1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Big fat brake upgrade

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by bjowett, Jan 30, 2004.

  1. bjowett

    bjowett Supporting Vendor

    Messages:
    3,322
    Likes Received:
    880
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2002
    Location:
    Western Massachusetts
    Yet another upgrade for the 80.... larger front brakes. I HATE brakes that fade, brakes that are not up to the job, brakes that warp, you all know what I'm talking about.... the automatic transmission doesn't help matters either. It's a peve of mine.
    This season, larger rotors will be finding their way onto the piggy so it may properly slow and stop time after time while driving over the various mountain passes around here.

    IMO, the stock calipers are more than adequate for the job. A larger more stable rotor is needed, more leverage, more heat absorbing ability, and much greater heat disapation.

    The plan, find a floating HD directional vane rotor in the 12.5" - 13" dia. x 1.25"+ thick size. Then, have a steel hat machined to fit it to the hub.... Have a bracket machined from steel to space the caliper out further for rotor clearance.

    The upgrade will most likely require a 17" wheel, though it may be possible for it to sneak under a steel 16". A 17" wheel won't be an issue for me, the 35"+ tire I will be running should still have plenty of sidewall.

    My point in posting this? More than 1 set can be done, if other folks have some interest, I can get an esimate on what this upgrade will cost. Not looking to make any money on this one (actually looking to save, the more they make, the cheaper it is, I've done this before). Sooooo.... just offering up something that has always been a no brainer upgrade for a fatty truck with large tires. I'd like to keep the cost around $500 - not including the wheel and tire upgrade. :flipoff2:

    Have at it.
     
  2. Darwood

    Darwood

    Messages:
    1,957
    Likes Received:
    4
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2003
    Location:
    Z.O.W.I.E. Headquarters
  3. bjowett

    bjowett Supporting Vendor

    Messages:
    3,322
    Likes Received:
    880
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2002
    Location:
    Western Massachusetts
    Thanks for the DBA suggestion, I am aware of those.... but I want more! :D
     
  4. lagwagon

    lagwagon

    Messages:
    1,061
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Location:
    Loomis, CA
    You've definitely been reading Europian Car magazine!
     
  5. robbie

    robbie Guest

    There is one maybe two companies that make caliper and rotor kits for the 80 series. I saw them at the sema show two years ago. The kit include bigger calipers (6 piston I believe), bigger rotors, new brake lines, pads to match. All this for about 2500. and you needed to run 17 in rims. If you can not find it for the 80 series, look for the Lexus 450. I really did think it was too much money. later robbie
     
  6. bjowett

    bjowett Supporting Vendor

    Messages:
    3,322
    Likes Received:
    880
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2002
    Location:
    Western Massachusetts
    Yeah, I read EC. :D

    That is too much for the FJ80 - the big expense with the many of the kits is the big alloy calipers, which again, the 80 dosn't need. Don't get me wrong, they have their place, my VW has a Brembo 4 pot each corner, I did that whole system front and back for about $2k, though. Just like your 4.7L, it is almost amazing what can be done if you know how to build it.
     
  7. Mr.Bryan

    Mr.Bryan

    Messages:
    1,117
    Likes Received:
    54
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2003
    Location:
    Over here
    i've got eh DBA rotors up front and this spring i'm doing the rears, I really love the improvement the rotors made. (i also have a set of ceramic pads) and if I slam on the brakes, I can kick abs on no problem on a dry sunny day. Once the rear is done, it should be that much better. But I guess if you need more then you need more :D

    -Bryan :beer:
     
  8. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Moderator

    Messages:
    21,564
    Likes Received:
    4,673
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Surrounded by Cruisers from all over the world
    Don't anybody get a rock caught in one of those holes in the rotors. :eek:
     
  9. IdahoDoug

    IdahoDoug

    Messages:
    8,848
    Likes Received:
    238
    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2003
    I have a well maintained stock brake system and I can engage ABS by jumping on the brakes at highway speeds no problem. How can you improve on a system if it can overpower the available traction of the tire's contact patch on dry pavement?

    I too have had the stock rotors warp, but it took about 100k and they were plenty thinned out by then. It is worth discussing whether the warping problems many have experienced could have come from neglect by the previous owners. For instance, not bleeding them regularly means pistons that don't fully retract if moisture has caused a bit of corrosion. So, the brakes are always much warmer than they should be at the onset of braking and the peak temps go up commensurately. Or, moisture buildup causes boiling of the brake fluid and instantly uneven braking that would happen over and over - overheating some rotors and underutilizing others.

    I am extremely hard on our Cruiser's brakes because of the amount of summer towing and the mountains we do. I have probably experienced a half dozen emergency stops in the 20,000 or so miles of towing, with two of them full on panic stopping from 60 to zero. I've become convinced that the IQ of other drivers decreases around trailers - people do the most amazingly stupid things while driving around those of us towing rigs.

    One stop I'll also never forget involved non operating trailer brakes as I'd forgotten to disengage the brake override to back the trailer up earlier. We exited the freeway onto a downhill exit and I hit the brakes and instantly realized we were in trouble - 6000lbs of trailer with no brakes. I hammered the pedal and the ABS kicked in, then out, then in as I tried to stay at threshold lockup. We arrived at the stop sign still going a few miles an hour and as soon as I realized there was no traffic I just rolled it and kept the truck going for cooling airflow. With the boat trailer and the usual trip stuff, we weighed a tad under 12,000lbs. No warpage. But I did bleed the brakes later that month as a precaution.

