Currie Anti Rock sway bars

[workingdog]

Yes, you've got it.

I'll post some pics in a minute, but I can't post alignment numbers. The Les Schwab down the street won't even put it on the rack because of the modifications. I took it to an old school guy recommended by a friend who checked the alignment without a computer, said the toe was way out (which it was, tire wear showed that) and noted the bearing preload on the king pin was too loose (which it was and I've since set the preload correctly), said the caster was okay but couldn't remember the exact measurement, and sent me on my way. I'm going to have to take it somewhere else and get a real print out.

It's sitting on a Dana 60 in front and a 14 bolt in the rear. All this work was done by a very reputable shop in Auburn Calif. I pretty much let them do their thing so I can't really explain why they did a lot of what they did. It's OME springs on a very custom hanger and shackle setup.

The most disturbing thing it does is in a long turn in which the rig gets loaded up, like a freeway on/off ramp or long freeway corner, if you hit a bump, the entire thing starts to oscillate in a very scary way that is kind of like death wobble but isn't death wobble. But, outside of that, it's the under steer that gets me. You should see my son driving it after driving his Tacoma, it's down right scary to watch him turn the wheel, think he's got it, then have to turn the wheel some more and then some more. I'm used to it, but it still shouldn't be happening.

 

[workingdog]

Here are pictures. It has a lot of lean that's only gotten worse as it's settled.

front end

Rear end

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I found a cheap run of the mill shop to do my alignment. They didn't have a problem putting my SOA 60 on wontons up on the rack.

Got to think about what you mean on the understeer. Understeer in my mind is the front tires scrubbing and pushing through corners, and I'm having a hard time understanding how that's happening on the freeway, since the front tires can't be actually sliding on the pavement. Maybe that's felt because you have a shackle reversal and as the front end compresses unevenly around a turn, and the axle moves back on that side, the steering effect is negated somewhat? Need to think more, but my gut feeling is that's how shackle reversal trucks feel.

Those are 5125 bilsteins? What springs are those? Based on the lean/settle issue, sounds like the springs are too soft, and I know from personal experience that 5125s aren't stiff enough for SOA shocks.

Finally, have you brought these concerns up to the shop you had do the work? What did they say?

 

[cruisermatt]

Those are 5125 bilsteins? What springs are those? Based on the lean/settle issue, sounds like the springs are too soft, and I know from personal experience that 5125s aren't stiff enough for SOA shocks.

I was going to say the same thing. It sounds like he has a very similar issue that I had with the oscillation that I was having before I put the heavier duty spring pack up front. He says they're OME springs, looks like a regular 60 length springs front and rear.

@workingdog Mine had a similar oscillation (I had rear springs up front with 4 leafs removed per side, and 63" Chevy springs in the rear, and same front shocks as you.), I went to a full fresh spring pack up front and there was a massive improvement, not perfect but so much better, and I still haven't went stiffer on the shocks yet. So I think the first thing I would do if I were in your shoes would be looking into beefing up your front spring pack and shock valving. Just in your pictures those springs don't look heavy duty enough for SOA application. I know there have been many guys over the years running regular 60 front springs SOA successfully though.

 

[workingdog]

Thanks for the input. That's helpful. I know they are not stock 60 springs because those went away a long time ago. But, they do look pretty flat on the driver's side. I'll get under and look for anything identifying. But, my memory is that they are OME heavies. I know Pryor went with a more aggressive shock that he's still tuning.

The under steer isn't as bad on the freeway as it is around town.

It's this shop that is pushing the track bar.

Ignore from here don't if you don't want to hear any more about track bars.

I know you guys don't agree, but he makes a strong argument. And, I don't want to argue with you, I'm just supplying opinions from the outside world. For posterity and anyone that might find this threat in the future, he pointed out they were on mini-trucks and any leaf spring truck that didn't have 'bell end steering' like the 60 came with and the older Fords. The newer Fords and everything with parallel or cross over steering has come from the factory with a track bar to counter all the play in the bushings and fittings. He said the 'bell end steering' ended up acting like a track bar.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Kingpin axles behave exactly the same as closed knuckle designs like toyotas, if you have springless steering arms. Kinpin setups use solid bushings instead of bearings, but they're set up with preload exactly the same way. Ball joint axles like in fords are a somewhat different beast, but if there's play in them, then they need to be replaced. Perhaps the panhard bar would help if people neglected their trunion bearings/kingpin bushings/knuckle ball joints, but that would apply to any axle design. I think the shop's point is that closed knuckles are somehow "stiffer" than kingpins or knuckle designs, which I'm not sure is accurate.

I think we can get you there without a panhard bar band-aid.

