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FJ25 Chat Thread

Discussion in 'FJ25 Owners Group' started by LandCruiserSteve, Dec 10, 2005.

  1. Bear

    Bear SILVER Star

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    Trying to understand the math: Last year importer asked $75,000 shipped, then sold. This year auctioneer anticipated as high as $130,000, sold for half that at $66,000 since no reserve. Results: auction seller likely pays 15% of selling price($9,900). Auction buyer pays "buyer's premium" 15%($9,900).

    So..............auction seller sees sale at $56,000, and likely lost money on the deal, depending on what he originally bought it for.
    Buyer sees his purchase rung-up at $75,900.

    And best of all, Auction house sees $19,800 for 2-3 minutes of stage time, using seller's photos and editing seller's ad copy.

    And the real winner is............

    And the moral of the story................
     
  2. BTUMAN

    BTUMAN SILVER Star

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    It was mine. I sold it. I reget it. Painful lesson learned.

    The auction houses all pursued me to list it with them (the big 3- RM Southbys, Gooding and Bonhams). Barrett Jackson also but I did not consider.

    Everything was selling very low and no one can figure it out. The buyer was a phone buyer and may have been out of country. The issue was there was not enough buyers in the room. It was after 5 PM when it came up and the RM auction down the road had also just started. Gooding had 20 cars with a reserve that didn't sell (nearly all that had reserve). (Has to be 250k or more to have reserve)

    I can assure you this was a near perfect restoration - both mechanically and body. I am modest collector and Enthusiast. The new buyer got an amazing deal. Everyone loved it. But the audience is really Lamborghini, Ferrari, Austin Martin. God forbid they consider a legend from the orient.

    And how do I know the value should have been much more? I had breakfast with Donald Osborne- the guy from Jay Leno's garage who makes a living at determining value- he concurred with the 100-130 and we spoke about how he wished he did the program on one like mine rather than Jay's ICON.

    So perhaps I have saved anyone else from making the mistake I made. Don't let the high end auction houses temp you with the lights and glitter of high end auction.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2017
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  3. Bear

    Bear SILVER Star

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    Really sorry to hear that, man. If more folks were as brutally honest as you, perhaps the hype from the auction houses would get toned-down.

    I understand some of the auctions will allow a reserve for a vehicle under $250K. Also trying to squeeze into the auctions in Scottsdale(January) and Pebble Beach(August) will have largest crowds. The political nature of the auctions, however, is the biggest demon. The auctioneers will hype auctions for "preferred" sellers with shills and phony phone bidders in an effort to drive up prices for "selected" vehicles--obviously illegal, but never proven. And, certain repeat sellers get the choice time slots on the choice days.

    It seems in your case that the interest wasn't there--either for the crowd and/or the auction house. Once you saw the direction things were headed, was there any way prior to yours heading up the ramp that you could have pulled out, under some pretense, to avoid a catastrophe--maybe having to pay a "fine" to do so?

    I didn't see any other FJXX/BJXX vehicles in their line-up as competition for attention--what about the other auction companies?

    Just as with gamblers returning from Las Vegas, nobody speaks about the folks who lost heavily, or the cars or the gemstones or the memorabilia that didn't sell at auction for astronomical record-setting prices--not headline-grabbing news. Without a protective reserve, it's gambling, in a game most of us know very little about, have limited experience, limited influence. Yes, there are sometimes huge winners, as in Vegas. But I always come away thinking that the glamorous, ostentatious creation that is the city of Las Vegas, was built with the financial losses of so many unspoken people.

    From me, personally, thank-you for enlightening those of us who debate whether we should try the auctions--a vicarious lesson I shall remember.
     
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  4. BTUMAN

    BTUMAN SILVER Star

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    Appreciate the support Bear.

    You can't pull out without paying the commissions on the high end estimate.

    Buyers pays 10%. Seller fee is negotiable- I did so to 8%. Entry fee is negotiable- I paid $900.

    I'm not going to bad mouth Gooding- they were professional all the way. I knew the risk up front- but began to foresee what was going to happen after the first American car was Auctioned that morning. There was a Lincoln- amazing restoration. Estimated at 160-180 that sold for 50. I knew then I was not going to get a premium. The room literally growned.

    There were no other Land Cruisers. There was a glimmer of hope when it rolled up on the stage...the crowd moved forward to take pictures...there was excitement buzz....then it turned horribly wrong when it stalled out when the room bidders would not go against the phone bidder. There was another collective gasp from the crowed as the hammer came down on mine.

