Which engine swap would be best for me? (5.3, 6.2 diesel, other?)

[OverLand Cruisers]

Another, not often brought up, point is that the rig will remain all metric...
Not a huge issue, but a nice benefit of going with the 4.7 (or non-usa OEM diesel).

 

[powermad]

No doubt the the LS2 and 3 are fantastic engines that have a lot of potential and aftermarket support.
I'm not a purist and don't really care what powers the rig as long as it does it well.

From the post I linked he quoted at the end about $4,500 for engine and trans plus around another $1,000 in misc stuff.
Looks like you can get a 6.0 liter, trans, ECM and harness for $4,000 on E-bay plus misc stuff.

4.7, (271 hp) at 4800 rpm with 427 N·m (315 lbf·ft) of torque at 3400 rpm.
6.0 LQ4, 300 HP @ 4400, 360 torque @ 4000

It doesn't seem any more expensive between them but the 6.0 makes a bit more power due to it's size.

Mmm, this looks tasty and way out of my price range.
http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/pts/4447413468.html

 

[powermad]

Slee's conversions are top notch but it carries a hefty price tag to just say you kept it all Toyota. How are they estimating this fuel economy? The Sequoia and 100 get less than that lol

That's just the one guys numbers, he seems knowledgeable enough to be able to accurately determine fuel mileage and don't see why he would falsify the info.
I believe he stated he stopped counting after 150 hrs doing the conversion and had a lot of figuring out how to make everything work together.
In the end he used a 2005 4.7 powertrain and the t-case was a direct bolt on to the trans.
I imagine it would be around 60 - 80 hrs labor cost in a shop for either powertrain.

Also don't you need to run a lift to be able use the 4l60 or 80 trans?

 

[RockJock82]

All Gen 3 and 4 use all metric hardware along with Cummins engines. Not saying the guy was lying about his #'s just believe factual recorded info off gps or a scan gauge tool. No lift is needed to run the GM transmission but it does help.

 

[rockrod]

Why not use a 4.7L? That is like saying why go to 35inch tires from your stock 275 Michelin's? A GM 4.8L puts out more hp and tq than a 4.7L and is cheaper to purchase hell even a 5.3L is cheaper than a 4.7L. People who usually comment and say GM products are crap are still living in the 80's and with the 305 mentality. These Gen 3 and 4 motors are just as reliable and produce more power than the Toyota motors. Someone mentioned why not buy a GM product with this motor in it, ask all the 40, 45, 55, 60 Series guys why they upgrade their drivetrains. LACK OF POWER!!! Bullelk why did you sell both your LX's and buy a 100? I think the 4.7 is a good motor in Sequoia's and possibly 100 series but it would not meet my power needs for a 6500-7000lb rig. I have around 30k on my motor since rebuild and have replaced NOTHING but the starter.

i agree with all of this. BTW - my motor and trans went in as-is. I didn't replacing anything except for the oil pan (swapped to f-body for more clearance). I did have a failure recently - not anything on the gm motor, but rather the stock toyota made radiator. It split the top tank at 195k miles.

 

[powermad]

A 2005 5.3 and 4l65e can be up to $4,500. 5.3/4l60 combos seem to be in the $2300 - $3800 range. 195 HP @ 4600 RPM, 260 torque @ 2800 RPM
A 2005 4.7 engine and trans will be around $3600. 271 hp at 4800 rpm with 315 lb·ft of torque at 3400 rpm.

So from just a bit of research the 4.7 is not more expensive or less powered than a 5.3
From that standpoint it boils down to what you prefer to swing into it.

Labor rate for either will most likely be the same if done by someone else.

It's just engine and trans mounts, electrical and other stuff to connect and sort out.
Nothing real magical or complicated for either one really.
Just time consuming is all.

It's not like trying to drop in a 428 Cobra Jet into a 76 Ford Highboy where nothing was ever designed to fit and every single thing has to be custom made to make it work. That job was no fun at all.

 

[OverLand Cruisers]

No doubt the the LS2 and 3 are fantastic engines that have a lot of potential and aftermarket support.
I'm not a purist and don't really care what powers the rig as long as it does it well.

From the post I linked he quoted at the end about $4,500 for engine and trans plus around another $1,000 in misc stuff.
Looks like you can get a 6.0 liter, trans, ECM and harness for $4,000 on E-bay plus misc stuff.

4.7, (271 hp) at 4800 rpm with 427 N·m (315 lbf·ft) of torque at 3400 rpm.
6.0 LQ4, 300 HP @ 4400, 360 torque @ 4000

It doesn't seem any more expensive between them but the 6.0 makes a bit more power due to it's size.

Mmm, this looks tasty and way out of my price range.
http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/pts/4447413468.html

That built LS3 would be bad ass!
I've been obsessing about putting something like that in a 62 we have sitting here...fun to dream.

 

[RockJock82]

A 2005 5.3 and 4l65e can be up to $4,500. 5.3/4l60 combos seem to be in the $2300 - $3800 range. 195 HP @ 4600 RPM, 260 torque @ 2800 RPM
A 2005 4.7 engine and trans will be around $3600. 271 hp at 4800 rpm with 315 lb·ft of torque at 3400 rpm.

