Help Me Fix My 2013 LX Loose Front End Part 6 (2 Viewers)

[Dashome]

Hopefully OP resolves this with accumulator replacement and AHC flush. Certainly this underscores the complexity of dynamic suspensions. I had an 03 GX that I maintained the air suspension on until 265k miles, and it comes with inconvenience.... Such as the airbag finally succumbing to a leak on a Saturday night when the mother in law and kids were riding in the back for 700 miles, ouch.

Although I planned to upgrade to a LX, I selected the LC for this and other reasons. My wife is always talking about how well the LC rides, even with AT tires running at recommended pressure, and she used to have a Range Rover. A properly tuned static setup should perform well and offer more consistent reliability than the dynamic setup.

Given, I don't know the OP's goals, I feel like they're similar to mine with the GX, he'll hopefully get the improvement desired with another $1500ish. However, given my transition to a LC with static suspension, I'd have no qualms making the swap from AHC to Static. Keep us posted.

BTW I do give credit to the OP for the frustration, it's seemingly hard to find a LX and getting a test drive is extra frustrating dealing with the weeks of follow-up sales calls, and actually taking advice and spending money to address issues instead of trying the suspension equivalent of replacing the gas cap to resolve the exhaust emissions codes when the entire system is clearly rusted out.

 

[xhrix123]

ICON suspension's feel is literally the opposite of what you've described: it is stiff & uncomfortable on road/slow speeds, and softens up & becomes more comfortable with speed. Furthermore, both their products and customer service are utter crap. Source: experience.

I hate being a negative nancy three posts in a row, but please learn about the suspension before suggesting someone tears out their AHC to replace it with your recommendation.

Maybe looking at what this gentleman was trying to solve vs being contrarian would be more productive and immediately chastising people with a different opinion to you as not knowing anything would also be better also, but I am sure you wont like this feedback either.

 

[TeCKis300]

Hopefully OP resolves this with accumulator replacement and AHC flush. Certainly this underscores the complexity of dynamic suspensions. I had an 03 GX that I maintained the air suspension on until 265k miles, and it comes with inconvenience.... Such as the airbag finally succumbing to a leak on a Saturday night when the mother in law and kids were riding in the back for 700 miles, ouch.

Although I planned to upgrade to a LX, I selected the LC for this and other reasons. My wife is always talking about how well the LC rides, even with AT tires running at recommended pressure, and she used to have a Range Rover. A properly tuned static setup should perform well and offer more consistent reliability than the dynamic setup.

Given, I don't know the OP's goals, I feel like they're similar to mine with the GX, he'll hopefully get the improvement desired with another $1500ish. However, given my transition to a LC with static suspension, I'd have no qualms making the swap from AHC to Static. Keep us posted.

BTW I do give credit to the OP for the frustration, it's seemingly hard to find a LX and getting a test drive is extra frustrating dealing with the weeks of follow-up sales calls, and actually taking advice and spending money to address issues instead of trying the suspension equivalent of replacing the gas cap to resolve the exhaust emissions codes when the entire system is clearly rusted out.

So you're aware, the LX AHC suspension has almost no similarity to your GX suspension. That's not a knock on the GX as I hold them in high esteem. My parents have one with KDSS, adjustable dampers, and rear air and I find the system excellent. 265k miles before an issue or failure would be more than anyone can ask out of anything IMO. And wouldn't be a reason to avoid something. AHC has many examples that have lasted as long. All suspensions as a wear item, would need to be maintained or fixed well before, including any static system on the LC. Aftermarket, well, we'll need to lower the bar a lot more.

AHC is its own animal and shouldn't be interpreted like GX with air suspension - one would give up a lot of capability by going to a static suspension. Because it's an active hydraulic system (not airbag!) with full control of height, multiple spring rates, damping, preload, between and cross axle damping - there's no equivalent out there that can offer the broad competency and diametric qualities: tailored ride height for hwy stability while providing large off-road clearance, controlled and optimal ride unladen or with 1800lbs, and can handle stock 31s or 35s on enthusiast off-road trips without any upgrades.

I'm all for helping the OP diagnose and fix the issues he's experiencing. Unfortunately it's been a case of throwing parts at a problem and still not finding the issue. From the symptoms, this is not normal, and everyone should not be jumping on the bandwagon assuming this is typical for AHC. It's one of the finest performing and highest durability suspensions out there. Maybe the thread title is not helping here.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Maybe looking at what this gentleman was trying to solve vs being contrarian would be more productive and immediately chastising people with a different opinion to you as not knowing anything would also be better also, but I am sure you wont like this feedback either.

How digressive suspension works is not open to "opinions." It's clear you still haven't bothered to look it up.

