A proposal for the TLCA (1 Viewer)

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

Romer

fatherofdaughterofromer
Moderator
Joined
Sep 14, 2003
Threads
559
Messages
11,958
Location
Centennial, Colorado
Lots of dialogue on the web and BODREPS on the status of the TLCA. Instead of saying the TLCA is the wrong rock, bring me another, I thought I would take some time while sipin a Crown and smoking a Macanudu to put down my thoughts.

What would I like the TLCA to become?

First and foremost, I think the TLCA should be an all Toyota 4WD club like it claims to be. This can be accomplished and still retain the Land Cruiser Heritage by saying we are the Toyota and Land Cruiser Association. Here are my reasons:

Aren’t we already acting this way with our clubs and events, but not following through at the National level?
· A good percentage of Rising Sun is made up of non Land Cruisers, heck I own two 4runners myself. We make these club members join the TLCA yet they sometimes feel excluded by the Land Cruiser preference. If it wasn’t for the club, these folks would drop out of the TLCA.
· A good percentage of attendants at TLCA events are non Land Cruiser owners
· We are pursuing the large FJ Cruiser contingent and a lot of them are tired of being told its not a Land Cruiser. These FJ Cruisers are quite capable and I have wheeled with them many times. I am glad to have them in the association.
· One of the reasons people don’t stay is they feel excluded without a Land Cruiser. Why does anyone want to stay in a club if they feel like they are the second tier membership.

The TLCA should be about education of Toyota vehicles, 4wheeling and Land Use. How about making some video segments for our new web sites available to members on wheeling techniques. The first one would be on Power Braking, what it is, when to use it and when not to with a demonstration. These could be put together by the chapters and members. We already do a Leader/gunner class before Moab, we could film a few segments of that.
Then when there is enough material, cut these into a DVD with some wheeling footage of some of the TLCA events (make them want to come) and sell it on Mud, TTORA, etc.

Best way to get folks into Land Use is to get them mad. Show them a great trail and responsible wheeling followed by a closed sign and what could have been done along with some success stories. Video and print and the web site would be good here. You could send an e-mail out to members when a new video is posted and give them the option to unsubscribe. Let them know what they individually can do and what the TLCA is doing even if its just donating money or time. We have many examples we could offer up with Rising Sun.

Make it about the family. Let people know their membership includes their family, but an extra membership is required if they want additional issues of TT, maybe make this an option. Highlight families wheeling and enjoying the sport together.

The TLCA membership is also a network. Why don’t we have a database (like woody use to) that allows members to have their name and number in a National list so if your in Oklahoma and you break down, you have a list of people who you can call and at least tell you where to get parts.

The Rising Sun Club has evolved with its membership and is no longer a Land Cruiser Club. We are a Toyota and Land Cruiser Club where all are treated equal. One of our new members had an FJ and wasn’t sure he would be accepted and we quickly changed his mind and put him to work (he he he) we have several FJ owners in our club

Right now the Rising Sun Club has elected volunteers as a Philanthropy committee to decide where to donate the proceeds from Cruise Moab (yes we paid TLCA 10%). This committee then brings back their recommendations for a vote by the club and the decisions are published in the minutes. Members have a say and get to vote and get to know where the money is going. For the TLCA, they could select a cross country committee of volunteers and give them a forum to work out the set number of cash, bring it to the BOD for a vote and then publish where the donations go on the forum or the main page. I have no idea where or if the TLCA donates money. I am sure they do, but I don’t have the information.

As I said, we need to make it inclusive of those we make join and for those we hope will join. There are probably people out there with better ideas on how to make it inclusive.

The TLCA needs to grow with its membership and accept that change is inevitable or the other option is a slow death. All I am suggesting is that the TLCA embrace the change based on its current dues paying card carrying Toyota drivin’ membership. Heck even Tony Twiddy has a mini-truck

Pretty soon if the TLCA doesn’t progress and the Chapters continue to, there will eventually be a point where Chapters may leave and I would hate to see that happen as the Chapters are what puts on the events and contribute most of the material to TT. Like any organization, 20% of the people do 80% of the work.

