So i will be in the market for a 40 in a month. The debate i am having is to go gas or diesel. It will be my everyday, all the time vehicle. I will also be keeping for a long long time. With this in mind, my question(s) would be how are parts for diesels? I am thinking long term so i average cost. spend more now vs later? Resale value is not a concern, as i don not plan to flip or sell if i dont have to. Its more of longevity. Any thoughts?
Gas Vs Diesel
- Thread starter cruiser9
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What kind of 40 Series are you looking for FJ40,(gas) or BJ40/41/42/45? They offer a variety of diesel engines ( 2B, 3B, H, 2H ) all of which are very reliable powerplants and offer good fuel economy.
..........1978HJ45
..........1978HJ45
My $.02.
Diesel will cost you 1/2 for fuel, Parts when you need them are somewhat more expensive, B motors last so long, diesel will lug down lower when wheeling off road, they aren't quick on the road, there is a good reason many are swapping diesels into Fj40s.
I drive a 350 powered Fj, can't justify cost/time/energy to swap in a diesel, not my only DD, 300 hp is a lot of Fun.
Diesel will cost you 1/2 for fuel, Parts when you need them are somewhat more expensive, B motors last so long, diesel will lug down lower when wheeling off road, they aren't quick on the road, there is a good reason many are swapping diesels into Fj40s.
I drive a 350 powered Fj, can't justify cost/time/energy to swap in a diesel, not my only DD, 300 hp is a lot of Fun.
Diesel Diesel Diesel Diesel !!
I miss my BJ42! I got an average mileage of 22-23 mpg with the stock H42 4 speed factory 4.11 diffs and some 33x10.50-15 mud terrains. Parts are more expensive and harder to come by but the trade off in mileage and just cool factor make up for it, not to mention on an old diesel like these there is little bit to nothing to go wrong on them other than electrical.
I miss my BJ42! I got an average mileage of 22-23 mpg with the stock H42 4 speed factory 4.11 diffs and some 33x10.50-15 mud terrains. Parts are more expensive and harder to come by but the trade off in mileage and just cool factor make up for it, not to mention on an old diesel like these there is little bit to nothing to go wrong on them other than electrical.
To do it over, Diesel for a DD.
20 years ago diesels were sooooo out of my price range. At 18, I didn't have 10-15k lying around. Now diesel isn't very much more.
20 years ago diesels were sooooo out of my price range. At 18, I didn't have 10-15k lying around. Now diesel isn't very much more.
One bad thing about a diesel is not all gas stations sell it, can be a drag when you are running low and every station you pull into does not have diesel. Probably depends on where you are, but an old Mercedes diesel we had was kind of a drag when you needed to fill it up.
Diesel.
They are slow, stinky, rattly, but you have great low end torque and the cool factor is worth it.
The stock 3B is a great motor, and has the side skirt oilers for the pistons if you want to go turbo later to pep it up. If you want better road manners, you can swap to an H55 tranny to give you the taller top gear.
One of the guys in our club did a 13BT conversion with an H55, and man was that a great conversion.
For the time being, the 3B is easy to get parts for from Mr. Yota and there are a bunch of Canadian vendors that have the stuff that your dealership might not try to get for you.
My $.02
I have a M300D that can get almost 700 miles to a tank, I'll find a gas station sooner or later
They are slow, stinky, rattly, but you have great low end torque and the cool factor is worth it.
The stock 3B is a great motor, and has the side skirt oilers for the pistons if you want to go turbo later to pep it up. If you want better road manners, you can swap to an H55 tranny to give you the taller top gear.
One of the guys in our club did a 13BT conversion with an H55, and man was that a great conversion.
For the time being, the 3B is easy to get parts for from Mr. Yota and there are a bunch of Canadian vendors that have the stuff that your dealership might not try to get for you.
My $.02
I have a M300D that can get almost 700 miles to a tank, I'll find a gas station sooner or later
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I had a B diesel in my BJ40 which I swapped for a current production 1HZ. I ran the original B for 16 months and it ran great, slow but fine for a city driving DD. It was excellent off road. The 1HZ runs great. I´m turbocharging and intercooling it now. But even without the turbo the 1HZ ran fine on the highway and great off road. Regarding not all gas stations have it, the Dodge Cummins and the Ford Powersmoke guys have to gas up somewhere just figure it out and plan. In Washington DC for example I can think of at least three gas stations that have it within 10 minutes of my Dad´s house, three more within 10 of my brother´s place accross the line in Maryland As to parts remember the parts scarcity is for the older diesel engines. If the engine is out of production then parts get scarce. The trick is that Toyota has been pretty good about keeping a lot of parts the same within engine families. I often found that while the parts department couldn´t find the part under the B engine it could in a search under the 3b or even the 13BT. In fact I often run accross parts not found in a 70 series search in searches fin the Coaster bus parts database. You just have to be creative. That being said you can do what we all do, hoard hard to come by critical parts for a rainiy day.
