Build Big Red Toy

[The Phoenician]

@boots4

I managed to convince the wife to ride with me in a thunderstorm and take notes. I'm not sure what factors are involved to make an accurate determination, but it was a cooler day and raining constantly, so speed was at 65mph max. Some uphill, a little downhill and normal traffic for a nation under quarantine. I included what gear I was in, just in case it mattered, but it doesn't look like it did. As you may very well be aware, a manual transmission makes the turbos have to rebuild all the boost once you're shifting. I'll keep doing this with different driving conditions and weather temps to see if there's a difference. I figured some data is better than no data. I didn't know how you want it sorted, so I can either send you the excel sheet or sort it the way you prefer. I couldn't go over 20 PSI because that would exceed 1200* on the pyrometer.

Total Boost in PSI	Large Turbo Boost in PSI	Gear/Speed	Outside Temps In Farenheit	Weather	Date
10	3	3rd	55*	T-Storms	4/3/2020
15	4	4th
11	3	2nd
5	1	5th
18	5	5th
10	3	3rd
16	5	4th
10	3	5th
15	4	5th
17	5	5th
19	6	5th
18	5	5th
20	6	5th
12	4	5th
14	4	5th
8	2	5th
20	7	5th
16	5	4th
8	2	4th
13	4	4th
16	5	3rd
19	6	4th
15	4	5th
18	5	4th
14	4	5th
19	6	5th
6	1	4th
10	3	4th

 

[Hojack]

Did you get any rpm’s?
From my memory
3rd will put out 22 psi at 3100 rpm’s
4th will put out 28 psi

 

[The Phoenician]

I didn't. I typically don't go over 2200 RPMs, as EGTs will be too high by then. It's a balancing act with this rig.

 

[boots4]

Excellent. I will run some numbers with the data you provided to start the review. All I'm really looking for is the the boost numbers for total and large turbo, I don't need the gears or rpms. The last thing I'll need (which I think you probably provided in a previous post) is your average elevation you normally drive in. I hope to be able to help with some tuning ideas regarding your higher EGTs.

Let's see some pics of the new set up!

 

[The Phoenician]

Thanks. I'll post some up this evening. It's really raining right now and I'm helping my buddy look for one of his cows.

 

[The Phoenician]

Elevation 755 ft.

 

[The Phoenician]

Decided to play in the mud a bit. Videos will follow later after I upload them. Today was the first time drifting in a vehicle as tall as big red and it was fun.

Also finally mounted the rear sight on my HK. I need to do the same for my other HK.

Tomorrow, if it doesn't rain will be a painful day of getting the mud off.

 

[Mr Cimarron]

Decided to play in the mud a bit. Videos will follow later after I upload them. Today was the first time drifting in a vehicle as tall as big red and it was fun.
View attachment 2260803View attachment 2260804View attachment 2260807View attachment 2260808View attachment 2260809

Also finally mounted the rear sight on my HK. I need to do the same for my other HK.

Tomorrow, if it doesn't rain will be a painful day of getting the mud off.

I have the same pistol except. However my light won’t fit on my compact rail. Only the full size. I think it’s the Surefire X-2.

 

[The Phoenician]

I have the same pistol except. However my light won’t fit on my compact rail. Only the full size. I think it’s the Surefire X-2.

HK pistols are weird like that. I had to use an adapter for it to fit in the Full size USP.

 

[The Phoenician]

Looks like this is the only drone footage that was recorded. I had issues synching the drone and then issues with the SD card recording. It's a shame because we took some good video crossing the pond.
Incidentally, today was the first time I was able to hit 4000 RPM in the 4BT. Was in the muddy pond trying to get out. I also think I have a leak in my front locker. I first realized it at LC RoundUp 2 years ago, but never addressed it then forgot about it. I guess at some point I have to look into it.

 

[The Phoenician]

Here's the new turbo set up.

You can see the hood had been rubbing on the housing. I banged the hood in and placed a piece of rubber to prevent contact

 

[The Phoenician]

The wife and neighbors found a way to Hate me even more.

I had to buy a new pressure washer as the old one broke.

 

[Mr Cimarron]

Farm dirt is some good fertilizer. When I was a kid my dad used to stink up the yard throwing feed sacks full of dried cow s*** all over the grass.