We need to capture a Vision that embraces what we want the TLCA to be, so here is a suggestion (its too long and needs to be whittled down a bit)

The Toyota and Land Cruiser Association vision is to enhance and expand the knowledge of our Toyota membership for responsible wheeling, environmental awareness, vehicle education and networking among like minded folks to build extended family relationships.

Next thing needed is a strategy. Any good strategy will have three points or its not worth anything

Where we are today
Where we want to be – need to quantify something to measure
And how we are going to get there

So my take on a Strategy is as follows:

Today we are an all Toyota Club with an emphasis on the Land Cruiser without a strong sense of belonging by a lot of our membership

We want to be an inclusive Toyota Club while maintaining the Land Cruiser heritage. We want people to have fun, want to be members and feel they are getting a lot out of the TLCA and as a result want to give back. We want to have a membership of 4000 members that grows by 10% each year.

We will get there by being inclusive, using current technology with e-mails and video, web site and print to provide information for our members. Inform people more about clubs in there areas and have meet and greets so people can learn more about the TLCA, Local Clubs. Wheeling and Land Use

Those are my thoughts and that should be enough to get Kowboy stirred up. Besides my drink is empty and I have to get up to refill it.

 
Last edited:
Ken,

I now see why you are the Front Range's Birfield Boss. Organizations need to evolve to stay alive. A few years back there was this other upstart organization called TTORA. Back then it was Tacoma Territory. Now it's Toyota Territory. Even they have become more "inclusive" vs. "exclusive." As a 4Runner owner I've never felt excluded by TLCA, and the TLCAs name has never bothered me. But, I do see your point. It is a very small change that still recognizes the Toyota 4x4 heritage while accepting that times have changed.

Romer for President.
 
I'm with Pappy on the owning a 4Runner and not minding the TLCA name, plus it helps that I don't care if members give me #*%$ about not having a cruiser... But there are a lot of people that don't have the thick skin that I do... and are turned off by what may even be a friendly prod. But if that prod comes before the person feels accepted, and a part of the group, it may just push them out the door.

I like Romers video ideas, show people what the TLCA is, and they will want to join, tell them to join, then figure it out, and............ Etc. :cheers:
 
Ken, thanks for organizing and presenting those thoughts. I could use some lessons on your technique 'cause drinking, smoking, and typing ain't easy for me - and I don't smoke.

I think you've accurately picked up the mood and direction of the new TLCA.

Sadly, for me, I lament the loss of a small car club focused on the rare and unusual Toyota Land Cruiser. You know, the ones strangers on the street call a "Jeep", despite knowing it's not, but for lack of knowing its real name.

I find nothing specific in the "new vision" that is aimed at preserving and protecting the history of the Land Cruiser. Honestly, I doubt this is important except for nostalgia sake. Does the history (or even technical details) of the Land Cruiser really matter new FJC, 4Runners or Tacoma owners? I think not. If I was them, I'd be thinking get over it old timer... carburetor, solid axles, leaf springs.... give me a break. Those things are primitive, uncomfortable and soon to be gone relics. They have no future and neither does a club that caters to them.

Ken, you've done a great job of articulating the TLCA focus on growing membership and accommodate diversity of vehicles and interests. As Pappy observes we need to be inclusive, expand to a all Toyota 4WD club or die. Heck, Toyota may quit making Land Cruisers, make new ones very expensive, or simply quit selling them in the USA. What would happen to the club then?

I my opinion it's more than reasonable to change the name to "Toyota 4WD Association." Grow the membership, promote responsible wheeling, land use and have fun wheeling Toyota 4wd vehicles with lots of great people. I'll likely participate and enjoy such a club. But it won't be a Land Cruiser club and I for one will lament the loss of a club dedicated to the Toyota Land Cruiser. At least the name TLCA would become available.

When I look at FJCs, 4Runners, Tacos, Tundras, 4WD Tercels and 4WD Vans I don't get the same feeling I get when I look at Land Cruisers. No offense that's just my personal perspective. But show me a FJ25, fj45, fj55, fj60, fj80, fzj80, 100 series, 200 series, or even better some non-USA, rare or exotic Land Cruisers, and I'm excited. I like Land Cruisers and I like Cruiserheads who are nuts about them. I appreciate the technical and historical expertise of these fanatics and I like hanging out with them.

Admittedly such a club would likely have a limited and diminishing membership - similar to the limited and diminishing presence of the Land Cruiser vehicle.

