- Thread starter
- #81
Don't think I'd keep the sway's off if I had a typical tricked-out 80. Too top heavy. Without all the added weight of those accessories the lean is actually pretty mild.
Why can't an 80 flex like..... (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ShottsUZJ100
- Start date
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I had a vision last night, sorry if this is allready in effect. But i was thinking that if you took the control arms that slee sells for his 6 inch lift and installed an adjustable joint (the kind for the adjustable panhard rods, you know the kind that screw in) on the control arm. THis would do two things; 1. Allow for lenghtening or shortening of the control arm if needed for caster, and 2. allow for central pivot of the arm during flexing. It would still be super strong, but as the axle articulated and the control arms start to bind on the bushings, the joint would simply pivot or screw a little and allow full flex of the axle without binding on the bushings.
alia176
SILVER Star
AMMO said:
What kind of a vehicle was helping you out?
- Thread starter
- #85
AZcruiser said:
ABSOLUTELY! I wouldn't miss that for anything! We'll do the 4.0 obstacle, the crazy hill then exit the wash again. Can't wait! Pics from last time are here:
http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/default.aspx?f=10&p=2&m=14250
COME ON OUT!
alia176 said:
A brave/stupid one.
- Thread starter
- #87
reffug said:A brave/stupid one.
Probably a 100? ;p
ShottsUZJ100 said:
u said it not me.....
and unless it was u there probably arn't any other 100 owners that are that brave/stupid....
alia176 said:
I kinda HATE to say it... A Montero... GenII wagon. I out weighed him allot, but I really just needed an anchor to keep that passenger side down. Then I could turn back up hill and go. This is a hill I’ve climbed before, just with all the storms and rain/snow it made it slick. I didn't lock, I didn't air down, I wasn't thinking... It was like someone threw sand on concrete, wheels just spun, and got me sideways.
-Ammo
AMMO said:
Bet there was a small amount of pucker factor involved.
reffug said:Bet there was a small amount of pucker factor involved.
BIG TIME.
John,
I would leave the 80 alone after removing the swaybar. Longer shocks in custom mounts will allow for greater extension travel, but you will need to address bushing restriction before any appreciable gains in crossed axle articulation will be made. Your 80 works awesome as is. By making major changes to the stock systems you are introducing too many variables to long term reliability and serviceability (IMO). I would suggest leaving the extreme fabrication to those who can also service those modifications on the trail.
Without major modifications your 80 will never have the flexibility of the quadra coil Jeep suspensions. Stock to Stock, the Jeep suspension allows much greater flex by design. Anyone that tells you that an 80 with the swaybar disconnected using stock suspension components will flex as much as a stock coiled Jeep is delusional. I fear that many on this board view reality through TLC colored glasses...
The reasons to own a Cruiser is not have greater capability than a Jeep Wrangler (which it does not, unless it is a pure WB climb), but to own a vehicle with superior durability and reliability. I drive a Jeep on the difficult trails because that is the BEST solution for that terrain (so is an FJ40, defender, etc.), which is the same reason why I drive a TOYOTA thousands of miles into Mexico, because that is what a Tacoma/80/100 is best at. I am often amazed at how hard people work to try an fit a square peg in a round hole. I guess chock it up being brand centered, even if it takes 3 times the effort and expense to come to the same result.
Everyone here knows how a match-up between a STOCK 80 and a STOCK Rubicon would fair...
I am sure I will receive some interesting responses to my comments. Hopefully they will be more empirical than emotional (as seems to be the trend...)
I would leave the 80 alone after removing the swaybar. Longer shocks in custom mounts will allow for greater extension travel, but you will need to address bushing restriction before any appreciable gains in crossed axle articulation will be made. Your 80 works awesome as is. By making major changes to the stock systems you are introducing too many variables to long term reliability and serviceability (IMO). I would suggest leaving the extreme fabrication to those who can also service those modifications on the trail.
Without major modifications your 80 will never have the flexibility of the quadra coil Jeep suspensions. Stock to Stock, the Jeep suspension allows much greater flex by design. Anyone that tells you that an 80 with the swaybar disconnected using stock suspension components will flex as much as a stock coiled Jeep is delusional. I fear that many on this board view reality through TLC colored glasses...