    So, the stock system seems quite capable to me, and I seriously wonder if many would benefit from starting fresh with new Toyota rotors all around, new pads all around, and a brake bleed for a total of $500 in parts and 4 hours work at home. Toss in the $22 front rotor rebuild kit while you've got it apart and you're essentially back at the braking capability Mr. T intended for 1/5 the cost of this aftermarket system.

    I use Castrol's synthetic brake fluid for the high boil point, and I'd be interested in doing a head to head braking competition with someone here who's got an aftermarket upgrade vs my well maintained stock system. We could agree on a simple procedure repeated 3 times and see where it goes. If someone's got stock LTX tires the test will be very comparable. Takers?

    DougM
     
  10. bjowett

    bjowett Supporting Vendor

    Messages:
    3,322
    Likes Received:
    880
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2002
    Location:
    Western Massachusetts
    Thanks for the input, Doug...I do appreciate!

    My truck recently had a complete Toyota brake job, no problems with my system - yet. I hear about problems time and time again, and I have watched my friends 80 wear out his syetm in short order. Throw on 35" tires and some "spirited" driving down the twisty mountain roads around here, and I doubt the brakes will hold up. Most systems will handle one good stop (then they warp, because most folks sit there)... it's the repeated heavy time after time use. I like to over build. :D
     
  11. IdahoDoug

    IdahoDoug

    Messages:
    8,848
    Likes Received:
    238
    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2003
    I'll look forward to what you come up with. You'll have your work cut out for you with 35s, I'd say, if you want stock stopping performance. Obviously the proportioning valve will need adjustment as well. Also, take a look at the small wheel spats some new cars (check the Hyundai Tiburon as an example) have in front of their inboard wheel wells to guide air into the brakes.

    When you get it done, slap on some stock wheels/tires and we'll do a measurement, eh? :cheers:

    DougM
     
  12. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

    Messages:
    18,893
    Likes Received:
    1,020
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Groveland MA
    I managed to warp the rear rotors, of course it was from the e-brake being stuck on :slap:.
     
  13. DanKunz

    DanKunz SILVER Star

    Messages:
    9,404
    Media:
    2
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    868
    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Location:
    Woodstock, GA
    I just have people in front of me send me a message two days in advance so I know I have enough time to stop.

    I just replaced my rear brakes and did fronts several months ago (rotors and all up front).

    I have drums in the rear and I can stop pretty quickly....

    Just don't let your kids play in front of me is all I can say. :cheers:
     
  14. the shed guy

    the shed guy

    Messages:
    624
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2003
    Location:
    DOWN UNDER
    Camburg make six pot calipers and bigger rotors can be done by any decent race brake supplier for the cruiser. www.camburgengineering.com they are on the acc page I think.

    Once you replace the front calipers with something decent, you can then move the front 4 pots to the rear with DBA rear rotors.

    BTW slotted are to let the gas escape that builds from the pad getting hot, cross drilled are to lower recipricating mass.

    And the big thing is use synth brake fluid, and change it every 12 months, old brake fluid is the biggest cause of brake swhich dont "work like they used to"
     
  15. Beowulf

    Beowulf

    Messages:
    12,530
    Likes Received:
    48
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Somewhere in the foothills...
    >> And the big thing is use synth brake fluid, and change it every 12 months, <<
    >> old brake fluid is the biggest cause of brakes which dont "work like they used to" <<

    I replaced my brake lines with SS lines and flushed with Castrol synthetic brake fluid. One or both of those mods made a huge improvement in pedal feel.

    Later... What was I thinking.... it was Valvoline synthetic brake fluid. Sheesh.

    -B-
     
  16. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

    Messages:
    18,893
    Likes Received:
    1,020
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Groveland MA
    A few years (8) back I was told that Synthetic brake fluid was not compatable with a normal system. Has something changed?
     
  17. IdahoDoug

    IdahoDoug

    Messages:
    8,848
    Likes Received:
    238
    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2003
    Yes, you're no longer listening to this person.

    DougM
     
  18. 97 FZJ80

    97 FZJ80

    Messages:
    1,538
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    8
    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2003
    Location:
    Plano Texas
    Valvoline Synpower is a DOT3/4 brake fluid that is compatiable with the regular brake fluids. The DOT5 silicon fluid are not and the brake system must be flushed clean before putting the DOT5 fluid in.
     
  19. Jim_Chow

    Jim_Chow

    Messages:
    2,479
    Likes Received:
    5
    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2003
    Location:
    Turquoise Trail, N NM
    Here's how you can make your cruiser stop like a Ferrari, but it's gonna cost ya....In a landcruiser book I bought in japan (there's a vol 1 and vol 2 book, they show pretty much all the cruiser accessories), it shows a kit available for the 80 and 100 series that upgrades the rotors to (IIRC) 355mm brembos, plus it uses Ferrari F40 brembo calipers. You need to run 18" wheels. Kit costs about 550,000 yen ($5000 USD). For the 100, you can get either the brembo rotor/caliper kit ($5000) or calipers only ($2000). Same F40 calipers are used.
     
  20. Riley

    Riley

    Messages:
    1,615
    Likes Received:
    11
    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2003
    Location:
    Fort Langley, BC
    This has been a good thread after all. I'm gonna replace my brake fluid with synth as I'm getting tired of my dubious braking ability in the 80.

    Last weekend, some dumb lady pulled out right in front of me then stopped. I almost Tboned her but dodged around her. I thought that she was a goner as I stood on the brakes. The ABS never kicked in, as I couldn't get enough brake on it. I need some better brakes.