, then LX450. The other part is that at times, I use all 8 seatbelts with a blended family. I also truly believe the hype about these cars being the most reliable thing on the road. I won't own anything other than Toyota. I also believe it because I've lived it.
Decades ago, I spent a few years at a local Toyota dealership. All these Toyotas coming in needing work. Just like here, in the forums. But that's the thing, we post about problems. The dealership? We only saw the problems. Of course there was preventative maintenance. But as I'm sure others have said by now, this, like a dealership is, in large part, it's a place to discuss issues. So it's not looking at things accurately. PLUS, what percentage of us here modify our rides and CAUSE problems?
I think with any one quality, it's easy to say _____ does it better. The appeal of this platform is that it can do so many things. At an elite level. In one package. So I'm with @Itsky
I'm hard pressed to think of another platform that rolls it all together with this degree of competency?
I'm hard pressed to think of another platform that rolls it all together with this degree of competency?
- Durability and longevity - legendary
- Reliability - perhaps only matched by another Toyota/Lexus or Honda product
- Build Quality - probably only matched other Lexi and other luxury brands, no other Toyota is built to this level of quality
- Comfort and refinement - probably matched only by luxury marquees
- Offroad-ability - very high
- Overlanding - legendary
- Articulation - elite, matched only by off-road specials from the likes of Jeep if the RTI tracker is anything to go by
- Towing - comparable or better than most 1/2 ton trucks
- Overbuilt - HD truck sized parts for a passenger vehicle
- Ride quality and comfort - luxury car level
- Capacities (payload, towing, etc.) - high end of 1/2 tons, additional margin with big bones
- Seating for 8 - minivan level albeit tight
- Date night - better than many
- Heritage - name is synonymous
- Safety - legendary
- Resale - excellent
- Road trips - eats up the miles (and gas)
- MPG - wrong metric, it's smiles per mile
bloc
SILVER Star
Let's keep this in context.. we've seen this twice, maybe three times in this section? Out of how many rigs and people that would come running straight to this board if it popped up?
Your odds of this failure are extremely low in the landcruiser, I'd argue not worth worrying about at all. If it happens you are one of the extremely unlucky ones. Any other vehicle would be far more likely to have equally as catastrophic issues.. it just has a really bad look for something perceived as so dependable otherwise.
- Thread starter
- #97
Im not saying the thing is not dependable. I own one. My second.
What i am saying is I've kinda lost the passion for old faithful here.
And most likely feel this way because, as I've been told here rightfully so by TbIsaacs, im not using it to its potential.
@Tex68w still working on a meetup. So, im looking forward to beating it to s*** at some point and taking out some of my frustrations.
And im still dicking with the thing to get it where i want it. But lets just not pretend there aren't any downsides.
As far as the forum goes, guys, reality check for one second with me, the LC sells one unit a year, and were all here on MUD.
The amount of failures and s*** i see here is abnormal for this reputation to hold true. If it were any other vehicle i would concede the point. But its not.
We are like 50% the sample size of the entire total sales number.
Face the music or not, I'm just expressing my observation. In addition, im worried the 300 will further complicate things.
And yes, i am ignorant of what its like to actually own a jeep, or GM product, or even an f-150 which do hard miles all over USA, And if living in the USA has taught me anything, they are more gung ho about their brand loyalty than yall are.
Point is you can see many examples of trucks lasting out there when taken care of just like those suburbans on the list.
Maybe not to the level of the 200 platform sure, but at the same time, the level of admiration IMO is a little too rosey.
I guarantee you if a nissan xterra or honda cr-v of yore were $90k worth of overbuilt like the LC is they would last just as long.
My family member had at one point put 200k of literally oil change only miles on a 99 CR-V back in the day.
Its not that LC is the best in the world but as a couple of you have put it now, its sort of a unique offering and stands on its own.
Nothing quiet like a $90k Toyota exists that was built with longevity in mind...
The other things at this price point are toys, and aimed at a totally different market segment. And unsurprisingly to me sell much better as well...