    I've made a fair bit of money from selling my cruisers - usually to buy another. So I can't complain about that. But it was disappointing to not see it appreciated in the market.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2017
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  5. daner

    daner

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    I too appreciate your candor-auctions are indeed risky business
     
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  6. hdjtachtig

    hdjtachtig

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    From Facebook. Who can translate Indonesian? IMG_0428.JPG
     
  7. JohnnyC

    JohnnyC Long ago TLCA# 2231 SILVER Star

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    Happy Easter !!!

    Happy SONrise :)

    Enjoy the day and the chocolate lol
     
  8. Doctor do Little

    Doctor do Little

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  9. JohnnyC

    JohnnyC Long ago TLCA# 2231 SILVER Star

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    Happy Mothers Day peeps

    May your momma not be a punchline in a momma joke and your wifes be the princess they deserve... and if you are a mother (mud ladies) .... I'm sorry you need to endure your husbands childish behaviors :)

    Enjoy!!!
     
  10. nuclearlemon

    nuclearlemon not an addict Moderator

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    I missed mother's day, but God 17 mai to any norske folk who may be on. It's a wet early morning south of Oslo, hoping the weather improves for the festivities
     
  11. Archie 1962 FJ25

    Archie 1962 FJ25 Autocrat

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    Does this bumper looks familiar??

    IMG_1541.JPG
     
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  12. Land Cruiser Junky

    Land Cruiser Junky SILVER Star

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    Archie, I drove this vehicle all through high school. 1967 Nissan Patrol. It's what got me started 4-wheeling. I went mountain climbing in the Canadian wilderness after graduating and found my parents had sold it while I was gone. I went out and bought my FJ40. The Patrol was a cool rig.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
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  13. Archie 1962 FJ25

    Archie 1962 FJ25 Autocrat

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    This one is a 1969 ute up for sale here in Christchurch (Travelled only 10,265 kms).

    IMG_1549.JPG

    IMG_1550.JPG

    I too grew up around these vehicles in India, my uncle and one of my cousin is in Indian Army. These were made for Indian army in a city called Jabalpur, India under license from Nissan. They are called "Jonga" in India and were not available for civilian use. When Indian army officially retired them from service most of them were scrapped (Similar fate as M151 (MUTT) in USA) but few survived and now highly collectible.

    India too had a non import policy I think until 1995/96 before that most things were produced in India (under licence). That's how India missed on early land cruisers, but they are plenty in neighbouring countries because import was more open there.

    Here is a wiki link on Jonga - Jonga - Wikipedia

    IMG_1551.JPG

    IMG_1553.JPG

    IMG_1554.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
  14. Bear

    Bear SILVER Star

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    Archie,

    Interesting split in that front windshield. Is that for some type of forward-shooting weapon? Looks like it could hold a bazooka !

    On a related question, did the Brits allow India to build Land Rovers under license?
     
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  15. Living in the Past

    Living in the Past SILVER Star

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    So Archie are you buying the Patrol. What is the price in US dollars? If I sold about eight cruisers would like a trayback to keep the patina and use as around the cabin. Problem with restoring one or buying a restored one is you never use it as it was intended to be used. I love my one owner FJ40 but will never use it like I do my 68. While I use it I treat like the 100 series owners who carry clippers to trim branches.
     
  16. Archie 1962 FJ25

    Archie 1962 FJ25 Autocrat

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    John, I am committed to finish FJ25. That patrol is nice and it's listed at $24800 NZD, if you are interested let me know if I can help anyway. It's listed in Christchurch, that's in South Island. Check here.
     
  17. Doctor do Little

    Doctor do Little

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  18. Archie 1962 FJ25

    Archie 1962 FJ25 Autocrat

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    Land Rovers were never built in India, however some very early series 1 & 2 along with jaguars made it to India. All of them were personal import that only royals, rich & famous could afford in India. Ironically now both brands Land Rover & Jaguar are owned by an Indian company.

    Indian army uses many different types of forward shooting weapons, I will try to find out more on this.
     
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  19. Living in the Past

    Living in the Past SILVER Star

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    Thanks Archie but that way to nice for what I would want. Would do a LWB 4X series since I have so many spare parts already.

    Thanks Peter, how strong our dollar is right now is why I pulled the trigger on a five speed in Australia. That and how old I am. Should have jumped on one years ago. Still weren't cheap but don't see a surplus of five speed with 40 series top cover happening anytime soon. Remember about eight years we were dollar for dollar with Australia and Canada. So much going on in our country and around the world figured with my luck I waited and things will reverse. Because I did pulled the trigger figured I took one for the country and our dollar will get even stronger and have been cheaper.:rolleyes:
     
  20. Splangy

    Splangy SILVER Star

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    The guy I bought my house from had 4 Nissan Patrols. I think he had every one known in NH! I had never heard of them and LandCruisers weren't really even on my radar at the time. My poor neighbors must be wondering what's in the well here that makes guys want to work on old Japanese 4x4's
     
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