As to parts remember the parts scarcity is for the older diesel engines. If the engine is out of production then parts get scarce. The trick is that Toyota has been pretty good about keeping a lot of parts the same within engine families. I often found that while the parts department couldn´t find the part under the B engine it could in a search under the 3b or even the 13BT. In fact I often run accross parts not found in a 70 series search in searches fin the Coaster bus parts database. You just have to be creative. That being said you can do what we all do, hoard hard to come by critical parts for a rainiy day.- Thread starter
- #10
Guys that was a fantastic reply!..As for what series 40. I had a 78 gas powered. Loved it loved it loved it. That said, I am not doing any serious off road as I live on a flat island ( Long Island ). I have been going back and forth and asking lots of questions before I pull the trigger. I thank the guys on here btw. I am not into the Chevy conversion thing ( nothing wrong with it just not my thing ). I would say bj 40, or 42 ( i am not sure of the model # but the one thats slightly larger than a 40 but not a troopy.). Someone has said something to the effect of a forklift motor? And i work in a marina, so apparently some of the Yanmar diesels are built by Toyota. Again I am thinking long term. So what would be a range of price? I am looking at 10-12 for a gas 40 ( at least that seems to be average anyways so far ). Thank you guys! I hope I can return the advice someday!
brian
SILVER Star
if you look at the numbers on paper between the 2f, 3b and 2h, the 2f has more hp and more torque, that comes in at a lower rpm.
fuel mileage would be up, but that's about it.
fuel mileage would be up, but that's about it.
When you drive a Diesel long enough (a week or two tops for your area) you will notice that many places have Diesel only time I would ever be concerned is when on a long road trip in unfamiliar area but having also done that a few times I have noticed that most stations off of the main freeways will have Diesel, you will also learn what chains do not carry Diesel and know not to waste your time even looking.
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- #14
well as far as the fuel situation goes, i live in a rural area. Dont have a freeway ( its about a half hour from me ) but there are two stations within 10 mins from my house, that have diesel. I dont need alot of power as I am not offroading like I see on here ( would love to but there is no place to do it ) I am used to going slow my 78 would do 55 maybe 60 tops, mostly it was 45 50. It is going to be my solid dd, getting through snow, an occasional beach run but thats it. As far as conversion goes, are all 40s able to fit a diesel? Meaning are the frames different from a 2f and factory diesel?
brian
SILVER Star
pretty sure the motor mounts are in different locations.
If you can find a good example, I would definitely go Diesel. Of course I am biased as I have only owned a diesel. Good luck, hope you find what your looking for.
- Thread starter
- #17
Thank you, been looking for a few months. I know what i want ( in terms of condition) just the whole engine thing, but I dont see a whole of diesels available..one on ebay but something about black smoke due to the fact that the po put conditioner in the fuel? Sounds like its dumping fuel..anyways...so my choice may be made for me. The hunt/ capture is on!
I enjoy having a truck that is reliable, and easy to repair. While I can get diesel parts, they aren't avaliable like f motor parts. You can't run down to AutoZone and get a fuel or air filter. Plus, I can pickup 3 fuel injected F engines for the price of one diesel.
This is why I am putting a 3fe in my 40.
This is why I am putting a 3fe in my 40.
If you go and lurk over in the Diesel section, there are several that are scared of the 3B, 13B-T, 2H, 12H-T, etc. because they are no longer in production and have been replaced by the 1HZ, HD-T, 15B-T, etc. which are still currently being produced. (disclaimer: I don't own a Toyota diesel so I don't know firsthand any of this, but this is what I've heard so you may want to look into it) Some parts are already supposedly becoming scarce for the 3B etc. from Toyota, so some say that if you're considering a motor replacement/diesel swap to look at current production engines because parts will be available for a long long time from now. A 3B was stock for BJ42s and 13B-T fits pretty well into an FJ40/BJ42 because it's a very similar engine (and there are many examples of both on this site), but some guys have done 1HZ/1HD-T swaps as well, which seem to be a little more of a shoehorn to get everything to fit up right (but again there are some swap threads on this site you can take a look at). crushers, rutbeer, JABXYZ and some others come to mind for some of the various swaps.