I do use the truck very frequently to haul family around, and i pick up a lot of furniture in it. It does get used, i didnt just buy it to complain about it.
But we as all know, there are drawbacks to going into the T fold, and now even they are making moves to correct that.
But sometimes i think maybe they start to tip the scale in my mind and the bells and whistles out there get that much more shiny.
So i came here mostly for horror stories from former LR and G class owners. I did not bargain for the amount bandwagoning but i accept that its my fault. sorry.
Afterall, if frugality wasnt a thing, i wouldn't exactly be here.
If a LR was not absolute dog**** i would be there. If an G63 wasnt quarter million bucks, id be there too.
Perhaps i need to be one of the sell and come back MUD members to get a reality check.
Or keep watching defenders fail on youtube.
But if you think you will out-wheel one of these new trucks theyre putting out there stock for stock your nuts.
Or hook me up with whoever is supplying you that good good dope.
With the right amount of care and consideration, this thing can be a do it all marvel and last a long time.
Its just the ommitance of the care and consideration part that i commented on earlier,.
Im not throwing the towel in because i have a wobbly mirror and need to replace a belt next week, a tensioner and idler.
But it would be nice if it was acknowledged that there are issues.
So apologies for any hyperbole, but if im being honest thats happening more in favor of the LC than against.
And in any case IM NOT SELLING!!!!
What i am saying is I've kinda lost the passion for old faithful here.
And most likely feel this way because, as I've been told here rightfully so by TbIsaacs, im not using it to its potential.
@Tex68w still working on a meetup. So, im looking forward to beating it to s*** at some point and taking out some of my frustrations.
And im still dicking with the thing to get it where i want it. But lets just not pretend there aren't any downsides.
As far as the forum goes, guys, reality check for one second with me, the LC sells one unit a year, and were all here on MUD.
The amount of failures and s*** i see here is abnormal for this reputation to hold true. If it were any other vehicle i would concede the point. But its not.
We are like 50% the sample size of the entire total sales number.
Face the music or not, I'm just expressing my observation. In addition, im worried the 300 will further complicate things.
And yes, i am ignorant of what its like to actually own a jeep, or GM product, or even an f-150 which do hard miles all over USA, And if living in the USA has taught me anything, they are more gung ho about their brand loyalty than yall are.
Point is you can see many examples of trucks lasting out there when taken care of just like those suburbans on the list.
Maybe not to the level of the 200 platform sure, but at the same time, the level of admiration IMO is a little too rosey.
I guarantee you if a nissan xterra or honda cr-v of yore were $90k worth of overbuilt like the LC is they would last just as long.
My family member had at one point put 200k of literally oil change only miles on a 99 CR-V back in the day.
Its not that LC is the best in the world but as a couple of you have put it now, its sort of a unique offering and stands on its own.
Nothing quiet like a $90k Toyota exists that was built with longevity in mind...
The other things at this price point are toys, and aimed at a totally different market segment. And unsurprisingly to me sell much better as well...
I do use the truck very frequently to haul family around, and i pick up a lot of furniture in it. It does get used, i didnt just buy it to complain about it.
But we as all know, there are drawbacks to going into the T fold, and now even they are making moves to correct that.
But sometimes i think maybe they start to tip the scale in my mind and the bells and whistles out there get that much more shiny.
So i came here mostly for horror stories from former LR and G class owners. I did not bargain for the amount bandwagoning but i accept that its my fault. sorry.
Afterall, if frugality wasnt a thing, i wouldn't exactly be here.
If a LR was not absolute dog**** i would be there. If an G63 wasnt quarter million bucks, id be there too.
Perhaps i need to be one of the sell and come back MUD members to get a reality check.
Or keep watching defenders fail on youtube.
But if you think you will out-wheel one of these new trucks theyre putting out there stock for stock your nuts.
Or hook me up with whoever is supplying you that good good dope.
With the right amount of care and consideration, this thing can be a do it all marvel and last a long time.
Its just the ommitance of the care and consideration part that i commented on earlier,.
