1HZ non-Turbo and Turbo EGT's differences (1 Viewer)

[daxwert]

Hi.
I wanted to ask/confirm something prior to turboing my 1HZ.
There are alot of post regarding the max EGT's for 1Hz runnign a turbo.
I want to know if the EGT;s i'm getting with a turbo will change immediately after fitting a turbo or only after adding fuel. I would assume that whatever i'm getting now is ok for later when its turboed.

I have been running a Pyro for the last 3 weeks on my non turbo fitted to the opening on the manifold where the EGR was located. Yes, its a later model 1HZ with EGR.
I deleted he EGR and the temps 'm getting on a recently rebuild engine are quite high already (700deg C). I know this should be still fine now since i'm directly at the exhaust port.

 

[Gun Runner 5]

I personally wouldn’t consider adding a turbo to a 1HZ without also adding an Intercooler.

 

[daxwert]

I personally wouldn’t consider adding a turbo to a 1HZ without also adding an Intercooler.

I do have an intercooler planned. Its will have to be an underbonnet unit coz it I couldnt find anything fitting behind grill. The aircon lines take up too much space.

 

[Willis]

Your EGT will immediately spike compared to non-turbo.

A turbo recycles exhaust heat back into the intake, gets hot quick.

Intercooler will be best, but you can also dial the fuel and air in and keep it manageable. Higher RPM means more air which means lower EGT.
I ran no intercooler for 5 years but just broke down and did an intercooler.

 

[daxwert]

Your EGT will immediately spike compared to non-turbo.

A turbo recycles exhaust heat back into the intake, gets hot quick.

Intercooler will be best, but you can also dial the fuel and air in and keep it manageable. Higher RPM means more air which means lower EGT.
I ran no intercooler for 5 years but just broke down and did an intercooler.

Thank you.

 

[daxwert]

Just waiting for my V8 bonnet. from a car thats being stripped because I dont wanna do the cuts. Hopefully in two weeks turbo should be in .

 

[coldtaco]

I do have an intercooler planned. Its will have to be an underbonnet unit coz it I couldnt find anything fitting behind grill. The aircon lines take up too much space.

PDI makes a front mount intercooler for the HZ with AC relocation kit

 

[bj70bc]

Your EGT will immediately spike compared to non-turbo.

A turbo recycles exhaust heat back into the intake, gets hot quick.

Intercooler will be best, but you can also dial the fuel and air in and keep it manageable. Higher RPM means more air which means lower EGT.
I ran no intercooler for 5 years but just broke down and did an intercooler.

I realize this may be ,ultimately, semantics but....
the turbo does not recycle exhaust heat into the intake, the two 'air' steams do not exchange heat directly, and really very little.
the incoming fresh air heats up mostly because of being compressed, and at 12 or so psi the heat from compression is high enough that an intercooler will help take this compression heat out from the air (and thereby increase air density)....
at 12-15 psi you will be somewhere around 180-240f....
In actuality as soon as you turbo it (and havent yet touched the fuel) it will run COOLER from the increased air in the cylinder measured on egt's...
Now you can turn the fuel up ( and increase the heat from fuel load ), to make more power and run somewhere close to what the egt's were before turbo-ing
This was my experience from turbo-ing my diesel, they run hotter N/A, until you up the fuel...

 

[Rigster]

I can speak volumes on this.

More fuel will definitely add heat, especially when the air is compressed.

You will have a good idea of EGT's with the NA 1HZ since you added the guage, but typically it is around 1200F. You want to make sure when tuning that you do not go over this. I have found with the front mount PDI intercooler, this is easy to tune and keep the EGT's under control.

However even then, if you maintain long sustained pulls at even 1100F, your engine will then start heating up on really hot days, or when I pull a trailer in the summer through the mountains.

So your idea of an intercooler solution under the bonnet might not be a bad idea as it would keep the airway clear to the radiator.

Much to think about. Check my build thread for more details....

 

[daxwert]

Thanks for those replies. It makes sense in the the physics sense.
Which makes me wonder about my relatively high temps now.
My sensor is installes like in the attched picture. As mentioned. my temps routinely go above 700 deg Celsius (1300 F).
I had the Head off recently for rebuilding valves and piston rings( no problems detected).

Can this be ? I checked the sensor today to make sure its reading correctly.

