FJC Diff gears

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Trollhole

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I talked with Greg Freeman the service manager with Ralph Hayes Toyota. Wanted to get his stance on what he would do if a a UC member broke one and brought it in. He said he has been working on this exact issue for the past week. Has a call into his District Rep to clarify the situation. I told hime I would like to have a good plan of action if this ever happens as I don't want this to become a problem between a UC member and Ralph Hayes. It's better to know the situation before this happens.

He said he would call me when he had me a good answer.
 
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Glad to hear you're running this down Troll. I feel like one of the *lucky ones* now. I just can't believe the abrupt about-face the dealers/regional mgrs have taken on this. To quote Slingerdoo's response from TMC...

Toyota's Response:
Dear Mr. McGinnis:

Thank you for contacting Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc.

We appreciate the opportunity to address your inquiry.

As Toyota website stated, the FJ Cruiser is designed as an off-road vehicle.

Driving your FJ Cruiser off-road does not automatically void your warranty but any component damaged by the off-road driving or performance problems resulting from the off-road driving would not be covered.

Determination of warranty coverage is done by a Toyota dealership inspection of the vehicle. The warranty is in effect unless the dealership determines that the cause of a particular concern is not caused by the manufacturer.


The part about dealership inspection is very subjective and at the Beasley event, even the TT member said the dealership service rep was not pleasant to them on both visits they made that day.
 
Rick,

for those of us contemplating the purchase of a new FJC :D are there any production dates after which this problem was resolved (i.e., have they started putting the hardened gears into newer FJC's)?

Thanks,

David
 
David I believe the cut off lies somewhere in the fall of 06 either sept or october production date.........

but I am sure Rick or one of the other FJC guys and gals can confirm

just buy a brand new one and you will be fine :D
 
I don't know the exact production dates, but fall of 06 is right, and I do know that mine is one of the ones that will break.

The dealership I take my truck to has replaced 2 diffs that I know of...Rick's and Dave's. I have kinda been taking it for granted that they would do the same for mine. But now I am not so sure. With my wheeling not allowed any more, my warranty is going to be up before I have this thing out wheeling again. However, I have heard that these things are blowing on nothing more than dirt roads. That being said, I am going to wait until I am big, fat and pregnant and take this thing out to the mountains and let happen what will happen. I dare them to tell me that I was wheelin' that truck when it broke when I am as big as a house. Hmmmph.

Thanks for looking into this Marshall, I'll look forward to seeing what Greg says.
 
David,
The rear diff has two part #'s in the Toyota parts system. Rick Arflin (RHT) revealed this to me when I first called about a replacement rear diff back in June of this year. The dateline is 02/07 actually. All FJ's assembled before February 2007 seem to be in the danger zone, at least that's my deduction. Why would they have two #'s in the system? This is what prompted Rick Arflin to ask what my VIN/build date was and he was baffled by the two part #s for the same model year.

But as JP said, buy a new one and no worries. In fact, you'll have the new ECU program which allows the rear locker and A-trac (front wheels) to be engaged at the same time.
 
for those of us contemplating the purchase of a new FJC :D are there any production dates after which this problem was resolved (i.e., have they started putting the hardened gears into newer FJC's)?

Thanks,

David

The big problem is not just the defective part but the way Toyota handles the warranty
 
I'm almost tempted to change out my gears before they grenade. I'll be up there this weekend and am stopping at Ralph Hayes on the way. I'd like to see how much it would cost to replace the 3.73 gears with 4.11s. Since I'm running 33s and pulling a camper.

Get the parts cost separately please.
I think I'll go ahead with this mod myself. When they changed them for Rick and Dave I planned to wheel mine until it broke but Eric's problem has convinced me otherwise.
I think the main problem is the mods we do. I think if you were dead stock and broke they would be stuck with it but the big tires and lift give them an out. My steering is clocked and the only solution Toyota of Greer had was new rack, at my expense. I believe they actually tried to get Toyota to pay for it, the Cust Svc rep called through two different hierarchies and got the same answer both places. Their rationale was the lift and big tires, not the wheeling.

I have high regard for Toyota manufacturing and design but dealer networks are stuck with no factory backing and they ain't gonna eat it.
I've seen the same thing with BMW on two major issues: There was an automatic transmission issue several years ago that they denied and wouldn't fix unless it cratered. And with the new (then) oilhead motorcycle engines there was a surging problem that they stuck their heads in the sand over for years until the next generation ECU came out.
Godonlyknows what it's like with the lesser maufacturers. We've all heard nightmares about their quality.


Here's the question that hangs out there. How do we know we don't get tainted gears in the replacement? Especially if we change ratios (which I would do too) and don't have the known good part number to go by.
b
 
I guess I'm lucky my transfer case locked up while I was still stock. D'ohh ! ! !