The reasons to own a Cruiser is not have greater capability than a Jeep Wrangler (which it does not, unless it is a pure WB climb), but to own a vehicle with superior durability and reliability. I drive a Jeep on the difficult trails because that is the BEST solution for that terrain (so is an FJ40, defender, etc.), which is the same reason why I drive a TOYOTA thousands of miles into Mexico, because that is what a Tacoma/80/100 is best at. I am often amazed at how hard people work to try an fit a square peg in a round hole. I guess chock it up being brand centered, even if it takes 3 times the effort and expense to come to the same result.
Everyone here knows how a match-up between a STOCK 80 and a STOCK Rubicon would fair...
I am sure I will receive some interesting responses to my comments. Hopefully they will be more empirical than emotional (as seems to be the trend...)
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R
robbie
Guest
What trails are you signed up for John? Just wondering so we might suggest the Far superior 100 series over the 80 in Moab. Remember you are the one that said the 100 could go the trails you have sign up for. later robbie
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
concretejungle said:
We used to make the arms with just such a joint. It allowed for reduced stress on the arms during flex, however it can not be used to change caster. Also, the joints were very difficult to machine. Needed very close tollerances as to not have slop in the arm. Then after you machined it the tube had to be bent. This could cause the threaded end to slightly deform and then you are hosed and start over again.
In the end, cost won over advantages. However if you 3 link the front and deal with straight arms, then it is quite doable.
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
expeditionswest said:
Not true, with longer shocks and the rear of the suspension stock, I got about double the articulation with the shortbus vs a stock 80. Sheetmetal got in the way a little
with
expeditionswest said:
Fully agree with this.
Not sure on this one. Would be interesting though.
sleeoffroad said:Not true, with longer shocks and the rear of the suspension stock, I got about double the articulation with the shortbus vs a stock 80. Sheetmetal got in the way a little
Slee,
Good point. I should have been more specific. I was refering to the front suspension only. I think the rear of the 80 has good flex, even in stock form.
Christo what is the Shortbus's RTI? Just curious. Figure its gotta be damn close to a perfect score.
Who cares? It’s not about flexibility, it’s about completing the task.expeditionswest said:
½ right there crackboy. … continued on nextexpeditionswest said:
Yes, it is more expensive to wheel an 80 that a jeep. Not sure though in the long run if it’s more expensive after the tough run. You’ll spend a lot of cash fixing your broken bits as we air up and cruiser home. It’s also not only climbs but offcamber situations etc. It depends on the trail. I’ve been up plenty of trails where 40s could not go and they have been up trails where I can’t go.expeditionswest said:
Yes, you are right. You would be sitting there trying to rebuild and holding up the line so the folks in the 80 would be bored out of their minds. Been there done that.expeditionswest said:
Actually it sounds as if your view of the world is more intuitive than empirical.expeditionswest said:
Personally, I have no issue if someone wheels a jeep; so long as they pick a trail that is suited for them. I have wheeled with plenty of them and my issues with the jeepers is not so much their vehicle of choice (hey, it’s not my problem they can’t afford something better), but rather their lack of groupness/teamwork and their tendency to run & gun versus encroaching an obstacle then strategically maneuvering to overcome it. In most cases they must think they are trying out to be the Jets punter and are more concerned about air time as they hit the skinny pedal, shout wahoo, and land to the sound of breaking bits.
Take this for whatever you want, but wheeling is not about flex.
sleeoffroad said:
Interesting, thanks christo. I find myself getting more and more involved in thinking about tweaking the suspension. Maybe one day when the 80 is a dedicated trail rig i may try out some of these ideas.
- Thread starter
- #100
expeditionswest said:
Noted and well said Scott. I started this thread just to see what the next step "up" would be. After hearing the responses I decided to simply remove my sways and be happy. Thet's where I'm at and I'm lovin it.
I can say that over the past few runs in the 80 and attempting some pretty wild stuff (like that left side at Chiva and the right side at Sibley) I am amazed at how closely I can "hang" with Brian's modified Rubi. Notice though I said "closely".
As far as stock 80 vs stock Rubi? That's an easy answer in my book. Despite the lesser ground clearance of a stock Rubi, the Rubi would eat it at most obstacles. I doubt many 80 owners would admit that though? It'd be like them admitting a stock 100 can hang with a stock 80 (which it can too except where it wouldn't fit).