Land Cruisers are not mainstream and I think they deserve an exclusive club. Toyota doesn't even promote them around here. I never see advertisements for Land Cruisers in print or on television. In fact, if I recall correctly, Toyota's limited support of the TCLA's Toyota Trails magazine, has consisted of Tacoma and FJC ads. The Land Cruiser vehicle is an exception to the rule. A minority. A quirky, funky strange vehicle with a strangely dedicated and enthusiastic following. A vehicle like that deserves its own club and if it's not the "Toyota Land Cruiser Association" then who is it?

Sincerely offered as "food for thought",
 
Pretty soon if the TLCA doesn’t progress and the Chapters continue to, there will eventually be a point where Chapters may leave and I would hate to see that happen as the Chapters are what puts on the events and contribute most of the material to TT ...

... those are my thoughts and that should be enough to get Kowboy stirred up.

Reckon there's alot of Folks just wish I'd go away. :grinpimp:

I think it's worth ponderin' why would a chapter want to stay with TLCA? ... I honestly don't know. Yet, The White Trash'll most likely stick 'round 'till we're kicked out. :rolleyes:

And why even be a member of a Chapter ... much less TLCA?

Some of The White Trash are active in TLCA ... some contribute to TT ... some are TLCA burnout victims ... and some don't, and never did, give a flip about TLCA. We drive Land Cruisers, mini's, 4-Runners, Taco's, buggies, Jeeps, etc. Members have been hand-picked for the person ... not the truck they drive. Membership to TLCA is no longer enforced, encouraged, or suggested for our members ... even for those drivin' Ty'otas. Each member has the right to choose if a TLCA membership is good for them or not. We have no committees, no meetin's, no votin', no elections, no newsletter.

So why have we maintained our membership?

Best I can figure it's just to have a good time ... a guaranteed good time By Gawd. Whether it's just a smile or a chuckle with a visit to our club's forum here on MUD ... or a handshake and manly hug at an event. Reckon we're a social club that does some wheelin'.

So what's the point? It don't matter what the name of the club is ... it don't matter what type of vehicle Folks drive. Folks join a club in order to feel a part of somethin' bigger than they can achieve on their own ... a sense of belongin' with like-minded individuals ... and first and foremost ... to have an enjoyable time away from the harsh realities of the daily grind we all face.

That's why we go to events.

That's why all TLCA members should go to an event.

Otherwise the club is just a group of magazine subscribers.

Carry on. :beer:

:flamingo:
 
<snip>
Folks join a club in order to feel a part of somethin' bigger than they can achieve on their own ... a sense of belongin' with like-minded individuals ... and first and foremost ... to have an enjoyable time away from the harsh realities of the daily grind we all face.

That's why we go to events.

That's why all TLCA members should go to an event.

Otherwise the club is just a group of magazine subscribers.
<snip>

I'm glad you're here Kowboy. WTOE is an example of a successful Club. We should all try to learn from them.

TLCA is made up of Chapters and Individuals. Chapters are the like-minded individuals mentioned above. TLCA started as a group of Chapters. As Romer said, Chapters make TLCA into a Club and are the 'Heart and Soul' of TLCA. 21% of membership is in the Chapters.

Individual membership expanded with the expansion of Toyota Trails. These individual members, for the most part, are magazine subscribers. Individual members provide the revenue through membership and circulation numbers for ad revenue.

TLCA needs BOTH. However, it's the Chapters that create the content for the magazine that serves the Individuals. So, as I see it, if TLCA focuses on growing and supporting the Chapters, the overall growth will take care of itself.

To grow the Chapters, TLCA must fix the perception of exclusivity that non Land Cruiser owners feel and provide a value to the Chapters. Help the Chapters turn individual members into Chapter members. I think these two issues should be the top priority for TLCA. There are many ideas for how to do this and I would like to see some focused discussions on each topic.

