Dexron III or Toyota WS ATF transmission fluid. What ATF are you using? (1 Viewer)

[2001LC]

It' my understanding the A750 5spd transmission was first introduced in the 2003 Land Cruiser/LX470 USA. In 2004 - 2007 dip stick was removed from this transmission.

Was 2003 the first year Toyota WS ATF fluid was installed at factory? No Toyota T-IV in 03, 04 was first for WS.

What ATF fluid does your (yr) Owners Manual recommend?

From what I've read for all years/transmission: Factory recommends inspecting every 30K miles, and replacing at 60K miles only in special use condition like; tow, very hot driving condition, heavy stop & go or burnt smell etc.. Otherwise Schedule Maintenance booklet doesn't recommend replacing fluid that i've seen.

My 2001LC:
1998-02 4spd A343F transmission factory Dexron II, III or greater. I use M1 (Mobil 1 MV full synthetic ATF). 1st flush at 60K, every ~30K miles since (much more than's needed). Shifting is smooth as butter

 

[jerryb]

I spent days reading online forums, 4 runner mostly. I decided on non toyota stock WS. No issues in 9k miles. I think I also read a fair amount on bobistheoilguy.

 

[jerryb]

Drain and fill 5 times 600 mile or so between. I drive I-10 640 round trip miles frequently. I'd get 3.75 qts out of the bottom each time and refill the same, from the bottom with a pump. At the end of the fifth time I leveled and drained excess. Getting that fill plug becomes very easy after the first time. I also think that 7-10% over/under capacity won't hurt anything in the short term.
I wasn't comfortable enough with the car yet to disconnect fluid lines and pressure swap. It was too new to me. I am now and I will exchange all fluid at 200k miles. I'm sure there's a tiny bit of ws left in there.
I bought the car at 170k miles, fluid exchanging starting at 171k, today it's at 180.4k
I used max life.
I read info from bobistheoilguy, tacomaworld, and a random 4 runner forum.
I would not get on either side of this discussion, everyone needs a hobby and I don't believe any one of us should push a certain fluid or not. I think max life or M1 or WS will all work just fine. From previous toyota records my atf fluid was flushed at 120k miles. It looked very good when I started exchanging it.

 

[apdxyk]

FWIW: my son, an engineer, ran his 4R up to 438k miles on WS factory fill. At that point the torque convertor gave up, and he rebuilt it himself. His case is a single case, not indicative of anything, of course. If one plays with WS, read up as much as you can on it, starting with Toyota TSBs: per mfg the WS is not miscible with anything, aggressive, and even the overfill fluid cannot be reused at all -- should be disposed. Also of importance, the WS thermal expansion characteristic are different from traditional ATFs of previous generations.

Personally, I have done full swap every 60k. I am not recommending anything, just sharing..

The Internet is full of claims that WS is junk, but those claims are based on hearsay, no statistical data series to support the claim.
Bottom line: if the unit is designed well, tested properly by mfg, it should work as advertised. That is quite a few variables right there.

 

[2001LC]

Drain and fill 5 times 600 mile or so between. I drive I-10 640 round trip miles frequently. I'd get 3.75 qts out of the bottom each time and refill the same, from the bottom with a pump. At the end of the fifth time I leveled and drained excess. Getting that fill plug becomes very easy after the first time. I also think that 7-10% over/under capacity won't hurt anything in the short term.
I wasn't comfortable enough with the car yet to disconnect fluid lines and pressure swap. It was too new to me. I am now and I will exchange all fluid at 200k miles. I'm sure there's a tiny bit of ws left in there.
I bought the car at 170k miles, fluid exchanging starting at 171k, today it's at 180.4k
I used max life.
I read info from bobistheoilguy, tacomaworld, and a random 4 runner forum.
I would not get on either side of this discussion, everyone needs a hobby and I don't believe any one of us should push a certain fluid or not. I think max life or M1 or WS will all work just fine. From previous toyota records my atf fluid was flushed at 120k miles. It looked very good when I started exchanging it.

Nice detail!

FWIW: my son, an engineer, ran his 4R up to 438k miles on WS factory fill. At that point the torque convertor gave up, and he rebuilt it himself. His case is a single case, not indicative of anything, of course. If one plays with WS, read up as much as you can on it, starting with Toyota TSBs: per mfg the WS is not miscible with anything, aggressive, and even the overfill fluid cannot be reused at all -- should be disposed. Also of importance, the WS thermal expansion characteristic are different from traditional ATFs of previous generations.

