2013 Toyota Land Cruiser 5.7L V8 93,500 miles. Serviced religiously at Toyota Dealership and every service interval and all recommended maintenance has been done for the past decade. I recently noticed the beginning of the engine oil seep (or leak) in the timing cover. Smelled oil burning on the exhaust, and a light tick noise on the drivers side of engine (with cold starts for 30 seconds or so). The Toyota Tech verified I am dealing with the infamous Cam Tower Leaks, Timing Cover Leak, Valley Plate Coolant Leak, and Chain Tensioner issue. The Toyota Dealership only recommended some repairs including resealing the valley plate with new sealant, replacing a bunch of gaskets, 2 chain tensioners, and cam tower seals. But curious how far people go with replacing parts at this point... the dealership basically did not recommend replacing the chain, 2 of the lower chain tensioners (only the top 2, heat exchange, valley plate, water pump, or the thermostat. I suppose there has to be a stopping point with this project but just wanted to knock out the common issues while the engine is open and we have access to replace parts. Or is this a lemon I am dealing with and just need to trade in. Thank you
5.7L V8 Cam Tower Leaks, Timing Cover Leaks, Valley Plate Coolant Leak (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter ElkRig
- Start date
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Car care nut literally just made a video about every single one of your issues. The tundra's owner is the top comment, said it was $5200 to have it sorted.
Elkrig, thanks for sharing and too bad to hear about these issues. I kind of hoped this was more so for US made 5.7ltr V8's (3UR-FE) and vehicles like the Tundra and Sequoia than Japan made Land Cruisers. So does not seem to be the case, although I hope it is less common... Whether this is lemon or Toyota should fix outside warranty I do not know. Lemon for a vehicle which is 2013 and 98k miles seems unlikely, making Toyota to step in is worth trying.
Regarding your issues, the Care Care Nut (AMD, ex Toyota Master Technician which seems to genuinely give good advise) actually did a repair on these issues on a 2016 Tundra and posted a video on this recently. While lengthy, he makes some statements on parts to replace or not.
Categorizing in must do and good to do, without being the expert, just summarizing what he is saying from memory and adding my interpretation so take it with a grain of salt:
- Valley coolant leak; seems must do or it just gets worse and leads to cooling issues. He indicates seal area on valley coolant chamber is not wide enough and becomes an issue at some point on the 3UR-FE. May have to do with proper cleanliness of the seal area during original manufacture assembly. I had hoped in Japan they do it perfect... Overall does not seem you can do much about prevention, it just happens
- Cam tower leak; depending on how bad a must or good to do. He suggest wiping the area and monitoring the leak rate is a step to consider. If it is worse which is maybe your case then have it fixed
- Timing cover leak; probably the same as cam tower leak, must or good to do
- Replacing Timing Chain Tensioners; Do not know if they get bad on 2013 Japan made 3UR-FE's. They certainly are an issue on the 16 Tundra he is working on. Seems good to do as you are in there
- Chains and chain guides; Should be fine if the chain tensioners are not bad yet and there is no noise from the same
- Water pump and thermostat; Good to do as you do all these repairs. Items known to go out.
All in all once you are in there it is worth considering doing the whole lot. Getting genuine Toyota parts and latest version of the same seems valuable. By doing so you should be good for another 100k miles +
In case you are looking for long term ownership it is worth considering switching from 0W20 to 5W30. Also doing it every 5000 miles as it apparently keeps things cleaner and running better. I can see Chain Tensioners working better over the long haul.
Maybe AMD in Chicago is an alternative option from a South Dakota Toyota dealer. All depends on delta cost (assume AMD is competitive) and how much effort you want to put in (travel to AMD shop and back). Looks like the Tundra repair was around $5.5k, so it adds up.
Keep us posted what you do and possible by whom and how much.
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Removed youtube link, see above from Texas Meatball...
Regarding your issues, the Care Care Nut (AMD, ex Toyota Master Technician which seems to genuinely give good advise) actually did a repair on these issues on a 2016 Tundra and posted a video on this recently. While lengthy, he makes some statements on parts to replace or not.
