Flexing the 3 link (25 Viewers)

[Booger weldz]

Is the flex worth the effort using the 4" lift shocks? I've never really looked to see how much unused shock is left on a typical 4" lift.
When you had that temp setup was is possible to use the fact. Sway bar?

Show me the stock axle w swaybar(pic), I don't even remember. This stuff is so far in the back of my head I can't really retrieve it in thoughts.

This scenario is entirely possibly, but please realize it was used in transition whilst I waited for other parts and daily drove the truck.

I don't wanna confuse anyone into thinking I recommend this, it's just a viable solution while morphing ones truck into something better I suppose.

If you're comfy w a slee/OME 4" suspension on your truck, who am I to say it sucks? Not fair, and not legitimate. I'm not saying that. It sucks for me, and it sucks on paper/math. The rest is for everyone to decide based on their own needs/wants out of their truck.

If you've never been to the other side of the mountain, you won't know if the grass is greener. Adding an upper link and ditching the front bolts on the radius arms is merely watering a brown lawn. Not even adding fertilizer.

 

[4WheelUnderground]

I wasn't even going to go there but you said it first. Wheel recession...talk about a give me my leaf springs back experience. WOW!

 

[4WheelUnderground]

I hate the phrase, "IT WORKS". For exactly that statement you just gave booger. My personal favorite response to reviews and posts about questionable mods to a truck is..."what yard stick are you using to measure its success". I promise you we are not all using the same tool to measure the performance of any said product. One guys is going to say it rocks while another will say its okay. Its not until the majority says "yes" that any product should be considered worth its salt.

 

[nukegoat]

I hate the phrase, "IT WORKS". For exactly that statement you just gave booger. My personal favorite response to reviews and posts about questionable mods to a truck is..."what yard stick are you using to measure its success". I promise you we are not all using the same tool to measure the performance of any said product. One guys is going to say it rocks while another will say its okay. Its not until the majority says "yes" that any product should be considered worth its salt.

People have strong confirmation bias as well. Everyone believes only the stuff that supports their hypothesis. I'll use a personal example. I replaced my sway bar bushings when I first got my cruiser. I was like "hell yes. now the ride is much firmer, yet more supple over the bumps" because it theoretically made sense. Of course, everyone knows it was just psychosomatic... Same with every iteration of dynamat I installed on my previous truck. I was convinced I had lowered road noise (and added 100 lbs).

 

[VuickB6]

People have strong confirmation bias as well. Everyone believes only the stuff that supports their hypothesis. I'll use a personal example. I replaced my sway bar bushings when I first got my cruiser. I was like "hell yes. now the ride is much firmer, yet more supple over the bumps" because it theoretically made sense. Of course, everyone knows it was just psychosomatic... Same with every iteration of dynamat I installed on my previous truck. I was convinced I had lowered road noise (and added 100 lbs).

How do you know you didn't reduce road noise? Did you take measurements before and after? I'm planning on doing at least a thermal barrier to keep the floorboards from getting so hot but was also going to do some sort of noise barrier as well.

 

[Booger weldz]

How do you know you didn't reduce road noise? Did you take measurements before and after? I'm planning on doing at least a thermal barrier to keep the floorboards from getting so hot but was also going to do some sort of noise barrier as well.

Road noise? Are you serious? If you even slip into high end shocks you will feel/hear the heim joint noise(sperical bearing ends).

If you use heims on steering you will quickly get used to the clunk of the joint pivoting and getting bound up on dirt/dust and then releasing.

Coilovers have a pronounced 'twang' when the dual rate slider gets pissy and is forced to slide against the shock body.

Bypass shocks 'clack' as one areas check valve flaps shut as travel enters another region of travel...


I think there's a few things overlooked in the suspension threads that some of you 'luxury' SUV types need to absorb or gtfo.

There's a stereo knob on my truck that remedies all of this. In the meantime, if you aren't ready for squeaks and farts, shop at slee.