 

[milellie111]

So you're aware, the LX AHC suspension has almost no similarity to your GX suspension. That's not a knock on the GX as I hold them in high esteem. My parents have one with KDSS, adjustable dampers, and rear air and I find the system excellent. 265k miles before an issue or failure would be more than anyone can ask out of anything IMO. And wouldn't be a reason to avoid something. AHC has many examples that have lasted as long. All suspensions as a wear item, would need to be maintained or fixed well before, including any static system on the LC. Aftermarket, well, we'll need to lower the bar a lot more.

AHC is its own animal and shouldn't be interpreted like GX with air suspension - one would give up a lot of capability by going to a static suspension. Because it's an active hydraulic system (not airbag!) with full control of height, multiple spring rates, damping, preload, between and cross axle damping - there's no equivalent out there that can offer the broad competency and diametric qualities: tailored ride height for hwy stability while providing large off-road clearance, controlled and optimal ride unladen or with 1800lbs, and can handle stock 31s or 35s on enthusiast off-road trips without any upgrades.

I'm all for helping the OP diagnose and fix the issues he's experiencing. Unfortunately it's been a case of throwing parts at a problem and still not finding the issue. From the symptoms, this is not normal, and everyone should not be jumping on the bandwagon assuming this is typical for AHC. It's one of the finest performing and highest durability suspensions out there. Maybe the thread title is not helping here.

I changed the title

 

[xhrix123]

How digressive suspension works is not open to "opinions." It's clear you still haven't bothered to look it up.

How about this I will look it up if you ask the gentleman what he is trying to solve. And then see if there is an application for it.

just because you dont like Icon and had a bad experience does not mean nobody can like it. Maybe they didnt give you the customer service you expected because they didnt want you as a customer. I could see that happening…

 

[Dashome]

So you're aware, the LX AHC suspension has almost no similarity to your GX suspension. That's not a knock on the GX as I hold them in high esteem. My parents have one with KDSS, adjustable dampers, and rear air and I find the system excellent. 265k miles before an issue or failure would be more than anyone can ask out of anything IMO. And wouldn't be a reason to avoid something. AHC has many examples that have lasted as long. All suspensions as a wear item, would need to be maintained or fixed well before, including any static system on the LC. Aftermarket, well, we'll need to lower the bar a lot more.

AHC is its own animal and shouldn't be interpreted like GX with air suspension - one would give up a lot of capability by going to a static suspension. Because it's an active hydraulic system (not airbag!) with full control of height, multiple spring rates, damping, preload, between and cross axle damping - there's no equivalent out there that can offer the broad competency and diametric qualities: tailored ride height for hwy stability while providing large off-road clearance, controlled and optimal ride unladen or with 1800lbs, and can handle stock 31s or 35s on enthusiast off-road trips without any upgrades.

I'm all for helping the OP diagnose and fix the issues he's experiencing. Unfortunately it's been a case of throwing parts at a problem and still not finding the issue. From the symptoms, this is not normal, and everyone should not be jumping on the bandwagon assuming this is typical for AHC. It's one of the finest performing and highest durability suspensions out there. Maybe the thread title is not helping here.

Absolutely, I am aware of the differences and made mine based on a qualitative ratio of comfort, capability, and risk of failure. I also made it a point to acknowledge OP may prefer to maintain OEM capability. I agree I got a long life out of mine, but the forums will show you many that didn't. I actually had the failure around 200k, still a great life. Other than the benefit of leveling it out while towing, I've been equally as happy with a static setup with respect to comfort.

 

[Romer]

@milellie111 many are frustrated because you have opened multiple threads on the same topic. Many turn to chat and it doesn't appear from my quick read that you come back with detailed results when suggestions are made

From reading your posts I don't think you are trolling, but there may be some communication issues.

You have had this problem a long time it would seem. From reading the couple of threads I can't really get what you issues is and what specifically you have done to isolate it. There are pieces over many pages, it just isn't easy to understand

Lets remove the chat from the conversation and do the following

discuss your issues, what's wrong

list in detail what you have done to address it with any results

You stay clear, short and to the facts and everyone else try and not be hostile

If this thread continues to meander, I will close it and any more on the topic

Let us work together to help solve the problem

Your friendly 200 series Moderator

 

[milellie111]

@milellie111 many are frustrated because you have opened multiple threads on the same topic. Many turn to chat and it doesn't appear from my quick read that you come back with detailed results when suggestions are made

From reading your posts I don't think you are trolling, but there may be some communication issues.