But back to the basic premise of your thread: I have to tell you from my few years owning and operating vehicles (I'm only 25), I have found it to be a LOT less stressful for me to own and DD a newer model vehicle (a 2000 Tundra), which is basically completely stock, that I can depend to get me to and from work. My FJ40 is my toy. Yes I keep it so I can pretty much drive it anywhere in the world at the drop of a hat, but since it's 34 years old this year it continues to show its age. Stuff breaks down or stops working randomly. Nothing is up to the standards of modern vehicles (suspension, lights, heater, wipers, cab noise, safety restraints, fuel economy, parts availability, mechanics who can diagnose and work on it, etc.) - that's fine on a toy, but I have found it's not ok on a DD (for me). I have MUCH more peace of mind knowing that if something stops working on my FJ40 I can park it until I can get it fixed and have some other means of getting around. I have been in the place where my FJ40 was my DD for a time and I had a major mechanical issue come up in the middle of it and I was left trying to come up with an alternate form of transportation.
To me, that situation is further exacerbated by your notion of putting in a non-USA engine in a 30-40 year old vehicle. Nobody is going to be able to work on it except for you. Parts may be hard to find - either they are being discontinued (3B etc.) or never made it to the main markets in USA/Canada (1HZ, 1HD-T, etc.). If you really must have a Land Cruiser as your DD, get a 100% stock FJ40, or even better an FJ60/62, FZJ80 or 100 series (all stock and well-maintained to ensure reliability, maintainability and serviceability) and then have your diesel converted FJ40 as your toy. The 40 series trucks aren't getting any newer, and you're going to also have to consider all the other things that wear out over time that you'll have to keep on top of if you're going to have a reasonably vehicle to DD (seats, weatherstripping, wiring connections, RUST, seals, gaskets, tranny, diffs, spring bushings, etc.)
That's my two cents.
But back to the basic premise of your thread: I have to tell you from my few years owning and operating vehicles (I'm only 25), I have found it to be a LOT less stressful for me to own and DD a newer model vehicle (a 2000 Tundra), which is basically completely stock, that I can depend to get me to and from work. My FJ40 is my toy. Yes I keep it so I can pretty much drive it anywhere in the world at the drop of a hat, but since it's 34 years old this year it continues to show its age. Stuff breaks down or stops working randomly. Nothing is up to the standards of modern vehicles (suspension, lights, heater, wipers, cab noise, safety restraints, fuel economy, parts availability, mechanics who can diagnose and work on it, etc.) - that's fine on a toy, but I have found it's not ok on a DD (for me). I have MUCH more peace of mind knowing that if something stops working on my FJ40 I can park it until I can get it fixed and have some other means of getting around. I have been in the place where my FJ40 was my DD for a time and I had a major mechanical issue come up in the middle of it and I was left trying to come up with an alternate form of transportation.
To me, that situation is further exacerbated by your notion of putting in a non-USA engine in a 30-40 year old vehicle. Nobody is going to be able to work on it except for you. Parts may be hard to find - either they are being discontinued (3B etc.) or never made it to the main markets in USA/Canada (1HZ, 1HD-T, etc.). If you really must have a Land Cruiser as your DD, get a 100% stock FJ40, or even better an FJ60/62, FZJ80 or 100 series (all stock and well-maintained to ensure reliability, maintainability and serviceability) and then have your diesel converted FJ40 as your toy. The 40 series trucks aren't getting any newer, and you're going to also have to consider all the other things that wear out over time that you'll have to keep on top of if you're going to have a reasonably vehicle to DD (seats, weatherstripping, wiring connections, RUST, seals, gaskets, tranny, diffs, spring bushings, etc.)
That's my two cents.
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- #20
Thats good advice. I have an 05 volvo v50 wagon, it just doesnt cut it. I work five mins drive from home, ans i dont really go for long drives ( less than an hour ). I drove my 78 everywhere. I had a 62 as well. Sold them both ( long story ). My plan is to get back what i had basically as i am miserable ( really ). I live in New York, so any vehicle over 25 years old is smog exempt. Only safety inspection. I am looking for stock/ lightly modified. I dont need a rock crawler as there are no rocks around here. I am also not looking for mint either. I guess nice would be correct. I do see your point however. But like I said, it doesnt seem like there is any diesels to speak of really so it may be gas anyways...