That's it before I go on a rant myself. Gotta go work on the Cruiser.:D

Phil
 
I think it's worth ponderin' why would a chapter want to stay with TLCA? ... I honestly don't know. Yet, The White Trash'll most likely stick 'round 'till we're kicked out. :rolleyes:

The Rising Sun Club will continue to be around as well. Although the politics of the TLCA sometimes bother me, the members never do. One of the great things is meeting others in the TLCA and having a great time. I always get a chuckle thinking of Flat Nasty in 2006 and seeing Kowboy driving with his helmet and Goggles, or CM with some great Apple Cobbler from Cindy Twiddy, or Rubithon 2008 with a warm visit by Pismo Jim with his sarape and shot belt. Its the people in the TLCA that make me and the club want to be part of it. Seems though unless you are in a chapter, the excitment and the team attitude to drive to an event 4 states over just isn't there.

And why even be a member of a Chapter ... much less TLCA?

. . . . . .

So why have we maintained our membership?

Best I can figure it's just to have a good time ... a guaranteed good time By Gawd.

Kowboy hit it right on the head. This is what we do for fun and it shouldn't be work or full of a bunch of BS. We do everything we can to make sure the members are having fun with no thgought about growth. People who show up to see what we are about see the fun and want to join.


That's why all TLCA members should go to an event.

Otherwise the club is just a group of magazine subscribers.

Most of the people that go to events are chapter members so to get more people to events we need to get more people to see what the chapters are all about and then when the chapters become large, break out a new chapter near by like Horsetooth did.

I think events could also be considered local runs. We do several overnight Club events like the Ouray trip, Triple Bypass, Ghost Town Run, Outlaws run and we get great par-tic-ipation

This is one of the reasons we started the Rally in August to give people a chance to see what we are all about and offer to take them on a trail run. It's also one of the reasons we allow anyone to come on our trail runs. In fact, you cant join Rising Sun until you attend an event and see what we are all about.
 
So what's the point? It don't matter what the name of the club is ... it don't matter what type of vehicle Folks drive. Folks join a club in order to feel a part of somethin' bigger than they can achieve on their own ... a sense of belongin' with like-minded individuals ... and first and foremost ... to have an enjoyable time away from the harsh realities of the daily grind we all face.

That's why we go to events.

That's why all TLCA members should go to an event.

Otherwise the club is just a group of magazine subscribers.

Carry on. :beer:

:flamingo:[/QUOTE]


Gotta admit, I never had so much fun as I did at Pismo, sitting around the campfire listening to Kowboy telling stories and Whitie laughing his ass off along with me.

Also that nigh sitting at orangefj45s and toploaders camp and watching him piss his pants while one of the kids went hell bent wild.

And to top off the evening Greg, Sheldon and few others sat around the main camp and had the pleasure of Pismo Jim getting up and sitting around the fire late and shooting the breeze.

I could go on and on, lots of good memories and very good people and thats only one event(I know its not a sanctioned run).
 
So, as I see it, if TLCA focuses on growing and supporting the Chapters, the overall growth will take care of itself.

To grow the Chapters, TLCA must fix the perception of exclusivity that non Land Cruiser owners feel and provide a value to the Chapters. Help the Chapters turn individual members into Chapter members. I think these two issues should be the top priority for TLCA. There are many ideas for how to do this and I would like to see some focused discussions on each topic.

I agree 100% with this statement. We need to provide value to chapters and chapter members. We're just a bumper sticker and a magazine otherwise.

TJK
 
I agree 100% with this statement. We need to provide value to chapters and chapter members. We're just a bumper sticker and a magazine otherwise.

TJK

I have a few things to add to this.

1. Grow chapters.
In getting more people involved in your chapters, you have more people excited about the chapter and it's annual event (if the chapter has one). It's a lot of work in a smaller chapter to put together an event and pull it off every year, there are many people that can attest to this. I think we should send each chapter president an extra 10 copies of TT every issue for their chapter to hand out at get togethers etc.

2. More TLCA National Events.
We have 1 TLCA event every year, the rest are Chapter specific events. We need to have a central and eastern event added at the very minimum, and these events need to be Open to ALL Toyota's in their first year so that the folks not familiar with the TLCA can come and enjoy what we are all about and meet us.

3. As membership increases, so will the content submitted to Todd for TT. We really need to have a section for each model of the trucks in each issue, this keeps everyone happy and may get someone else interested in another model or a new project. I'm thinking 40/45, 55, 60/62, 80/100, Mini/4Runner, Tacoma and FJC. If I missed anyone, it wasn't intentional. As membership increases, we "should" be able to reduce some costs as well as lower the annual membership fee's, be able to work with vendors to offer exclusive TLCA discounts, etc. There are 20,000+ members on FJCruiserForums.com and only ~300 of them are TLCA members at last count, that makes no sense to me.

