Glucosamine treatment for an old warrior

[Scott68FJ40]

I hadn't driven a cruiser in about a year so I took one of his for a few laps around his place.

 

[Cdaniel]

Anyone have any insight on the differences in stock FJ40 springs having the clamps at different ends through the years? I've got no idea of the years of these. Curious.

 

[Cdaniel]

A little bit O Sunday garage time...

So with the 1st test fit of some stock springs on top with my new set up tacked in place. Holy wheelie Batman!
I know I'm missing some weight right now, but wow.

Just to see what would happen I put the trans and xfer in the tub, plopped the fenders and other misc pieces up front and it dropped about 3/4".

My springs in the rear run nearly flat. and it turns out that those have one less leaf than the these in the front. So next I guess I'll be pulling a leaf (or two) out of the front.

Put together, take apart, put together, take apart......

 

[Scott68FJ40]

Do you need some stock springs? I have a full set out of my 68 here in my garage that would love to find a new home.

 

[Cdaniel]

Do you need some stock springs? I have a full set out of my 68 here in my garage that would love to find a new home.

It couldn't hurt to have a look at some other old stuff.

 

[subzali]

I'm pretty sure that the front spring pack was intended to have an extra leaf over the rear to support the weight of the F/2F. I'm sure you could find it somewhere on MUD with some searching.

I'm not a SBC or a Saginaw guy, but I really enjoy finding this thread with new posts in it. Hope you are getting close to finished so you don't miss too much of the wheeling season!

If it were me with what you have already, I would put the Saginaw back in. You've been running it forever and other folks run them forever, I would maybe adjust its location relative to the cross member and/or reinforce the hole in the crossmember and call it good for another 17 years or however long you've had it.

 

[Cdaniel]

I'm pretty sure that the front spring pack was intended to have an extra leaf over the rear to support the weight of the F/2F. I'm sure you could find it somewhere on MUD with some searching.

I'm not a SBC or a Saginaw guy, but I really enjoy finding this thread with new posts in it. Hope you are getting close to finished so you don't miss too much of the wheeling season!

If it were me with what you have already, I would put the Saginaw back in. You've been running it forever and other folks run them forever, I would maybe adjust its location relative to the cross member and/or reinforce the hole in the crossmember and call it good for another 17 years or however long you've had it.

Miss wheelin' season? Spoken like a true Mile High Man. Wheelin' season is over dude. At least it is if you're running an open top FJ40. The furnace is coming on over here. I grew up in Denver and surely miss the summers there.

I'll be lucky to get this thing rolling again before the next season ends.

Thanks for the input, but I'm confused by what you mean by the extra leaf over the rear?

And after scanning your FJ60 PS install, I would think you would be more of a fan of me going the Scout route possibly. Any regrets with that?

I think re doing what I had would be fine, but the box behind the cross member has got to be stronger.

It's amazing how much flex there is in the frame without the bumper attached. No matter what the set up I'll be boxing all that in and improving the bumper too.

 

[subzali]

Miss wheelin' season? Spoken like a true Mile High Man. Wheelin' season is over dude. At least it is if you're running an open top FJ40. The furnace is coming on over here. I grew up in Denver and surely miss the summers there.

Figured that, depending on whereabouts in AZ you lived, maybe the weather would be a little more temperate.

I'll be lucky to get this thing rolling again before the next season ends.

Thanks for the input, but I'm confused by what you mean by the extra leaf over the rear?

I meant that I think the front leaf pack has one more leaf in it than the rear leaf pack has, at least from the factory. I think the front pack has 9 leaves, the rear has 8 leaves, or something like that. I'm probably wrong though.

And after scanning your FJ60 PS install, I would think you would be more of a fan of me going the Scout route possibly. Any regrets with that?

I love my FJ60 ps for my 31" tires and because it was something I wanted to try on this vehicle. For another, more trail dedicated and less stock vehicle, I might consider going Saginaw. I am fighting a belt squealing issue which I don't know if it's being caused by a narrow belt on a wide pulley or not being able to get enough tension with my ps pump mount. I think maybe a little of both. But I haven't taken it into technical rocks yet so I'm not really sure how it's going to do when put to the test. And I'm not sure if a Scout box can handle higher loads than an FJ60 box; the 3 bolt configuration always weirded me out a little bit. But from my reading here on MUD a Saginaw will provide more boost with larger tires than the others will; and so I figure if you haven't had any problems with it in the past why change? It would be a bummer for you to go to all the work of changing the steering box configuration around only to find out you're not happy with how it performs as compared to your old setup.

 

[Cdaniel]

Figured that, depending on whereabouts in AZ you lived, maybe the weather would be a little more temperate.

Some day,... some day. I hope to be a snow bird, but I would fly back to the Rockies. Not these meager mountains we have here.