 

[maxamillion2345]

Lol race car parts make race car noises. Dang boy, everybody know that.

 

[VuickB6]

Road noise? Are you serious? If you even slip into high end shocks you will feel/hear the heim joint noise(sperical bearing ends).

If you use heims on steering you will quickly get used to the clunk of the joint pivoting and getting bound up on dirt/dust and then releasing.

Coilovers have a pronounced 'twang' when the dual rate slider gets pissy and is forced to slide against the shock body.

Bypass shocks 'clack' as one areas check valve flaps shut as travel enters another region of travel...


I think there's a few things overlooked in the suspension threads that some of you 'luxury' SUV types need to absorb or gtfo.

There's a stereo knob on my truck that remedies all of this. In the meantime, if you aren't ready for squeaks and farts, shop at slee.

If I cared that much about noise I wouldn't have bought a 80 Series and put 37" mud terrain tires on it! I'd be in a comfy LR3 with some nice quiet all terrain tires.

 

[nukegoat]

How do you know you didn't reduce road noise? Did you take measurements before and after? I'm planning on doing at least a thermal barrier to keep the floorboards from getting so hot but was also going to do some sort of noise barrier as well.

Yep. I just assumed my ears were more precise than my meter.

 

[nukegoat]

The truck I dynamatted was not a wheeler. Just a daily driver I spent too much money on the system for. External dacs and the whole deal.

 

[Wrench]

Any of the $6-700 ruffstuff, or similar kits can work, with the exception of the axle end panhard.

If you do the math, however, youre giving 4wu just a few extra bucks to have done the hard part for you(geometry). You're on you're own w the others....

The actionjackson, etc pioneers built 3 links. That's all they can be described as. The info is abundant on how to do the same, but substantially improve the driving characteristics not addressed by OME, SLEE, TJM, etc kits or the 3links built by the guys who pioneered it on 80s back in the day.

If you did what is being described above(removing radius arm bolts at the axle and adding an upper link). You would create more flex, but fall into the same ill handling woes that cause the 3 link rumored issues that plague it's representation on this website.

It would yield a slight improvement over how a slee 6" kit feels at highway speeds, but nothing near the potential of building entirely new link mount locations and control arm angles.

The rear is still poison at the end of the day. It's geometry, once lifted causes nearly identical dilemmas in handling as the front. Half of the truck being fixed, certainly feels 50% better, and I'd let my mother drive mine now, but I won't lie, it's still gotta get a rear overhaul.

Huge Oversteer numbers and high rear AS completely ruin a lifted 80. It's completely retarded after 3-4" and gets insane there after.

LOL at handling. Every guy that has done a 3 link says it drives 80 on the highway no problem.Would let their mom drive it.

 

[Wrench]

I hate the phrase, "IT WORKS". For exactly that statement you just gave booger. My personal favorite response to reviews and posts about questionable mods to a truck is..."what yard stick are you using to measure its success". I promise you we are not all using the same tool to measure the performance of any said product. One guys is going to say it rocks while another will say its okay. Its not until the majority says "yes" that any product should be considered worth its salt.

The butt dyno has made many people rich.

 

[Booger weldz]

LOL at handling. Every guy that has done a 3 link says it drives 80 on the highway no problem.Would let their mom drive it.

I guess you could come drive my truck if you're so inclined. I have nothing to hide, except the used rubbers and rather large panties in the backseat...

 

[UnderDawg]

I cant wait to come out to NorCal next year and wheel with you freaks...

I guess you could come drive my truck if you're so inclined. I have nothing to hide, except the used rubbers and rather large panties in the backseat...

 

[4WheelUnderground]

The butt dyno has made many people rich.

I wasn't referring to the butt dyno, rather that one persons version of it works may not be the same as anothers.

 

[maxamillion2345]

LOL at handling. Every guy that has done a 3 link says it drives 80 on the highway no problem.Would let their mom drive it.

