For John. N74L vs N101 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter sleeoffroad
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bull said:If it makes any difference I went wheeling in my 100 series 3 times over 2 weeks with the N74Ls with only the spring retainer and no bumpstop installed and it worked fine..
Do you have any photos of a 100 series? Mail them to me and I can load them up on my server.
MAD FLEX
Way to go Bull. Glad you're happy.
Without lowering the bump stop though your shock becomes your bump stop and that could damage it.
TEST: Jack up one side of your axle and see of the wheel will stuff all the way to your stock bumpstop. I don't think it'll make it.
Here's another "3000 words"
:
no pics of it at the top there for the first 1000 words ? 
EL_3grab said:
Our Bilstein premium package uses a shock slightly longer than the OME L series from the 105 with toyota bonded bushes front and rear, and slightly longer front shocks.
We use an 18mm washer mount on the tops, with heavy duty domed washers to prevent the washer turning inside out and pulling the nut through on the front and they are 3" dia washers and rubbers.
We also have a Ridepro shock, using a heavy duty top washer setup, more in the cheaper OME/TJM type build quality, but with better valving to suit 4wd application.
And we have the Ridepro competition shocks, which require bump stop spacers, and pin to eye convertors for 4" lift, but the rear shock is 760mm [30"] with 12" of travel, making for the same amount of diff movement in travel as my red tray in the pic shown here [same as cruiser set up in weight, size, mount length, width, bump travel etc]
Modifying the rear mount to suit these is also a good option, as there is alot of room to do this between the chassis and the floor on the 100.
that nice ..
i have
diff dowen
bump spacer (4 cm)
and adjustable pan rod .. so im in the right way
..
now im looking for the shocks .. and my budget is 2000$ for the 4 shocks
i have the choice of aragosta and proflex .. but they way pricey
maybe we will contact in the future
i have
diff dowen
bump spacer (4 cm)
and adjustable pan rod .. so im in the right way
..
now im looking for the shocks .. and my budget is 2000$ for the 4 shocks
i have the choice of aragosta and proflex .. but they way pricey
maybe we will contact in the future
Hey ATS4x4, when John asks for pics just reply that you don't need pics to prove anything to him. For a long time I tried to get John to show his 100 on a "hard core" trail (something other than rutted out roads for gay flex pics) and he never produced any saying that he didn't have to prove it to me.
I think the most important thing in this thread is something that Christo brought up a while back but didn't get much attention. He was talking about the ShortBus and how it isn't a ramp champ, but it is a lot more stable than a lot of vehicles that can crawl all the way to the top. In real world off-roading, this is what you want........balanced travel between the front and rear. You can make a 100 flex like mad in the back, but you will lose stability. John will argue this and say that his real world results disprove my point, but I still have yet to see any of his pics showing real world off-roading. If you are on relatively flat ground, yes, the rear axle will follow the ruts very nicely, all tires will stay planted, and you can get out of your car and take hundreds of retarded "look, the back can flex but the front can't do schmidt." Take that same vehicle onto a trail that has lots of off camber situations coupled with flexing the suspension at the same time, and all that rear travel will get you into bad situations. You get too close to the roll axis, and just as you hit it, immediate transition to your side. A lot of D90 guys deal with this because the front end doesn't flex nearly as well as the rear. Some just build up the rear to flex ridiculously and they become topple machines.
Christo's point about stability doesn't refer to keeping all the tires on the ground. Sometimes a wheel up is more stable than ruining front to rear suspension balance.
Flame away.
I think the most important thing in this thread is something that Christo brought up a while back but didn't get much attention. He was talking about the ShortBus and how it isn't a ramp champ, but it is a lot more stable than a lot of vehicles that can crawl all the way to the top. In real world off-roading, this is what you want........balanced travel between the front and rear. You can make a 100 flex like mad in the back, but you will lose stability. John will argue this and say that his real world results disprove my point, but I still have yet to see any of his pics showing real world off-roading. If you are on relatively flat ground, yes, the rear axle will follow the ruts very nicely, all tires will stay planted, and you can get out of your car and take hundreds of retarded "look, the back can flex but the front can't do schmidt." Take that same vehicle onto a trail that has lots of off camber situations coupled with flexing the suspension at the same time, and all that rear travel will get you into bad situations. You get too close to the roll axis, and just as you hit it, immediate transition to your side. A lot of D90 guys deal with this because the front end doesn't flex nearly as well as the rear. Some just build up the rear to flex ridiculously and they become topple machines.
Christo's point about stability doesn't refer to keeping all the tires on the ground. Sometimes a wheel up is more stable than ruining front to rear suspension balance.
Flame away.
DBS311 said:
Sorry my friend. Judging by your signature I doubt you have much experience with a UZJ100 on the trails. ??? I'm not a big enough dumb ass to tell people about what works on a 60.
By what you write you prove yourself wrong just by looking at the 80-series. The 80-series isn't "balanced" F&R either. Duh! With the typical 10" front and 15" rear travel it's hardly balanced. Gonna tell the 80 owners their off-road ride sucks too? Wake up! Let's all take our 80's and limit the travel to 8". Better huh? Not a chance. Land Rover Freelander City. The Short Bus is a whole nother truck with unque build and huge tires. You can't compare.
Ever heard of A=B and B=C so A=B?