Personally, I have done full swap every 60k. I am not recommending anything, just sharing..

The Internet is full of claims that WS is junk, but those claims are based on hearsay, no statistical data series to support the claim.
Bottom line: if the unit is designed well, tested properly by mfg, it should work as advertised. That is quite a few variables right there.

So I take it you're doing the full 12qt flush (not drain & fill), with Toyota WS every 60K?
Is this DIY?

 

[apdxyk]

Yes, 60k period for full swap at the dealer - around $210 in Portland, OR

For some AT, anything over 200k is an achievement.

 

[2001LC]

60K certainly a proper & respectable interval.

200K is barely broken for 100 series.

 

[abuck99]

Toyota WS-

Although I don't think WS is full synthetic, it is good stuff (study the TDS) - and its spec'd for the 5spd. I will continue to use it.

During baseline I had the trans fluid exchanged on a BG machine- Its not cheap, but it is complete and ensures you clear all of the old fluid. The whole process of draining and filling every 600 miles seems like a pita.

Interval? 90k would be reasonable (60k for us over maintainers) especially if you don't tow or use under heavy/extreme service. Our 100 series trans operating temps are pretty low compared to other trucks . (50-70+ degrees lower) and I think the fluid lasts longer under those circumstances.

 

[medtro]

It' my understanding the A750 5spd transmission was first introduced in the 2003 Land Cruiser/LX470 USA. In 2004 - 2007 dip stick was removed from this transmission.

Was 2003 the first year Toyota WS ATF fluid was installed at factory?
What ATF fluid does your (yr) Owners Manual recommend?

I believe A750 started in 2003 for Land Cruiser/LX470 in USA. However WS transmission fluid started in 2004.

From 2003 LC owner manual:

• Fluid type: Toyota Genuine ATF Type T−IV

From what I've read for all years/transmission: Factory recommends inspecting every 30K miles, and replacing at 60K miles only in special use condition like; tow, very hot driving condition, heavy stop & go or burnt smell etc.. Otherwise Schedule Maintenance booklet doesn't recommend replacing fluid that i've seen.

From 2003 LC owner manual:

• Change automatic transmission fluid only as necessary. Generally, it is necessary to change automatic transmission fluid only if your vehicle is driven under one of the Special Operating Conditions listed in your ”Scheduled Maintenance Guide” or ”Owner’s Manual Supplement”. When changing the automatic transmission fluid, use only “Toyota Genuine ATF Type T−IV” (ATF JWS3309 or NWS6500) to aid in assuring optimum transaxle performance.

 

[2001LC]

Toyota WS-

Although I don't think WS is full synthetic, it is good stuff (study the TDS) - and its spec'd for the 5spd. I will continue to use it.

During baseline I had the trans fluid exchanged on a BG machine- Its not cheap, but it is complete and ensures you clear all of the old fluid. The whole process of draining and filling every 600 miles seems like a pita.

Interval? 90k would be reasonable (60k for us over maintainers) especially if you don't tow or use under heavy/extreme service. Our 100 series trans operating temps are pretty low compared to other trucks . (50-70+ degrees lower) and I think the fluid lasts longer under those circumstances.

I've no worries using Toyota WS in the 07LC 5spd, form what I've read in this thread and searching the 100 series forum. But I do like full synthetics wherever I can use.

The 01LC 4spd had it's first trans flush done at Dealer at 60K, along with all fluids for a good baseline. It was early in it's life, so I had no worries having a full flush releasing internal gunk. Although I found every case overfilled, I've DIY every since. But I do think the BG flushing machine to be a good one, be great to have.

I flushed at 30K interval not as supper over maintainer (which I'm), but because I was experimenting with Dexon III, VI & M1 effect on MPG. The earlier lower number III gave best MPG with M1 the worst, but M1 the smooths shifting.

I believe A750 started in 2003 for Land Cruiser/LX470 in USA. However WS transmission fluid started in 2004.