 

[boots4]

Ran some numbers and here are the results:

Total Boost - psi	Large Turbo - psi	Small Turbo - psi
5	1	3.7
10	3	5.8
15	4	8.7
20	6.5	9.2

With only being able to get up to 20 total psi numbers the results are limited. But... looking at total 15 where large is 4 and small is 8.7 and then total 20 where large is 6.5 and small is 9.2 we can begin to see the large turbo starting to spool up. At this point the small turbo may not make a whole lot more even though that super 30 can make and handle a bunch more. Initial limited review would suggest the little turbo needs to do more work.

From the pictures above it looks like the small turbo's wastegate actuator's pressure feed is coming from the small turbo's compressor housing and that means the actuator controlling the wastegate is seeing the total boost numbers. I'm guessing the actuator is factory set and probably starting to open up around 20 psi which is the highest boost number you provided and which we are starting to see with the psi numbers. We need to keep that actuator from opening the small turbo's wastegate until it's see's higher psi numbers. We can do this a couple of ways:

1. Tighten the rod going from the wastegate actuator to the wastegate lever to increase preload on the internal spring on the actuator's diaphragm. This means that it will take more boost psi to overcome the spring preload in the actuator to open the wastegate which in turn will keep more exhaust flow working on the small turbo making it produce more boost.
2. Get a "boost fooler" , also know as a manual boost controller (you can make your own or buy one online), and insert that in the feed line going from the small compressor's housing to the actuator. This will "modify" the signal/feed pressure going to the actuator so that the actuator won't see the full boost (or it get's delayed) generated in the compressor housing and in turn keep the wastegate closed longer allowing the small turbo to do more work. This little device is adjustable which is helpful in tuning the load between the small and large turbo.
3. Do both 1 and 2 if neither are enough to get the small working harder.

The benefit of getting the small turbo to work more will be better boost response, should clean up some smoke, and can actually lower egts.

 

[The Phoenician]

Ran some numbers and here are the results:

Total Boost - psi	Large Turbo - psi	Small Turbo - psi
5	1	3.7
10	3	5.8
15	4	8.7
20	6.5	9.2

With only being able to get up to 20 total psi numbers the results are limited. But... looking at total 15 where large is 4 and small is 8.7 and then total 20 where large is 6.5 and small is 9.2 we can begin to see the large turbo starting to spool up. At this point the small turbo may not make a whole lot more even though that super 30 can make and handle a bunch more. Initial limited review would suggest the little turbo needs to do more work.

From the pictures above it looks like the small turbo's wastegate actuator's pressure feed is coming from the small turbo's compressor housing and that means the actuator controlling the wastegate is seeing the total boost numbers. I'm guessing the actuator is factory set and probably starting to open up around 20 psi which is the highest boost number you provided and which we are starting to see with the psi numbers. We need to keep that actuator from opening the small turbo's wastegate until it's see's higher psi numbers. We can do this a couple of ways:

1. Tighten the rod going from the wastegate actuator to the wastegate lever to increase preload on the internal spring on the actuator's diaphragm. This means that it will take more boost psi to overcome the spring preload in the actuator to open the wastegate which in turn will keep more exhaust flow working on the small turbo making it produce more boost.
2. Get a "boost fooler" , also know as a manual boost controller (you can make your own or buy one online), and insert that in the feed line going from the small compressor's housing to the actuator. This will "modify" the signal/feed pressure going to the actuator so that the actuator won't see the full boost (or it get's delayed) generated in the compressor housing and in turn keep the wastegate closed longer allowing the small turbo to do more work. This little device is adjustable which is helpful in tuning the load between the small and large turbo.
3. Do both 1 and 2 if neither are enough to get the small working harder.

The benefit of getting the small turbo to work more will be better boost response, should clean up some smoke, and can actually lower egts.

Thanks for doing this. I was just actually thinking about you. The small turbo Waste gate is still factory set, and yes 20psi is where i notice it begins to struggle to go higher. Boost fooler might be the way to go as it's hard to reach that rod.

 

[boots4]

Agreed, a boost fooler should be easy to install and easy to adjust. Once one get's installed we can run the numbers again to see the results.

There are lots of options but something like this: manual boost controller | eBay

 

[Hojack]

The wife and neighbors found a way to Hate me even more.

View attachment 2262883View attachment 2262884View attachment 2262885View attachment 2262886View attachment 2262887

I had to buy a new pressure washer as the old one broke.

Maybe next time over the lawn...

 

[The Phoenician]

I might have to get something like this.

Space is tight.

 

[The Phoenician]

Maybe next time over the lawn...

2 things. I didn't think about it and when i did think about it, the hose was too short.

 

[boots4]

That is exactly what I'm using on my small turbo actuator reference line. I ended up making mine. They work by restricting the amount of signal getting to the actuator.