Alcans (again)
- Thread starter YukonCruisers
- Start date
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What about the longer spring is making it tight ?
I doubt it. Cruisers are notorious for their driver side lean. So much so that one of Man-A-Fre’s fixes back in the day was a 3/4” lowering block for the “offending high side”, which to me is just... just....
blasphemy!!
It was just more difficult to get the shackles aligned when installing because the spring is longer. Not sure how to explain, there is always tension on a shackle but it seems there is more pressure on it than a standard set of springs at resting state. Not sure if that is making any sense. I could be totally mistaken. I'm not a suspension specialist by any stretch. I do know it rides real nice though.
I’m truly trying to be helpful here so don’t take this as I think I know more than your local rock crawler builder/fabricator or I believe something you have done is right or wrong. These are just my opinions and they might steer you in a slightly different direction to solve your “tight spring” thing.
If you have a 3” lift spring made the main leaf would need to be longer, without doing all the math about an inch sounds about right +/- a little. This has more to do with getting your shackle angle back in the ballpark at ride height and looking at the photo you posted (the best I can tell) it looks close so I wouldn’t remove them and have them shortened before I did a few things first.
Confirm the source of your intermittent lean issue, this could be as simple as spirted drive on a bumpy road or a little more grease and this problem solves itself or an issue with one of the spring eye bushings.(Don’t rule out a sticky shock, new doesn’t always = good) Second the spring main leaf length is an important number in the geometry that makes all of the components work together and when you get it wrong not only ride quality suffers but you’ll start inverting shackles and limit travel.
If you decide you need shorter springs take a day and do the math, the correct geometry is well documented across the internet and knowing is going to be better than guessing when it comes to making another change on your springs.
Good luck.
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Thanks Jim, you said what I was getting ready to say - with lift springs, they have to be longer to compensate for the arch, otherwise your shackles would be in what’s referred to as “negative cam zone” which can be hell on a frame because the suspension can’t work like it’s supposed to. Judging from the above pic, your front shackles look to be around 50 - 60 degrees, which isn’t too bad. If they were actually too long, your shackles would be almost horizontal, with the spring eye trying to touch the frame.
@J Mack @RUSH55 Thanks for the feedback. No offense taken. I don't know that i put any stock in to what the local rock crawler dude said anyway, just thought i'd mention his opinion. I realize the lifted springs need to be longer. I had Alcan build the lift spring taking their usual specs for that amount of lift and then adding 1" of length to the shackle side. So they are longer for the lift, and then longer again because I asked them to make them so. I really don't want to take them off the rig again - the lean really bothers me though so I've just been trying to figure out what could possibly be causing it. I've loosened, tightened, re-greased shackles and pins. Swapped springs side to side. Where the lean amount varies from quite a bit to almost none it makes me think something it binding. I guess in theory if I remove the shocks and see where it sits I could rule out them as the issue.
OK now I’m understanding your 1” longer statement and that would make more sense why your shackles look a little forward of where they should be.
Your spring rate is predictable from just past vertical to 45° shackle angle then starts to fall off pretty quick, you could be operating in the 30° to 75° zone for instance with a longer spring and yes that would give a nice soft ride but would also be unpredictable.
Again I believe a tape measure, angle finder and a calculator will be your best friend before you make any permanent changes.
Good luck
Possibly try an add-a-leaf on the offending low side(s) or replace one or two leaves with one of a higher rating or arch.
I really wouldn’t want to change out your springs again either considering the ride quality is good and your shackle angles look decent.
Otherwise, after some measuring, possibly have the main leaves reworked to give you your desired driver side ride height, and remove 1/2” of length.
I really wouldn’t want to change out your springs again either considering the ride quality is good and your shackle angles look decent.
Otherwise, after some measuring, possibly have the main leaves reworked to give you your desired driver side ride height, and remove 1/2” of length.
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Well I pulled the axles and springs and set the rig down on axle stands - looks kind of good sitting low, maybe I will give up on the lift and go for a lowrider..
Taking the springs to a local shop in the next couple of days to see what they can do, also called another shop 2 hours from here and they were really excited about putting together an OME package with longer billy shocks up front- I didn't know those leafs have a proprietary rippled or wavy surface that decreases friction and improves ride/articulation
Taking the springs to a local shop in the next couple of days to see what they can do, also called another shop 2 hours from here and they were really excited about putting together an OME package with longer billy shocks up front- I didn't know those leafs have a proprietary rippled or wavy surface that decreases friction and improves ride/articulation
Great picture! Hope I can make it up your way sometime...
Pretty good rule to have!
I would follow up on this, something is making you think things are binding...
Shocks? Easy enough to check as you and @J Mack stated above.
Shackles? Are you running the correct size shouldered bolts to ensure they don't bind?
What kind of wraps do you have on your spring packs? Could the spring packs be binding?
just waiting on my door cards so i can install the welting/bulb seal on the door openings - want to get that on before wheeling to keep the doors from banging and getting scratched. Soon i hope.
Agree looks great in that picture!