Categorizing in must do and good to do, without being the expert, just summarizing what he is saying from memory and adding my interpretation so take it with a grain of salt:
- Valley coolant leak; seems must do or it just gets worse and leads to cooling issues. He indicates seal area on valley coolant chamber is not wide enough and becomes an issue at some point on the 3UR-FE. May have to do with proper cleanliness of the seal area during original manufacture assembly. I had hoped in Japan they do it perfect... Overall does not seem you can do much about prevention, it just happens
- Cam tower leak; depending on how bad a must or good to do. He suggest wiping the area and monitoring the leak rate is a step to consider. If it is worse which is maybe your case then have it fixed
- Timing cover leak; probably the same as cam tower leak, must or good to do
- Replacing Timing Chain Tensioners; Do not know if they get bad on 2013 Japan made 3UR-FE's. They certainly are an issue on the 16 Tundra he is working on. Seems good to do as you are in there
- Chains and chain guides; Should be fine if the chain tensioners are not bad yet and there is no noise from the same
- Water pump and thermostat; Good to do as you do all these repairs. Items known to go out.
All in all once you are in there it is worth considering doing the whole lot. Getting genuine Toyota parts and latest version of the same seems valuable. By doing so you should be good for another 100k miles +
In case you are looking for long term ownership it is worth considering switching from 0W20 to 5W30. Also doing it every 5000 miles as it apparently keeps things cleaner and running better. I can see Chain Tensioners working better over the long haul.
Maybe AMD in Chicago is an alternative option from a South Dakota Toyota dealer. All depends on delta cost (assume AMD is competitive) and how much effort you want to put in (travel to AMD shop and back). Looks like the Tundra repair was around $5.5k, so it adds up.
Keep us posted what you do and possible by whom and how much.
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Removed youtube link, see above from Texas Meatball...
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- Thread starter
- #4
Thanks for your input. I did watch the recent Car Care Nut video before posting this. I also watched AMD's video about the LX vs the Land Cruiser awhile back and he calls out the Cam Tower Leak in that video as a possible issue, that is what brought this to my attention.
I wanted to get details more specific to the 200 series and see if anyone else has dealt with this and what their parts list included. My Dealership did not recommend water pump, thermostat, PCV value, Heat Exchanger, or replacing the valley plate as AMD did, so wanted to get some more opinions on the matter. Hopefully the LC has some better parts but I really don't know. I did ask that the water pump, thermostat be replaced as well. I think I caught it early enough that the time chain and the lower chain tensioners are ok. There is a long list of gaskets and seals to be replaced and I know the Toyota Dealership does this job quite often. Toyota quoted about $3500 which included around 17 hrs of labor. Plus I had them add on the water pump and thermostat, so probably another couple hundred dollars.
Literally says no damage found.
Valley plate was $1400.
I was quoted $3k on the timing cover and have just ignored it as it just seeps a little, not even noticeable on the dipstick after 6k miles. If I did the cover I’d do tensioners and anything easy to access because most of the cost is labor to get in there.
I can’t speak to the cam tower leak cost.
I do think the 3URs seem to have various leaks or seeps over time and you should just accept them if they’re not bad unless it becomes a problem. The valley plate for instance won’t get better but I think mine had a slow leak for a while… maybe 20k even… before I had to add coolant. I think my timing chain cover has been seeping at least slightly for 75k. When you are adding oil, coolant, power steering fluid, etc between oil changes then it’s time to address it.
Other than that I think you just have to weigh labor vs materials as to what to replace. I’m at 150k with no water pump issue but if I had to have it removed to fix the timing cover I’d replace it. But if I was at 75k I wouldn’t have bothered. You can go PM crazy if you let yourself.
I was quoted $3k on the timing cover and have just ignored it as it just seeps a little, not even noticeable on the dipstick after 6k miles. If I did the cover I’d do tensioners and anything easy to access because most of the cost is labor to get in there.
I can’t speak to the cam tower leak cost.
I do think the 3URs seem to have various leaks or seeps over time and you should just accept them if they’re not bad unless it becomes a problem. The valley plate for instance won’t get better but I think mine had a slow leak for a while… maybe 20k even… before I had to add coolant. I think my timing chain cover has been seeping at least slightly for 75k. When you are adding oil, coolant, power steering fluid, etc between oil changes then it’s time to address it.
Other than that I think you just have to weigh labor vs materials as to what to replace. I’m at 150k with no water pump issue but if I had to have it removed to fix the timing cover I’d replace it. But if I was at 75k I wouldn’t have bothered. You can go PM crazy if you let yourself.
What we are seeing usually are coming from vehicles that have overheated at some point. Usually from a failed radiator. Every valley plate we have done we have done a radiator as well. But we have seen very few valley plate leaks. We have replaced dozens and dozens of 200/570 radiators. Starting to see heater tees starting to degraded on the 08-10 models. We will start suggesting they be done when we do coolant changes. 570 by far have the worst design. You can't even see the radiator due to the covers. But the covers ARE needed to keep air going where it should.