Your username is ironic...

Like... Nevermind, you got them factory long arms up on them 37 neetos Im sure. Drives great no doubt.

 

[Wrench]

On the contrary.

Long arms...LOL.

 

[maxamillion2345]

So with a pretty good guestimation on final ride height, as I'm still waiting on my springs, and just guessing on axle centerline height being half my tire height, I plugged in a few numbers. Had to bug booger to see if I'm totally retarded or what but here it is.

The anti-dive is VERY finicky and even the slightest change throws things way off so take it for what it's worth. I'll see if I can't measure for real when I get it sitting on it's own weight on tires. But probably close enough anyway as the center of gravity changes it drastically.

So I tried it on google docs, doesn't really show up quite right but I was able to plug in most of the numbers. Kind of had to give a pretty good guess on some but this is what popped out. I'll retry when it's actually sitting on all 4 but I'm pretty sure I know what my frame height will be and I just went with half of 40" for the axle height related stuff so should be pretty close I think. Figure I'm no more than 20% +- on the Anti Dive and the roll axis ought to pretty damn close. Unless I messed something up. It did get a bit confusing... and I'm not sure on the center of gravity z axis measurement, I put 44" that's around the top of the bellhousing but I do have a heavy ass cummins/getrag/np205 so who knows, and that really wreaks havoc on those anti dive numbers.

Anti-Squat93.84%
Roll Axis Angle2.71degrees ( - roll understeer, + roll oversteer)
Roll Center Height29.45in
Instant Center X-Axis79.78in
Instant Center Z-Axis28.90in

So I'm gonna go ahead and stand by what I've said, and did, which is build em long, flat, and triangulated. Upper 75% ish of lowers. I got as much axle separation as I could and about half that at the frame. Made the panhard pretty flat but had to match drag link angles, and had to fit everything around a cummins. I'm happy with the numbers. I'll report back if I ever get it driving. Should be soon though.

 

[Booger weldz]

I think it looks sexy!! And while numbers aren't 'perfect' it'll absolutely out shine any 4-5" lifted factory radius arm setup.

 

[BOOSTED80]

So with a pretty good guestimation on final ride height, as I'm still waiting on my springs, and just guessing on axle centerline height being half my tire height, I plugged in a few numbers. Had to bug booger to see if I'm totally retarded or what but here it is.

The anti-dive is VERY finicky and even the slightest change throws things way off so take it for what it's worth. I'll see if I can't measure for real when I get it sitting on it's own weight on tires. But probably close enough anyway as the center of gravity changes it drastically.

So I tried it on google docs, doesn't really show up quite right but I was able to plug in most of the numbers. Kind of had to give a pretty good guess on some but this is what popped out. I'll retry when it's actually sitting on all 4 but I'm pretty sure I know what my frame height will be and I just went with half of 40" for the axle height related stuff so should be pretty close I think. Figure I'm no more than 20% +- on the Anti Dive and the roll axis ought to pretty damn close. Unless I messed something up. It did get a bit confusing... and I'm not sure on the center of gravity z axis measurement, I put 44" that's around the top of the bellhousing but I do have a heavy ass cummins/getrag/np205 so who knows, and that really wreaks havoc on those anti dive numbers.

Anti-Squat93.84%
Roll Axis Angle2.71degrees ( - roll understeer, + roll oversteer)
Roll Center Height29.45in
Instant Center X-Axis79.78in
Instant Center Z-Axis28.90in

So I'm gonna go ahead and stand by what I've said, and did, which is build em long, flat, and triangulated. Upper 75% ish of lowers. I got as much axle separation as I could and about half that at the frame. Made the panhard pretty flat but had to match drag link angles, and had to fit everything around a cummins. I'm happy with the numbers. I'll report back if I ever get it driving. Should be soon though.

Did you do all the work yourself Max ? Looks good , look forward to hearing how everything handles.