Just my .02.

I'm fairly new to the TLCA and there are things that frustrate the heck out of me as well, but we can't sit and armchair quarterback from the sidelines, it's counterproductive and makes us all sound like a bunch of whinners. If you are interested in making a difference and can lend a little time (1-2 hours a month at MOST), please hit me up for a position on any of the MSVP Committees that are forming. The Board of Directors want's this feedback and input, and we are trying to keep everyone happy, however, we all know keeping EVERYONE happy just doesn't work, but we are trying...

-Art
 
We really need to have a section for each model of the trucks in each issue, this keeps everyone happy and may get someone else interested in another model or a new project. I'm thinking 40/45, 55, 60/62, 80/100, Mini/4Runner, Tacoma and FJC. If I missed anyone, it wasn't intentional.

It has been my direct experience that reserving space for membership specific input is not successful. Membership will submit what membership will submit.

Your point is valid though, that what appears in the magazine does seem to affect what will appear in future magazines. For example, people see 80 series coverage in Trails and think, hey, I could submit an 80 series article. Interestingly, it doesn't seem to work in the opposite direction though, as in, I see a lot of 80 series coverage, I'm going to submit 40 series content.

My point is that we can reserve the space for specific model coverage but that doesn't mean the articles will be turned in. We used to reserve space to spotlight a different club in each issue. We quit doing that because clubs didn't submit their articles. Similarly, we used to reserve space for Member Rigs but we received so few submissions that we bagged that as well.

So reserving 14+/- pages for model specific coverage would be something that would concern me. What might be a better idea would be to have membership designate a sort of liaison to the model specific worlds who could come back with what they had to offer and we could work it out from there. A member with interest in FJ45's could reach out to that community and perhaps come up with an article once or twice a year. I'm not sure that this isn't what's happening already.

I do think that along these lines, we need to be certain that we're not fracturing the larger group in order to focus on the more specific groups. I'm in this for the group activity and the notion that that includes many different types of Toyota (and even non-Toyota) trucks makes the TLCA more appealing to me. When I first joined, I owned an FJ62. If I had been limited to that aspect of the TLCA, I would have never owned an FJ55 and met lots more great people as a result. Let's just be open minded and accepting.

TJK
 
There are 20,000+ members on FJCruiserForums.com and only ~300 of them are TLCA members at last count, that makes no sense to me.

I'm sorry, but this is where I probably disagree with most. I don't want 20,000 FJC members in the TLCA. There are only 4000 members now, that would severly change the make up of the TLCA (where will we get 20,000 40 series members?). Right now I like the FJ cruiser guys and gals in the TLCA and I enjoy the fact that they will argue with many of us telling us the FJ Cruiser is really a LandCruiser, because they want to belong and be part of the LandCruiser thing (Same goes with the mini trucks, they are around cause they want to be, there are millions of minis around too). I could go on for days typing, but I feel that if you don't under stand the Land Cruiser thing, you don't need to be part of the TLCA. Like Kowboy says, it doesn't matter what you drive, anyone can have it, but the Land Cruiser bond goes deeper then a car club and if you don't understand it, there is no need for you to be around. I agree with Romer that inclusive is good, but I don't want to go around begging people to be my buddy just to get extra members. Now before anyone starts blasting me for being a hater, I refer to members we don't need like a guy on the FJ cruiser form that is on there to see how he can beef up his stereo system, or the commuter that lost his users manual for the cigerete lighter......hope you get my point.
Cheers,
Deny
 
I dont think he ment for all 20000 to join, but it would be good to tap into more of that crowd. I dont believe that 4000 is the total number of land cruiser owners in north amercia so we dont have all of these owners in TLCA. I also know there are many Landcruiser owners that can be described in the same way you stated on owner manuals and radios. I would go so far as to say that a far higher percent of FJC are willing to take there truck out and wheel it than owners who have purchased a new 100 or 200 owner in the last three years. I would say that in the events that I have gone to there are 10 to 1 fjc's to modern 100 series cruisers. Is it ok to seek out soccer moms with 100's over FJC owners who want to go and be active in this organization.
 
