Why arent people 3 linking the rear of built 80’s? (1 Viewer)

[EWheeler]

Lots of “long travel” rear 3 link builds all over the net for the 4 runners and GX470, which appear to make them pretty well rounded for crawling travel and smoothing out the ride for higher speed washboard roads (mostly a function of upgrading to a better shock package). I’ve searched the 80 series section, and havent found anyone that has 3 linked the rear for upgrading for more travel. Ive seen what Nukegoat and JCardona have done with the rear of theirs, which is 4 link with wishbone upper. The fuel tank keeps from being able to do a properly triangulated rear 4 link. Im aware of how capable the 80 series is in nearly OEM form (Broski’s rig is the shining diamond here, but there are many other well documented highly capable wheeling 80’s here). Rear 3 link would be done in conjunction with front 3 link on hypothetical future 80 series.

Do they not exist because the juice isnt worth the squeeze?
Packaging issues make it not feasible?
Or few are willing to do the body trimming/sheet metal removal required to take advantage of more travel than what the factory setup will give with minimal effort?

 

[CharlieS]

Same reason we aren't buying jeeps?

 

[tmxmotorsports]

Lots of “long travel” rear 3 link builds all over the net for the 4 runners and GX470, which appear to make them pretty well rounded for crawling travel and smoothing out the ride for higher speed washboard roads (mostly a function of upgrading to a better shock package). I’ve searched the 80 series section, and havent found anyone that has 3 linked the rear for upgrading for more travel. Ive seen what Nukegoat and JCardona have done with the rear of theirs, which is 4 link with wishbone upper. The fuel tank keeps from being able to do a properly triangulated rear 4 link. Im aware of how capable the 80 series is in nearly OEM form (Broski’s rig is the shining diamond here, but there are many other well documented highly capable wheeling 80’s here). Rear 3 link would be done in conjunction with front 3 link on hypothetical future 80 series.

Do they not exist because the juice isnt worth the squeeze?
Packaging issues make it not feasible?
Or few are willing to do the body trimming/sheet metal removal required to take advantage of more travel than what the factory setup will give with minimal effort?

Maybe try the hardcore section. Most guys in the 80 section don't wheel their 80s hard enough for all that.

 

[EWheeler]

Same reason we aren't buying jeeps?

The rear design on an 80 series is basically a parallel 4 link with panhard to locate axle laterally....a 3 link essentially loses the drivers upper link and frees up the suspension for more travel. How does that relate to buying a jeep?

 

[EWheeler]

Maybe try the hardcore section. Most guys in the 80 section don't wheel their 80s hard enough for all that.

There are like 6 people that visit the hardcore section, 5 if I take my name off the list....

 

[AgentOrange]

I haven't because I'm not there yet. Making everything else work correctly. That may be a year or two away on my rig, but at that point, most of us move the fuel tank and go triangulated 4 link

 

[EWheeler]

but at that point, most of us move the fuel tank and go triangulated 4 link

It makes sense, but I haven't seen anyone do this....examples? I know the 24gal LRA behind the axle fuel tank would allow it, but I havent seen anyone actually ditch the factory tank to go with a single rear mounted tank. I'm sure someone has, I just haven't found an instance in my obsessive searching over the past couple weeks. Those LRA tanks are spendy...

 

[baldilocks]

 

[AgentOrange]

It makes sense, but I haven't seen anyone do this....examples? I know the 24gal LRA behind the axle fuel tank would allow it, but I havent seen anyone actually ditch the factory tank to go with a single rear mounted tank. I'm sure someone has, I just haven't found an instance in my obsessive searching over the past couple weeks. Those LRA tanks are spendy...

@nukegoat has had a couple variations I believe Double triangulated rear 80 - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/double-triangulated-rear-80.811185/
There's a guy up near me that has something different as well, but I don't know his name on Mud. His Instagram is oregon_trail_
The odd thing is as several of us go further down the rabbit hole, less and less gets posted. Not sure if there's any relation, but it happens.