From 2003 LC owner manual:

• Fluid type: Toyota Genuine ATF Type T−IV

From 2003 LC owner manual:

• Change automatic transmission fluid only as necessary. Generally, it is necessary to change automatic transmission fluid only if your vehicle is driven under one of the Special Operating Conditions listed in your ”Scheduled Maintenance Guide” or ”Owner’s Manual Supplement”. When changing the automatic transmission fluid, use only “Toyota Genuine ATF Type T−IV” (ATF JWS3309 or NWS6500) to aid in assuring optimum transaxle performance.

Good info, THX.

Interesting T-IV is recommend in the first 5spd used in a 100 series. In my 07LC the door plate shown A/TM A03A/A750F. Is that the same for your 03 LC transmission code?

Been years since I compared ATF's. Does yours OM state Toyota-IV or equivalent Dexron IV?

Note: Dexron VI is backward compatible with Dexron II, III & IV.

BTW: Was "transaxle" a typo on your part or does it really say that?

 

[abuck99]

I think the shift to WS is for environmental reasons- they consider it a lifetime fluid FWTW.

 

[2001LC]

I think the shift to WS is for environmental reasons- they consider it a lifetime fluid FWTW.

Seem Toyota considers all Toyota ATF life time.

Seem to me if 03 has the same transmission using T-IV, then it could use T-WS as well. For that matter 04-07 could use T-IV. This should open up additional compatibility option.

 

[medtro]

Good info, THX.

Interesting T-IV is recommend in the first 5spd used in a 100 series. In my 07LC the door plate shown A/TM A030A/A750F. Is that the same for your 03 LC transmission code?

I have A/TM A03A/A750F.

Been years since I compared ATF's. Does yours OM state Toyota-IV or equivalent Dexron IV?

Note: Dexron VI is backward compatible with Dexron II, III & IV.

No mention of equivalent Dexron. There is a notice/warning for not using Toyota ATF.

Dip stick is labeled with "Type T-IV". There is also a sticker on the plastic handle that says no need to replace ATF under normal driving condition.

BTW: Was "transaxle" a typo on your part or does it really say that?

Not a typo.

 

[looking4lc]

mine (lx07)Flushed with Toyota WS at 100K.
planing to do this every 60K since i live in extreme hot weather.

 

[Dannyboy lx470]

Why is it suggested to change more frequently in hot climates? .

 

[looking4lc]

Why is it suggested to change more frequently in hot climates? .

Don't think so, but I notice it dirty at 100k miles. So 60k or70k Perfect interval for me

 

[Dannyboy lx470]

Don't think so, but I notice it dirty at 100k miles. So 60k or70k Perfect interval for me

Agree nothing better then a simple check and if fluid no more bright red and dirty time to change

 

[2001LC]

Why is it suggested to change more frequently in hot climates? .

FWIW:
Actually I've not seen "hot climates" in Toyota booklets. That said towing or using a car top carrier put extra load on transmission. This raise ATF fluid temperature, breaking down the carbon molecules of the oil. So it stand to reason driving in a desert sun would also run transmission hot, IMHO. Conventional oil breaks down cooking the carbon, losing lubricating ability. It turns dark, foul smelling and gunk builds on internals. Synthetic oils can handle much high temperature without breaking down, just one of the reason for using. This is my limited understanding of the differences in oil's., and why I say in hot climates!
Synthetic vs. Conventional Motor Oil | AMSOIL

 

[Dannyboy lx470]

FWIW:
Actually I've not seen "hot climates" in Toyota booklets. That said towing or using a car top carrier put extra load on transmission. This raise ATF fluid temperature, breaking down the carbon molecules of the oil. So it stand to reason driving in a desert sun would also run transmission hot, IMHO. Conventional oil breaks down cooking the carbon, losing lubricating ability. It turns dark, foul smelling and gunk builds on internals. Synthetic oils can handle much high temperature without breaking down, just one of the reason for using. This is my limited understanding of the differences in oil's., and why I say in hot climates!
Synthetic vs. Conventional Motor Oil | AMSOIL

Thankyou for that.As I live in the UAE and hot temperatures rising now for summer I will keep a eye on it.

 

[2001LC]

Here my 2007 LC OM page 352:

Mobil has a ATF 3324 OpenGraphTitle

Interesting Toyota WS ATF, supplier: ExxonMobil (I'd assume they make it)

Mobil also has a Toyota IV compatible ATF 3309
Mobil ATF™ 3309 automatic transmission fluid | Mobil™ Motor Oils

I don't see the word synthetic used so I'll bet none are, including Toyota.