Stiffer shocks are easy to do. Stiffer, or even just fresh, springs would have a dramatic improvement in your truck IMHO. Based on matt's experience with swapping springs, after driving my truck to feel the difference between ours, I'd recommend stiffer/fresher springs as a first step.

 

[cruisermatt]

I drove @GLTHFJ60 ‘s 60 and it was better then mine with the ONLY suspension difference being 3-4 more leafs in his front packs and shackle forwards vs my shackle reversal. Same shocks, same spring length, and his front suspension bushings, shocks, springs were pretty worn out too.

 

[cruisermatt]

@workingdog
Here’s what I had/have. This was my first set of springs when I set my SOA up. They are rear 2.5” lift springs that have several leafs removed, and rubber bushings. Not too different in terms of pack thickness and probably spring rate that you have up front.

This is what I have now. Stock rear spring pack with all the leafs included (minus the lowest shortest leaf). With polyurethane bushings.

My point is, with this being the ONLY change I made, I got a massive increase in driveability and handling. So go add some leafs to your front packs, that’s a quick bolt-on change that I promise will help.

 

[workingdog]

Thanks for all the info, it's been very helpful.

Got it down to a good alignment shop and they fixed the toe the previous guy had done. It's only got 2 degrees of caster, and there's a bit of a hook to the rear axle.

But, while we were there, they walked me through it. It's so nice to have it up on the rack. You could easily see the rear springs are shot, particularly the drivers side rear.
My memory is they took leaves out to get the rear end down, and last years Rubicon when we had it loaded to the gills with gear must have been too much for it.

And it looks like the driver's side rear shackle mount is not lined up with the spring perch on the axle.

See how the shackle is at an odd angle and the shackle hanger looks about 1/2" outboard of the spring perch on the axle?

So, clearly I need to address the springs before I do anything else. I assume I'll be going with Alcan as I can get them the height I need at the length I want. I'm going to a spring shop next week to see if the shackle hanger is really off.

 

[workingdog]

More questions? Where are you guys getting your springs? Do you think the forward versus reverse shackle makes a difference? What would you suggest for shocks.?

 

[cruisermatt]

That’s the stock rear shackle hanger.

Most of us SOA wagon guys are running 63” Chevy 3/4-ton rear springs.

Are you close to Atlas suspension? @MyCruiserisaHogBeast just had a bunch of work done to his there. If he could post up his experiences that would be great.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

3/4 ton chevy rear springs are very good for your application

Shocks-stiff cheap ones like Rancho 9000 work as do big $$ Kings, Fox, etc. Bilsteins are way under damped.

Regarding the perch alignment I think the spring perches are spaced a bit too wide.

 

[cruisermatt]

Back to sway bars for a minute, steering boxes on an 80 are a bit farther forwards then on a 60, so this should work on a 60 with leaf springs I think. I was really hoping to keep the arms straight so I could make them myself and out of aluminum but I just don't think it can happen. @nukegoat used pre-manufactured arms on his and bent/welded them

How to add a front aftermarket sway bar to your cruiser

I'm sort of smug about this one - I finally was able to crack the "secret" to packaging a 3-piece front sway bar on these things. The result? Fantastic. Driving on road is much improved again. -----Context ---- As most of you know, the front sway bar with radius arms is sort of vestigial at...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[workingdog]

Atlas is an 8 hour drive.

I had intended to do the cheby springs, but it didn't happen. Maybe it's time now.
Good info on the bilsteins.

I can't see how that arm is attached to the axle.

 

[tmxmotorsports]

Atlas is an 8 hour drive.

I had intended to do the cheby springs, but it didn't happen. Maybe it's time now.
Good info on the bilsteins.

I can't see how that arm is attached to the axle.

If you zoom in you can see it little short link attached to the axle truss looking thing

 

[workingdog]

So, that's a bump stop behind I'm seeing? That's a very fancy looking attaching rod. Someone has a cnc machine.

 

[tmxmotorsports]

Nah its a female heim joint and a male heim joint must not have to many threads screwed in tho unless its a long male threaded heim joint and yep nitrogen charged bump stops

 

[nukegoat]

Nah its a female heim joint and a male heim joint must not have to many threads screwed in tho unless its a long male threaded heim joint and yep nitrogen charged bump stops

There's a threaded rod in between two female heims w/ studs now

 

[Cruiserdrew]

3/4 ton chevy rear springs are very good for your application.

And I should mention, there are many versions of 3/4 ton springs. I'd recommend heavier ones than stock 3/4 ton. Keep the overload spring. National Spring has the goods. Your local junk yard does too, but it's harder to select the heavy duty springs you want. And BTW, the overload spring leaf basically kills any spring wrap, so it makes for a good, heavy duty solution.