BTW they wanted $1500+ to unclock my steering.
Alignment is still in spec. So I drive with steering 25deg off and no VSC.
b
 
hmm, is the sensor on the wheel or somewhere else in the system...one would consider disabling the airbag and just moving the wheel :)

As for the gearing thing...aftermarket gears are the way to go. If you do get toyota, there are two different part numbers for THIRD MEMBERS (no R&P sets in toyotas system).

So, you can get a R&P set and master kit, have them setup aftermarket out the door for probably $600 per end, or you can spend $2000-2400 to get new gears for both ends...remember, if you want to change gears to 4.11s you have to do both ends :)
 
Another option my 4X4 shop suggested is find an old 'chunk' used somewhere, should be a swap from 4Runner or Tacoma or something, and just carry it along for an emergency spare.
I know so little about how that end works it's a learning curve for me.

Same for the steering rack. I was thinking just move the wheel a notch or two on the column, then you should be able to to get a reset on the VSC at the dealer. But again, I'm sailing uncharted waters on a moonless night with no GPS here.
b
 
hmm, is the sensor on the wheel or somewhere else in the system...one would consider disabling the airbag and just moving the wheel :)

As for the gearing thing...aftermarket gears are the way to go. If you do get toyota, there are two different part numbers for THIRD MEMBERS (no R&P sets in toyotas system).

So, you can get a R&P set and master kit, have them setup aftermarket out the door for probably $600 per end, or you can spend $2000-2400 to get new gears for both ends...remember, if you want to change gears to 4.11s you have to do both ends :)

I like $600 WAY better than $2400. I can live with the gearing.

Suggestions on A/M vendor?


I'll find out where our BMW steering angle sensor is. Probably similar setup. BMW has pretty much led the way on this stability control stuff.
b
 
it makes me sad to hear this

Makes you wonder if there will be FJCTT's next year. If not, then they better find another way to market these rigs. So far I've only seen one local dealer show one in a TV ad. Then the only other ads have been in 4WD mags.

If enough ruckus is made about the way they handle warranty items, then they will seriously have to look at the marketing of this rig. Either that or start honoring their warranties.
 
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Here's the thing with warranties. Like it or not, they are a game. Dan and I were talking today after I got back from the dealership and we agree that the game starts the DAY you buy your truck and continues until the warranty period is over. I have learned a lot over the past year and a half with my truck and look at things differently now than I ever have.

Rick, you played the game to get your diff fixed. By going to my service writer at one of the biggest Toyota Dealerships in Georgia (if not THE biggest) your warranty was much more likley to be honored. These things are about numbers. The dealerships LOSE MONEY on warranty repairs. If they have a bad month with warranty repairs, they won't honor any more. So the smaller the dealership (Milton) the less likely for warranty coverage. Toyota Corporate has VERY little to do with this and will just parrot their dealerships. Crap, yes. True, also yes.

The other part of the game is relationship. Where do you have your toyota serviced? I've known my service writer for close to 10 years (minus the Nissan years, but we don't like to talk about those, just too painful). I brought my truck in to see him after I bought it at another dealer. He remembered me from 6 years prior, I let him know that I wanted to use him for service exclusively, and for that I wanted him to be honest and forthright with me. I also told him that if he treated me well, I would recommend him and his team to my friends, who also all drive FJ Cruisers. The first time I came in with a repair (cut CV boot while installing lift) I was prepared to eat it because I did it installing the lift. He told me that I should have just come in and that he would have covered it under warranty (I already had the part, etc.). Nice. I also don't march in there with a chip on my shoulder from reading all this stuff on the web. They don't know the background usually, so I am nice, understanding, but also very firm in my desires.

Today I took the truck in for an oil change, etc. I also asked them to wash it. He made a comment how I didn't have my offroad tires on and chit chatted about the truck for a while. I also asked him what do to if my rear diff blew. He said that as long as he didn't see visable evidence of an impact or other damage on the outside, then he would cover it. I told him that the truck was all sorts of scratched up underneath, he's seen it, he knows I wheel it. He said yes he knows, but if it's not damaged he would cover it.

NOW, I am not naive enough to think that when my diff blows (because I know it will) that there isn't the possibility of them not covering it. Sure...but I have the groundwork down and I have done what I can to build the relationship to get it covered.

Marshall, thank you for laying that foundation with Ralph Hayes. That's what we need for sure.

OK, all that being said. I don't think it's right to have to play this game to get what is promised to you. And I'll tell you what, if after all that, Toyota denys my diff under warranty, I will march my happy a$$ right to a lawyer and file a claim against the Dealership and Toyota.

But, on another note...I do believe in you play, you pay. If this were anything OTHER than a defective part, I'd be on the side of you broke it you bought it. Dan just replaced the gears in his front diff that blew up to the tune of $800. Now, we all know how hard Dan wheels that tank, but he accepts the responsibility that things break and cost money (granted he does whine about it a lot, but he knows what he's in for).

OK, I know I am on a bit of a soapbox, but I just think that there are ways to get things done, and I think that there are ways to get things not done and I wanted to share my philosophy on them both.
 

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