 

[bj70bc]

N/A will read high as it really needs more air to burn more efficiently and cooler.
3b's will read this high or higher as well.
Its one of the reasons a turbo is a good thing if properly installed and tuned

 

[Combat Wombat]

I can also mention that a free flowing dump pipe and exhaust can assist in removing the additional heat too.
In past projects, I have seen a 150 C temp reduction at cruise just from a 3" dump pipe.
In a few cases here in Australia, tuners will install a pre-turbo EGT probe, and also one after turbo.
There are some EGT gauges that have the provision for 2x readings.
Warning though: a cheap or incorrectly exposed pre-turbo probe (in the manifold) can fail and also make a bit of a mess in the turbo exhaust wheel!
This application on a 1HZ may be a bit over the top, as you will likely be tuning for maximum torque instead of limiter bashing mud bogging.

If you want to go fully mad scientist, look into drive pressure. Basically a way of monitoring exhaust manifold pressure.
Ultimately the turbo selection, matched with a correct intercooler and piping diameter will all assist in healthy EGTs
Dont forget to have a air/fuel ratio check on a dyno once its all zipped up. Adjusting the fuel screw for optimum running will save your pistons!

 

[JDM Journeys]

Some good info here already so I'll just ask a couple of more questions. What altitude are you currently sitting at for your day to day drive? When were your injectors replaced or reconditioned? Has your fuel screw been turned at all?

I live at 1100 m and routinely go above that. On my n/a 1hz I was fighting EGT's and smoke even after I put in new injectors and had the pump rebuilt until I really dialed in the timing and the fuel. My timing now is at 1.06, which is in the middle of the spec. My fuel is turned down so the max I ever see is 1200 Fahrenheit pushing up a hill but that's only if I don't downshift to 4th. Almost zero smoke under any circumstances.

Yes, I'm running on the lean side but lean is safe... esp when there's less atmo air. I've been sitting on a turbo setup on my bench for over a year but won't put it in until I'm positive I've got some room to breathe so to speak.

If you're comfortable doing it yourself, make tiny adjustments to fuel and you'll be surprised how dialled you can get it. But start with valves/ pump timing in spec.

 

[bj70bc]

I can also mention that a free flowing dump pipe and exhaust can assist in removing the additional heat too.
In past projects, I have seen a 150 C temp reduction at cruise just from a 3" dump pipe.

Is this difference compared to a stock 2" pipe or a 2.5"
Just wondering how much benefit from 2.5" dump to 3" a guy might get....

 

[bj70bc]

And also retarded timing can contribute to the egt reading higher as more heat/burn gets pushed into the exhaust
advanced timing will read the opposite, but as far as engine total heat load i dint think it really changes as the injection volume is still the same.
It just affects the cylinder pressures, retarded timing is easier on the moving mechanical things

 

[roma042987]

Your EGT will immediately spike compared to non-turbo.

A turbo recycles exhaust heat back into the intake, gets hot quick.

This is just blatantly wrong.

 

[bj70bc]

yes

 

[daxwert]

Some good info here already so I'll just ask a couple of more questions. What altitude are you currently sitting at for your day to day drive? When were your injectors replaced or reconditioned? Has your fuel screw been turned at all?

Altitude is mostly around 1600m
Fuel has never been turned. In-fact, I only removed the fuel screw cover after the original post.
Injectors are brand new about 5days ago now and yes, it has brought down the max EGT's by about 80 deg C. So i guess there was some injector leakage.

Am busy making my flange now and hope to do the install this coming week.

I live at 1100 m and routinely go above that. On my n/a 1hz I was fighting EGT's and smoke even after I put in new injectors and had the pump rebuilt until I really dialed in the timing and the fuel. My timing now is at 1.06, which is in the middle of the spec. My fuel is turned down so the max I ever see is 1200 Fahrenheit pushing up a hill but that's only if I don't downshift to 4th. Almost zero smoke under any circumstances.

Yes, I'm running on the lean side but lean is safe... esp when there's less atmo air. I've been sitting on a turbo setup on my bench for over a year but won't put it in until I'm positive I've got some room to breathe so to speak.

If you're comfortable doing it yourself, make tiny adjustments to fuel and you'll be surprised how dialled you can get it. But start with valves/ pump timing in spec.

 

[daxwert]

Ok. I have finalized the installation two days ago. apart from some minor issues like boost&exhaust leaks (sorted) everything went well.
Car feels so much better. currently boosting 8.5 psi and yes, the EGT's are generally lower. No Fuel added yet. Just happy to hear tyres chirping.
I will be going on holiday now but when I return form Europe i will be taking it for a tune and dyno. really looking forward to it now.
Also ordered a new core for my turbo coz it was used and history on it was not very clear. Then Its time to do all the inter-cooler bits...
/Best thing to do with a 1HZ/