 

[EWheeler]

@nukegoat has had a couple variations I believe Double triangulated rear 80 - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/double-triangulated-rear-80.811185/
There's a guy up near me that has something different as well, but I don't know his name on Mud. His Instagram is oregon_trail_
The odd thing is as several of us go further down the rabbit hole, less and less gets posted. Not sure if there's any relation, but it happens.

Thanks. I’ve read & saved everything he has posted in regards to his builds. That build has a wish one upper utilizing factory frame mounts so as to not have to screw with the fuel tank. There was also a member who did a double triangulated rear setup with rear facing links. Pretty out of the box thinking setup!

Less and less gets posted because people suck and want to sit behind their keyboard and criticize your efforts instead of thanking you for sharing your work. Ive read your build a few times, love the evolution of your 80! The rear body chop was an aggressive undertaking!

 

[ThreeEyedBandit]

I duplicated Nukegoats with some number changes for my lift and it works really well, much nicer than factory for my use. Yes, I'd like longer uppers, but don't and still don't have the motivation to deal with the fuel tank.

 

[EWheeler]

I duplicated Nukegoats with some number changes for my lift and it works really well, much nicer than factory for my use. Yes, I'd like longer uppers, but don't and still don't have the motivation to deal with the fuel tank.

I looked and looked for details on your setup after seeking photos of it in the Kanati tire thread….I ordered those same tires as you put on yours after seeing those pics. Bitchin truck. Can you share some photos of your rear setup?

After ditching the panhard, why not push the rear axle back to achieve your desired longer uppers?

 

[OGBeno]

Less and less gets posted because people suck and want to sit behind their keyboard and criticize your efforts instead of thanking you for sharing your work. Ive read your build a few times, love the evolution of your 80! The rear body chop was an aggressive undertaking!

I don’t think that’s really the case— at least in my opinion as a former 80 series nutjob and person who used to spend a lot of time driving my 80 on rocks:

The issue becomes that 30+ years in 80 series modifications in the US and a few things have become apparent:

1. The 80 series is decent rock crawler without having to do much to it: 33’s, sliders, and a rear locker and you can conquer 99% of the trails in the US.

2. The 80 series really has too many body panels and glass to become a great rock crawler without **serious** mods and then becoming a trailer queen. And I think for many people, the point of the 80 is to drive, wheel, brake things, fix, and drive it home (I did this a lot in my 80 series rock days in the 2000’s).

3. Modifying an 80 series to be a serious rock crawler is a significant amount of money/time/effort…. And you can just go out and buy a dedicated rock crawler.

4. At least here on MUD as a forum to share and discuss, these types of conversations happened 15-20 years ago. And a lot of those threads are buried and a lot of the folks who made the modifications you are talking about are no longer on MUD, have sold their 80, or have gotten older and don’t care about 3-linking a 3 ton brick.

A deep search of MUD will give you a lot of the answers you want to 3-linking the rear of an 80 series. Searching on GOOGLE and then delimiting MUD as your source, you will get days of reading from the 2003-2010 time period.

 

[EWheeler]

I don’t think that’s really the case— at least in my opinion as a former 80 series nutjob and person who used to spend a lot of time driving my 80 on rocks:

The issue becomes that 30+ years in 80 series modifications in the US and a few things have become apparent:

1. The 80 series is decent rock crawler without having to do much to it: 33’s, sliders, and a rear locker and you can conquer 99% of the trails in the US.

2. The 80 series really has too many body panels and glass to become a great rock crawler without **serious** mods and then becoming a trailer queen. And I think for many people, the point of the 80 is to drive, wheel, brake things, fix, and drive it home (I did this a lot in my 80 series rock days in the 2000’s).

3. Modifying an 80 series to be a serious rock crawler is a significant amount of money/time/effort…. And you can just go out and buy a dedicated rock crawler.