You have had this problem a long time it would seem. From reading the couple of threads I can't really get what you issues is and what specifically you have done to isolate it. There are pieces over many pages, it just isn't easy to understand

Lets remove the chat from the conversation and do the following

discuss your issues, what's wrong

list in detail what you have done to address it with any results

You stay clear, short and to the facts and everyone else try and not be hostile

If this thread continues to meander, I will close it and any more on the topic

Let us work together to help solve the problem

Your friendly 200 series Moderator

I‘ve taken all of the suggestions on here replacing suspension components, rotating tires etc and reported I was still having the issue. I’ve even posted alignment sheets as requested. I was having 3 issues which may or may not have been related to the other which is why different threads were started. 1. Vehicle pulling (proper alignment and seized caster bolt replacement seems to have fixed) 2. Steering wheel not properly returning to center after some quick full lock u-turns (told by dealer there are no faults in VGRS and most likely behaves normal) and 3. The excessive movement and wobble of the steering wheel over bumps and instability of the vehicle.

#3 is the issue I am focused on. Another member had the exact same issue who no longer appears to be on the forum (TTO5). Everyone here said to start with alignment, bushings, tie rods, tire pressures, rotating tires, all of which I did. At times it felt better and I thought it was fixed but realized it wasn’t and has just gradually gotten worse. Now, I have been pointed towards the AHC accumulators as the culprit. I’ve ordered the accumulators. I have taken the suggestions on here and I am following through and hopefully will report back with good news.

 

[Romer]

I‘ve taken all of the suggestions on here replacing suspension components, rotating tires etc and reported I was still having the issue. I’ve even posted alignment sheets as requested. I was having 3 issues which may or may not have been related to the other which is why different threads were started. 1. Vehicle pulling (proper alignment and seized caster bolt replacement seems to have fixed) 2. Steering wheel not properly returning to center after some quick full lock u-turns (told by dealer there are no faults in VGRS and most likely behaves normal) and 3. The excessive movement and wobble of the steering wheel over bumps and instability of the vehicle.

#3 is the issue I am focused on. Another member had the exact same issue who no longer appears to be on the forum (TTO5). Everyone here said to start with alignment, bushings, tie rods, tire pressures, rotating tires, all of which I did. At times it felt better and I thought it was fixed but realized it wasn’t and has just gradually gotten worse. Now, I have been pointed towards the AHC accumulators as the culprit. I’ve ordered the accumulators. I have taken the suggestions on here and I am following through and hopefully will report back with good news.

Thanks for the crisp summary. Lets wait and see what the results are before moving forward in this thread so we dont lose sight of the issue and current path

 

[PDoyle]

@milellie111 take a quick look at this video I found on U tube.

 

[milellie111]

@milellie111 take a quick look at this video I found on U tube.

@PDoyle What was the problem?

 

[paulunm]

@PDoyle What was the problem?

If you read the comments on that youtube video, he was asked just that- and responded that Lexus couldn't figure it out and he had them take the truck back.

 

[PDoyle]

Yes thank you Paulunm.
That to me resembles what you have described. I may be wrong of course.

 

[bentonrover]

Strangely my LX470 did just that out the blue one day. I changed all brake components, new michlens tires, numerous tire balancing and rotations at lexus. Nothing changed. They said it was normal? I feel his pain and frustration. Especially after it was driving so smooth for so long. Week later traded it to purchase a 200 LC

 

[Zjohnsonua]

Before this goes into the weeds again, @milellie111 , does that video show what you are describing? Or is your issue something else?

 

[lx200inAR]

Any chance doing a VGRS calibration might help with this. I only have anecdotal evidence, but i know anytime i've messed with my height sensors, The first mile or two after the change my steering definitely acted weird. For me it has always been self healing, but maybe his got too far out of whack. I know the OP mentioned that Lexus said there were "no codes" with VGRS, but may still want to try the calibration. I think it's a pretty simple procedure with Techstream and level ground.

 

[grinchy]

Maybe it’s the AHC ECU? It’s not particularly hard to get to in the left side behind the third row seat 1/4 panel.

 

[milellie111]

Before this goes into the weeds again, @milellie111 , does that video show what you are describing? Or is your issue something else?

My issue is a significant loose feeling through the steering wheel and significant movement of the steering wheel over bumps causing instability in the front end. It gets worse going from sport to comfort. Also the truck has become way more floaty. Bad accumulators are the next suggested culprit which I have on order. I hope that significantly improves my situation.

It’s hard to tell from that video, but his steering wheel seems to just have significant vibration while driving even on smooth roads. Not sure if we have the same issue or not.

 

[milellie111]

Any chance doing a VGRS calibration might help with this. I only have anecdotal evidence, but i know anytime i've messed with my height sensors, The first mile or two after the change my steering definitely acted weird. For me it has always been self healing, but maybe his got too far out of whack. I know the OP mentioned that Lexus said there were "no codes" with VGRS, but may still want to try the calibration. I think it's a pretty simple procedure with Techstream and level ground.

VGRS calibration was done at Lexus dealer