I meant that I think the front leaf pack has one more leaf in it than the rear leaf pack has, at least from the factory. I think the front pack has 9 leaves, the rear has 8 leaves, or something like that. I'm probably wrong though.

Ahh got it. Makes sense, but news to me. I've always wondered why there were front and rear springs when the lengths were the same. I guess I got lucky when I picked the rear set to put in the rear.
I've got two front pairs to pick from now. Maybe I can get a pair of rears for the front from Woods.

...... I'm not really sure how it's going to do when put to the test. And I'm not sure if a Scout box can handle higher loads than an FJ60 box; the 3 bolt configuration always weirded me out a little bit. But from my reading here on MUD a Saginaw will provide more boost with larger tires than the others will; and so I figure if you haven't had any problems with it in the past why change? It would be a bummer for you to go to all the work of changing the steering box configuration around only to find out you're not happy with how it performs as compared to your old setup.

Good points. As I understand it the Scout Saginaw is internally the same as any other Saginaw. So no worries there, but 3 bolts?
I guess International was good with it. I don't know. The work will have to be done no matter which way I go. Except I do have the previous mounting plate at this point.

And honestly the current box isn't as good since the addition of 35's. I've been pondering one of those souped up versions from AGR. But $$$$$

 

[Scott68FJ40]

There yours if you want them. I would be happy to get them out of my garage, but I don't want to just throw them away either.

 

[pb4ugo]

If you do some research, maybe on pirate, I think you can drill out the saginaw ports to increase internal flow & power in the sag box instead of going AGR or maybe it was the pump. As for the 3 bolts on the scout box, they are considerably larger than the 3/8 bolts on your old box. When I did mine, I sleeved my frame for the bolts so I wouldn't crush the frame rails & scabed the outside of the frame approx 3/4' w/flat stk, so i didn't have to move the rad over as much. I oblonged the mtg holes for the rad & then welded in a washers for the new location. I already had sag out front so really all I had to do was shorten my steering shaft in the engine compartment, scab & sleeve, ford shock mount, & I purchase a wagoneer 4" drop pitman arm. The pitman arm was specific for my application, i don't know if it will work for you. I also had th shorten my drag link. The drag link runs close to parallel on 2 planes of the tie rod which eliminated bump steer. I know there's a mud member who tapped his scabbed plate for the bolts so the did'nt have to do any sleeving.

 

[Cdaniel]

Small step

Garage time was short this week, at least for the Cruiser. Spent half of my day rounding up and installing a starter in the wife's 66 Stang. Pulled it out of the garage for the 1st time in 9 months and went to the local Saturday night car show. Try to start it to come home and the @#$$&*^ starter drive broke. $100 tow home and unload at 1 am left me a little burnt out.

Anyway, got them stocker springs from Woods (Tanks!) And set out to put in a pair of rears on the front....now it's an inch higher than before. These must be in much better shape the other sets I have.

So, I went at a pair of fronts and took out the 3 shortest leafs and put those in. 2 inches lower and a more acceptable shackle angle. I think I'm in the ball park now once all the missing weight is put back.

Before:

After:

 

[Cdaniel]

Some more trial fitting. Took the plasma to my free previously whacked cross member to make some room to tuck in the steering box more. .....And I took out a bit more than necessary Oh well, if I go with this config I'll cover it up with an escutcheon plate. Looks like it would work out pretty well with the oringal mounting plate reused. Had to remove a corner of it to clear the spring hanger.

Put the bib back on to ponder where the hoses would go too.

Scout box is looking better all the time ;p

Time to start thinking about high steer arms too.

 

[Cdaniel]

Mmmmmm, fresh flywheel....

 

[Cdaniel]

Getting spring perches lined up........

 

[Cdaniel]

Scout box in the house..


pb4ugo I'd sure like to see some pics of your installation. Or anyone else's for that matter. There's a lot of talk and some pics out there, but I'd like to see more.

 

[Cdaniel]

Final welding on the frame extensions done. The inside areas will be boxed once the front cross member replacement is complete.

Not the prettiest, but effective I think.

Vertical and upside down welding sucks

 

[Cdaniel]

other side

 

[Cdaniel]

The beginnings of the Scout box mock up.....trying to figure out what sheet metal trimming will be needed. Looking like this is the way to go, plus I now have a non hacked front cross member to install with this setup. It needs to get dipped because it has a curious black over white paint job. Some paint stripper and a pressure wash took most of the black off, but the white is dug in good.

Who paints their frame white?

Broke my sand blast cabinet window this weekend too.

 

[pb4ugo]

I'll try to take some pics tonight. I didn't do any work to the fender until I was ready to bolt it on. During the mock up be sure to include the rad support. It will have to be shifted over to the pass side
slightly. I egg shaped the mtg holes in the frame mounts then welded washers for the new location.