4. At least here on MUD as a forum to share and discuss, these types of conversations happened 15-20 years ago. And a lot of those threads are buried and a lot of the folks who made the modifications you are talking about are no longer on MUD, have sold their 80, or have gotten older and don’t care about 3-linking a 3 ton brick.

A deep search of MUD will give you a lot of the answers you want to 3-linking the rear of an 80 series. Searching on GOOGLE and then delimiting MUD as your source, you will get days of reading from the 2003-2010 time period.

I use the search function on MUD alot, wasn't aware of the google search method. Will spend some time doing that.

Appreciate the response.

I get the “at some point you just build a buggy or dedicated crawler” standpoint. Ive got a crawler, but that that doesnt keep me from thinking that an 80 series can be more capable.

CaliFab on instagram has some good video of a GX470 with his rear 3 link kit boogying through some whoops at a very impressive click. Why can’t an 80 series do that? (assuming the front suspension is setup to appropriately), the rear suspension designs are very similar between the 80/100/4runner/GX.



Do i want to go rally Baja in an 80 series? Maybe? I have a baja prerunner to do that with, but its RWD and while it would be much faster and more comfortable on the bumpy stuff, a capable 80 series would be much more useful….

 

[ThreeEyedBandit]

Here is the the thread @AgentOrange was talking about, good read for sure!

RHD JDM mall crawler

Alright I decided it’s probably worth documenting my build here. I have documented it a lot through instagram that can be hard to follow. It’s a 1996 Land Cruiser that is a RHD diesel with a Toyota 1HD-FT I6 engine. Bought it in April 2022 bone stock and even better it’s a JDM import little...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[ThreeEyedBandit]

I looked and looked for details on your setup after seeking photos of it in the Kanati tire thread….I ordered those same tires as you put on yours after seeing those pics. Bitchin truck. Can you share some photos of your rear setup?

After ditching the panhard, why not push the rear axle back to achieve your desired longer uppers?

I don't have a build thread going, basically it'd be a bunch of random photos that I upload and update every two years...

Someday I might, but at the time I didn't have the time to rework the rear body. Was planning in doing a ute chop with a flat bed, but every winter realize how nice it is to sleep inside the back . But I did tell my self it will happen when I blow out the third hatch window, which I am currently on..

Here are a couple of my rear.

 

[mudgudgeon]

The 80 rear end is not really comparable to 4runner, at least, not early generations. 4 runner have much shorter rear links than an 80. This along with other differences limits articulation and travel much more than stock 80 rear links

80s have longer rear links than many other production 4x4, so the rear actually works pretty well.

In Australia, guys fit longer lower links to Nissan Patrols (very similar to 80s), but very rare for anyone to do it to an 80. This makes the Patrol rear end more equal to the 80s.

I think Rampt customs??? in Aus has kits for longer rear links. upper and lower links for 80s I believe. ( might be wrong on the shop name)

By the time you go to 3 link, or longer triangulated 4 link, you'll also want longer shocks and springs, or coil overs to make use of all the extra articulation. Then you're modifying spring mounts, cutting out rear cargo floor and adding hoops.

That's a lot of squeezing for a bit of juice out of a fat ass 80.

Honestly, just buy the best 80 you can find within your budget. Add 2" lift, 35s, lockers, sliders, and go wheeling with your buddies.

Start thinking about major mods IF you find things like stock links are stopping you from keeping up with your buddies in their jeeps, 80s, and whatever other basic rigs you said they have.

I regularly wheeled my hzj105, built more or less as above, with guys running 37" stickies, highly modified trucks with more lift, bigger tires, better suspension etc etc
The biggest difference in where my group's rigs would go was 90% driver capability, then the limitations of the truck.
There was loads of times, I walked my cruiser through an obstacle in 1 or 2 go's when "more capable rigs" needed multiple tries at the same obstacle.

Then there was times the frame would get hung up on rocks, and the only option was winching.
All good fun when done with buddies. More fun than building a rig at home alone.