32cls6speedmt
SILVER Star
@Trollhole timely post since part sale is almost over. I have a 13 with 160k miles. Do you recommend replacing the inlet 87209-60c01 and outlet 87209-60c12 with heater tee 87248-08030. I think hoses come with clamps.
Just wanted to add that I also have the timing chain cover "seep" at 142k miles. I was told by one Toyota dealerships and my go-to independent mechanic that it wasn't anything to worry about: An inspection at another Toyota dealership in between did not even bring it up on their report. I can confirm that my oil levels are always consistent, and I tow 6,000 lbs. semi-regularly. It's been nearly 10k miles since I became aware of the seep, and I have no plans on "fixing" it until I see/smell a larger issue.
from someone interested in the 200 series platform. are the fixes for these leaks a permanent fix or will they always be at risk for it leaking again? This is not giving me confidence of reliability coming from j100. i really dont mind the timing belt job and it seems a lot cheaper of a maintenance item.
The valley plate should be permanent. I mean as permanent as gaskets can be I suppose. But it’s a different material now so the original leak issue should in theory be resokved
I assume the timing chain cover leak would happen again in time.
bloc
SILVER Star
I don’t. It could be an issue with how Toyota applied the sealant.. in fact I lean this way because everyone seems to get the leak at the same place. If it’s faulty RTV I’d expect leaks on the other side more often.
On low mileage the timing chain cover leak is usually caused by sealant not applied correctly from the factory. On high mileage it get stiff and does not flex when the engine expands and contracts with heat. As far as parts are concerned, I have never seen a stretched chain or failed gear on a 5.7 in 10 years at a dealer. Tensioners are another story. The right bank is usually ok, but the left bank fails.
290K miles. 08. 1 owner, dealer serviced:
Valley Plate done at 97K miles.
Valley Plate done again at 186k miles. No issues since.
Radiator, Alternator, water pump, steering rack all fluids done at 180k
190k - radiator, alternator, water pump, all fluids. All fluids being changed at 40K intervals since.
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I am second owner. I do all my own fluids, and keep up on maintannce. Has cam tower leak. Nothing on ground. Spotless driveway. But I can smell it after a drive, on and off when oil hits the exhaust shields. Live with it, check oil regularly, hardly any need to add. I imagine it will keep going like this till 400K miles.
I really wish AMD or @Trollhole was close to me. So Cal Cam Tower leak really 200 series specialists are far between.
Valley Plate done at 97K miles.
Valley Plate done again at 186k miles. No issues since.
Radiator, Alternator, water pump, steering rack all fluids done at 180k
190k - radiator, alternator, water pump, all fluids. All fluids being changed at 40K intervals since.
---------
I am second owner. I do all my own fluids, and keep up on maintannce. Has cam tower leak. Nothing on ground. Spotless driveway. But I can smell it after a drive, on and off when oil hits the exhaust shields. Live with it, check oil regularly, hardly any need to add. I imagine it will keep going like this till 400K miles.
I really wish AMD or @Trollhole was close to me. So Cal Cam Tower leak really 200 series specialists are far between.
bloc
SILVER Star
In your experience what is the failure mode of the tensioner? The ratchet mechanism or clogging of the piston?
Honestly I'm not sure.
Why?
Regarding chain and chain tensioner noise and eventually issues, my opinion is that timely oil changes (to keep the tensioner actuator clean) and 5W30 (or 0W30) vs 0W20 is the way to go (to increase oil pressure on the tensioner actuator). I am saying this as the 3UR-FE was designed in the late nineties/early two thousands with 5W30 as the factory supplied oil (with W30 viscosity at regular operating condition of an engine, whether in the South or North). In the Middle East & Africa it stayed like that much longer. Toyota in the US went along as the EPA and our friendly politicians behind it pushed for it. IMO not good for long term reliability, nor the environment as vehicles would be written off sooner and would need to be recycled at sizeable CO2 foot print. Definitely not good for your own pocket.
forum.ih8mud.com
3UR-FE timing chain tensioner and oil viscosity
Another Interesting Car Care Nut video, in this case on the US build Tundra 3UR-FE and issue with timing chain tensioner. Wondering whether 0W20 pushed by the EPA is resulting in less oil pressure and possible issue with these tensioners not exerting enough force. Seems the rotor type oil pump...
forum.ih8mud.com
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Thank you very much for sharing this information with us.