Im not throwing the towel in because i have a wobbly mirror and need to replace a belt next week, a tensioner and idler.
But it would be nice if it was acknowledged that there are issues.
So apologies for any hyperbole, but if im being honest thats happening more in favor of the LC than against.
And in any case IM NOT SELLING!!!!
scottm
SILVER Star
Unimog. But it fails in various important metrics, and I'll still take the LC for a daily. But if I had unlimited $, I'd also have a Unimog.
I think a Honda passport would be perfect for OP.Im not saying the thing is not dependable. I own one. My second.
What i am saying is I've kinda lost the passion for old faithful here.
And most likely feel this way because, as I've been told here rightfully so by TbIsaacs, im not using it to its potential.
@Tex68w still working on a meetup. So, im looking forward to beating it to s*** at some point and taking out some of my frustrations.
And im still dicking with the thing to get it where i want it. But lets just not pretend there aren't any downsides.
As far as the forum goes, guys, reality check for one second with me, the LC sells one unit a year, and were all here on MUD.
The amount of failures and s*** i see here is abnormal for this reputation to hold true. If it were any other vehicle i would concede the point. But its not.
We are like 50% the sample size of the entire total sales number.
Face the music or not, I'm just expressing my observation. In addition, im worried the 300 will further complicate things.
And yes, i am ignorant of what its like to actually own a jeep, or GM product, or even an f-150 which do hard miles all over USA, And if living in the USA has taught me anything, they are more gung ho about their brand loyalty than yall are.
Point is you can see many examples of trucks lasting out there when taken care of just like those suburbans on the list.
Maybe not to the level of the 200 platform sure, but at the same time, the level of admiration IMO is a little too rosey.
I guarantee you if a nissan xterra or honda cr-v of yore were $90k worth of overbuilt like the LC is they would last just as long.
My family member had at one point put 200k of literally oil change only miles on a 99 CR-V back in the day.
Its not that LC is the best in the world but as a couple of you have put it now, its sort of a unique offering and stands on its own.
Nothing quiet like a $90k Toyota exists that was built with longevity in mind...
The other things at this price point are toys, and aimed at a totally different market segment. And unsurprisingly to me sell much better as well...
I do use the truck very frequently to haul family around, and i pick up a lot of furniture in it. It does get used, i didnt just buy it to complain about it.
But we as all know, there are drawbacks to going into the T fold, and now even they are making moves to correct that.
But sometimes i think maybe they start to tip the scale in my mind and the bells and whistles out there get that much more shiny.
So i came here mostly for horror stories from former LR and G class owners. I did not bargain for the amount bandwagoning but i accept that its my fault. sorry.
Afterall, if frugality wasnt a thing, i wouldn't exactly be here.
If a LR was not absolute dogs*** i would be there. If an G63 wasnt quarter million bucks, id be there too.
Perhaps i need to be one of the sell and come back MUD members to get a reality check.
Or keep watching defenders fail on youtube.
But if you think you will out-wheel one of these new trucks theyre putting out there stock for stock your nuts.
Or hook me up with whoever is supplying you that good good dope.
With the right amount of care and consideration, this thing can be a do it all marvel and last a long time.
Its just the ommitance of the care and consideration part that i commented on earlier,.
Im not throwing the towel in because i have a wobbly mirror and need to replace a belt next week, a tensioner and idler.
But it would be nice if it was acknowledged that there are issues.
So apologies for any hyperbole, but if im being honest thats happening more in favor of the LC than against.
And in any case IM NOT SELLING!!!!
My loyalty to Toyota badge comes from 10 years of driving fantastic vehicles. My hate for Chevy comes from driving an $80k turd. Life experiences and whatnot.
Op, why are you driving a 200? What’s your mission? Drive a 200 on the beach, or through a hurricane. Drive one in a blizzard. Wreck one and let it save your family from harm. Or don’t. Put a blower on it and beat the crap out of it is the definition of FAFO.
bloc
SILVER Star
This right here.