80-series L-shocks were created to provide the same articulation with taller lifts/bigger tires. It's undisputed their benefit on an 80 and everybody uses them including Slee.
All I've done is copy the same thing onto a 100. It's exactly the same benefit on the 100 as the 80. To argue with that.....
Line the 100's up on the trail and run 'em. God I'd luv to see your face when you see the difference. ;p
WAIT...ANOTHER THOUGHT: So YOU can tell me which setup is superior on MY truck?
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Yeah, pretty much what I expected from John.
When did I say I was the authority on the 100 series?
When did I attack the "shock" issue?
In fact, when did I even mention shocks?
Where did I say that your off-road ride sucked?
When did I say that a balanced suspension between the front and rear meant the EXACT same travel in inches?
Did I tell you which setup is superior on your truck??
Johnny boy, I could really care less what shocks you put on your truck. My point (besides flaming you a little) was that one (I'm not talking only 100 series owners when I say this) should try and maintain a balance between front and rear travel. When you start to have one end that moves A LOT more than the other, you can get yourself into bad situations. With radius arms on the front of my Bronco I run into the same problem that the 80 series guys experience. Now, I could be a moron and put a 1/4 elliptic setup on the rear of my truck that flexes nearly 90 degrees and topple on nearly every serious obstacle........Or I could use limiting straps and try to balance the articulation, lift a wheel from time to time, but be a lot more stable in the end.
Also, why is the ShortBus exempt from my example? You can't tell me the laws of physics don't apply to Christo's truck. I would also consider my Bronco a "whole nother truck with unique build and huge tires" but I follow the same rules and concepts when building it and my 62.
Dude, I know you are like 75, but try and calm down a little. You show the early signs of frustration that accompany ED.
Oh, and judging by your signature, you must not have much off-road experience.
When did I say I was the authority on the 100 series?
When did I attack the "shock" issue?
In fact, when did I even mention shocks?
Where did I say that your off-road ride sucked?
When did I say that a balanced suspension between the front and rear meant the EXACT same travel in inches?
Did I tell you which setup is superior on your truck??
Johnny boy, I could really care less what shocks you put on your truck. My point (besides flaming you a little) was that one (I'm not talking only 100 series owners when I say this) should try and maintain a balance between front and rear travel. When you start to have one end that moves A LOT more than the other, you can get yourself into bad situations. With radius arms on the front of my Bronco I run into the same problem that the 80 series guys experience. Now, I could be a moron and put a 1/4 elliptic setup on the rear of my truck that flexes nearly 90 degrees and topple on nearly every serious obstacle........Or I could use limiting straps and try to balance the articulation, lift a wheel from time to time, but be a lot more stable in the end.
Also, why is the ShortBus exempt from my example? You can't tell me the laws of physics don't apply to Christo's truck. I would also consider my Bronco a "whole nother truck with unique build and huge tires" but I follow the same rules and concepts when building it and my 62.
Dude, I know you are like 75, but try and calm down a little. You show the early signs of frustration that accompany ED.
Oh, and judging by your signature, you must not have much off-road experience.
DBS311 said:
I luv this forum. I am calm though. I was LMAO at your last post. Old? Yes. You are correct.
Off-raod experience? None. You are correct also.
DBS311 said:
Thats why I mentioned about his car being parked up, but no pic at the top :whoops:
Balance is important, and thats why we use a longer front and rear generally, and why we went for something longer than the L series OME, because they are too short for what we [and alot of others over here] require.
Our standard shock package is slightly longer than what John has achieved, and my original point here was always, just to let John know he didnt really save the 100 IFS world, but that he expected everyone else to be as surprised as him, when he did it, because he hadnt seen it in his world before.
I think most of us know
John well enough when he is behind the computer, to take what he says as his opinion 
ats4x4dotcom said:Our standard shock package is slightly longer than what John has achieved, and my original point here was always, just to let John know he didnt really save the 100 IFS world, but that he expected everyone else to be as surprised as him, when he did it, because he hadnt seen it in his world before.
I think most of us know
Tell us about your standard longer shock package for the UZJ100? What front shocks do you use that are longer and how much long are they?
ShottsUZJ100 said:
Not being an expert at this...I'll just get that one out in the open right up front...but isn't the limiting down travel of the 2.5"/2/75" raised front 100 IFS the A-arm bump stops and not the shock? So what value would longer front shocks have with the stock A-arm assembly?
spressomon said:
The shock is the down travel limiter, so longer shock = more down travel.
ShottsUZJ100 said:
You havent read this thread very well have you John, maybe more time reading, less time attaching
poser pics.....
ats4x4dotcom said:
I thought, with a properly set up suspension, using the shock as the 'limiter' was not good for the shock?
spressomon said:
Correct.
Toyota chose to do it anyway, so we designed a shock, and bush/rubber set up to cope with that.
ats4x4dotcom said:
Next question: Are they available to us here in the USA? And what, if any, downsides to your set-up?
spressomon said:
Havent found a downside, other than the obvious one, a lighter hip pocket
ats4x4dotcom said:
What become the next limiting factor?
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ats4x4dotcom said:You havent read this thread very well have you John, maybe more time reading, less time attaching
I hate to point out the obvious...but I will
Isn't ats4x4 the one posting pics of rigs on an RTI ramp aka poser ramp?I also thought you had to have a silver star before you could try to talk trash?