You may not consider the FJC a land cruiser but Toyota's concept for this truck was a reincarnation of the FJ 40 including the signature white top.
 
It's about the people, not the specific trucks. If like minded people who happen to own an FJ Cruiser (or other non-Land Cruiser Toyota 4WD with a transfer case) want to join the TLCA and participate, I don't see the downside to that.

TJK
 
It's not about the trucks, it's about the people.

<Rant>

While I understand the argument in regards to adding too many FJC/Mini/4Runner/Tacoma members to the FJC, I have to disagree with it. We as an organization are at a crossroads, membership is way down. What do we do? This is what the TLCA BOD is trying to figure out for the members. We can only do so much, it seems no matter what is done, someone is unhappy with the decision. Just like in any organization when decisions are made, most are made with the majority in mind. That is what the TLCA BOD is trying to do as well. I ask everyone to please be patient, there is a LOT going on with the TLCA BOD right now, and many new things in the works. Everyone on the TLCA BOD that takes the time once a month to hop on a call, respond to a thread on the mailing list, here on the forums, etc. does so unselfishly.

I challenge anyone that isn't happy with the direction of the TLCA, to speak up and join one of the committees that have formed or suggest your ideas like Romer and Kowboy and others have.

<Rant />

That being said, as a member of the TLCA, I understand some of y'alls frustration, I've experienced it myself. All I can suggest is to hang in there, we are moving forward with everyone in mind.

-Art
 
Deny' point is very spot on for me too. What I took away was... you have to want to belong, regardless of what you drive. His point about a million mini trucks out there is a prime example.

I also agree with Arts post in general. Some one will always be unhappy.

However, membership is not way down. It is running about average although down from the recent high of 4000.
 
Good discssuion

I just want to be clear that my thoughts weren't about growing to be a huge club like the BMW. It was more about servicing the existing participating members so they have more fun and get more out of it, then they will want to be more engaged as they will value the TLCA more. Growth will be a byproduct when others see how much fun we are having. That's just what is working for our club.

We had a lively discssuion last night at our club meeting when the subject of potentially doing away with the hard copy TT and going the electronic route (Just a discussion, not the current TLCA plan). The TLCA rep at the club asked what the club would do if the hard coppy TT was eliminated, and the majority said they would quit the TLCA because thats all the TLCA provides, at least thats what they see. These are participating members who wheel multiple events each year and put on two TLCA events. What they see is we pay dues, don't know whats done with the dues, we get a great magazine 4 times a year and then have to provide 10% of our event profits back to the TLCA instead of donating them to land use organizations. A club needs to provide value for its reason for being, right now that value is percieved by many as just TT. Thats what we need to work on.

One thing we are starting to do is meet up with other nearby clubs for runs and going out of state to a different TLCA event each year as a club.
 
TLCA needs BOTH. However, it's the Chapters that create the content for the magazine that serves the Individuals. So, as I see it, if TLCA focuses on growing and supporting the Chapters, the overall growth will take care of itself.

Clubs like White Trash and Rising Sun are certainly great clubs to aspire to and there are other examples around the country. But, when you consider that the Denver metro area has more people than the entire state of New Mexico, you should quickly understand our limitations. We have a great club with great people, and that extends beyond the vehicles we drive. I think that happens anytime you get like minded people together. We have even managed to grow a bit ourselves and we really don't do any promotion. Folks just somehow manage to find us, and lately it's been through MUD (I found the club through TT!).

We have been historically accused of being a club that isn't, and the comment was not meant as a compliment. We don't do the Robert's Rules thing, our meetings are extremely informal, and families (read children and wifes) are encouraged to attend meetings and outings. Budget? What budget? Our meetings rotate around member's homes and are usually preceeded by tire kicking in the street. Our goal is to have fun. Would we like more participation at times? Yep. But it doesn't matter if there are 3 of us, or 15 on a trail ride, we are going to have a good time with friends. I think I'm :deadhorse:.

But, Phil's comment bothers me. TLCA should not be growing clubs, clubs should grow themselves with TLCA in a supporting role. It's the clubs that should assume responsibility for their membership, not TLCA.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top Bottom