By the time you really find the limit of an 80, you'll be beating sh¡t out of the body work.

 

[AgentOrange]

I don’t think that’s really the case— at least in my opinion as a former 80 series nutjob and person who used to spend a lot of time driving my 80 on rocks:

The issue becomes that 30+ years in 80 series modifications in the US and a few things have become apparent:

1. The 80 series is decent rock crawler without having to do much to it: 33’s, sliders, and a rear locker and you can conquer 99% of the trails in the US.

2. The 80 series really has too many body panels and glass to become a great rock crawler without **serious** mods and then becoming a trailer queen. And I think for many people, the point of the 80 is to drive, wheel, brake things, fix, and drive it home (I did this a lot in my 80 series rock days in the 2000’s).

3. Modifying an 80 series to be a serious rock crawler is a significant amount of money/time/effort…. And you can just go out and buy a dedicated rock crawler.

4. At least here on MUD as a forum to share and discuss, these types of conversations happened 15-20 years ago. And a lot of those threads are buried and a lot of the folks who made the modifications you are talking about are no longer on MUD, have sold their 80, or have gotten older and don’t care about 3-linking a 3 ton brick.

A deep search of MUD will give you a lot of the answers you want to 3-linking the rear of an 80 series. Searching on GOOGLE and then delimiting MUD as your source, you will get days of reading from the 2003-2010 time period.

I as well as several others here can definitely attest to most of this. I've removed LOTS of sheet metal and if I was paying labor for the work I've done, it would be ridiculous. That said, I drive my 80 everywhere I wheel. No trailer queen here. But every year it gets further and further away from being an 80 anymore

 

[ThreeEyedBandit]

One thing I think would help tremendously is going to coil overs in the rear, mounted as far outboard as possible. Mostly to control off camber/body roll, and get the thing to feel a little more planted. I'm at the point I might do the rear before the front.

I also concur that these things have a ton of sheet metal to smash through. I do love being able to drive mine anywhere, wheel and return all self contained, my wife even love driving the thing distances. That is making removing the rear a little more difficult. Would be nice to drop the CG and get some clearance around trees in the roof line.

 

[SNLC]

The 80 rear end is not really comparable to 4runner, at least, not early generations. 4 runner have much shorter rear links than an 80. This along with other differences limits articulation and travel much more than stock 80 rear links

80s have longer rear links than many other production 4x4, so the rear actually works pretty well.

In Australia, guys fit longer lower links to Nissan Patrols (very similar to 80s), but very rare for anyone to do it to an 80. This makes the Patrol rear end more equal to the 80s.

I think Rampt customs??? in Aus has kits for longer rear links. upper and lower links for 80s I believe. ( might be wrong on the shop name)

By the time you go to 3 link, or longer triangulated 4 link, you'll also want longer shocks and springs, or coil overs to make use of all the extra articulation. Then you're modifying spring mounts, cutting out rear cargo floor and adding hoops.

That's a lot of squeezing for a bit of juice out of a fat ass 80.

Honestly, just buy the best 80 you can find within your budget. Add 2" lift, 35s, lockers, sliders, and go wheeling with your buddies.

Start thinking about major mods IF you find things like stock links are stopping you from keeping up with your buddies in their jeeps, 80s, and whatever other basic rigs you said they have.

I regularly wheeled my hzj105, built more or less as above, with guys running 37" stickies, highly modified trucks with more lift, bigger tires, better suspension etc etc
The biggest difference in where my group's rigs would go was 90% driver capability, then the limitations of the truck.
There was loads of times, I walked my cruiser through an obstacle in 1 or 2 go's when "more capable rigs" needed multiple tries at the same obstacle.

Then there was times the frame would get hung up on rocks, and the only option was winching.
All good fun when done with buddies. More fun than building a rig at home alone.

By the time you really find the limit of an 80, you'll be beating sh¡t out of the body work.

I digress, the rear works like poo when you really flex it. Axle walks bad.

Cheers