So from just a bit of research the 4.7 is not more expensive or less powered than a 5.3
From that standpoint it boils down to what you prefer to swing into it.

Labor rate for either will most likely be the same if done by someone else.

It's just engine and trans mounts, electrical and other stuff to connect and sort out.
Nothing real magical or complicated for either one really.
Just time consuming is all.

It's not like trying to drop in a 428 Cobra Jet into a 76 Ford Highboy where nothing was ever designed to fit and every single thing has to be custom made to make it work. That job was no fun at all.

195hp?? That is not correct.. The first gen 5.3L is 295hp which is higher than the vvt 4.7L. The vvt 5.3L lays down some decent power in the 300's also with displacement on demand.

 

[powermad]

You're correct, 315 HP and 335 ft lbs torque for 2005. Don't remember where I got that other info, Wiki I think.
Still pretty close powerwise and in the same ballpark costwise.

If your'e prone to can't leave well enough alone for very long and want to start fiddling around with stuff, the Vortecs would be the best option due to aftermarket stuff that can just be bolted on or reprogrammed with relative ease and cost.

 

[RockJock82]

True story no aftermarket support out there for the 4.7l other than a sc... You'd think a company would come up with something due to how many of them are in vehicles... But on the upside you can rack up the mileage on them

 

[THEROK]

Is the 2uZfe any smoother and quieter than the GM engines? I really enjoyed these two qualities when I had a v8 4th gen 4r.

 

[RockJock82]

I haven't noticed a difference in vibration or noise between the two. My brother has a 100 series that I've driven a couple times. Granted my Lexus has a high flow cat and a decently loud 3in magna flow so it's quite a bit louder on that aspect

 

[Dutchman82]

Just food for thought, the 6.2l has a turbo kit available from Banks Power that is claiming +60 hp/+115 lb-ft. Its about 2k but makes gives it some good torque, but comes as a complete kit.

 

[Zero1]

Just remember guys, 'peak' numbers don't mean s***, its all about 1) where in the power band curve you want power 2) what the area under the curve is.

Now we're not talking about some little 4cyl rice rocket that makes 90% of its power above 6000rpm (which can be fine, too, if you have narrow gearing and live between there and redline). But diesels and gasoline engines, no matter the cylinder displacement, count or arrangement, will inherently have different power band styles, each with their own pros and cons. Additionally, as referenced above, gearing too can make an impactful difference. And this is all for whether you want 1 billion N•m at 50 rpm or 1 billion km/L cruising on the highway at 74.9 mph

So which would be best for you? Sarcastically, I'd say undersize your tires with low rolling resistance, raise your gearing, lower your truck, remove sliders and add skirts front and sides, seal off front air openings, and a VW 2.0TDI put to a new ZF 9spd transmission.
But since your goals were range and fuel economy, perhaps just buy a Prius-V

 

[mgilvan]

A 2005 5.3 and 4l65e can be up to $4,500. 5.3/4l60 combos seem to be in the $2300 - $3800 range. 195 HP @ 4600 RPM, 260 torque @ 2800 RPM
A 2005 4.7 engine and trans will be around $3600. 271 hp at 4800 rpm with 315 lb·ft of torque at 3400 rpm.

So from just a bit of research the 4.7 is not more expensive or less powered than a 5.3
From that standpoint it boils down to what you prefer to swing into it.

Labor rate for either will most likely be the same if done by someone else.

It's just engine and trans mounts, electrical and other stuff to connect and sort out.
Nothing real magical or complicated for either one really.
Just time consuming is all.

It's not like trying to drop in a 428 Cobra Jet into a 76 Ford Highboy where nothing was ever designed to fit and every single thing has to be custom made to make it work. That job was no fun at all.

The torque & hp numbers in both engines (4.7/5.3) are in higher rev .
In every day driving I don’t think any of these numbers matter because at 70mph im at 2300 rpm , when was the last time any of us drive our truck at that high rpm ?
With higher rev you can kiss your gas mileage good bye
I’m a big fan of Chevy diesels , 6.2/6.5 or the turbo /6.5Turbo
You can get a very decent gas mileage and torque /H.P on very low end
Good luck

 

[69rambler]

I would have a hard time spending a dime on a 6.2/6.5 GM. They aren't horrendous, but they are a pretty crappy engine.

The 4BT's shake. It's not that they aren't "refined"- They are extremely well made engines. They are just built as no-frills, no complications work vehicle engines. They are a utility engine, not luxury or stylish. 4BT's are KISS to the extreme and frankly, I love them, but have grown to love them and wouldn't expect anyone not familiar with one to relate. A friend recently replaced his '95 K2500 6.5 turbo (aftermarket block, crank, decompressed pistons, HX40, blah, blah indestructible BS) with a pretty mild 4BT. The 4BT walks all over that 6.5 turbo. Brand new motor, not even close to broke in getting 23 average with 4.10's and 32" tires. It will do in 3rd gear what the 6.5 wouldn't do in 2nd. It's actually a nice smooth engine too, he got a nice one.

The 6BT's are pretty much the exact same physical size as the 1FZ. They weigh 300 pounds more, but the 80's don't care. There's lots of info about this swap and more to come. If you're in Portland you're kinda in the mecca of 80 series diesel swaps.

 

[Joe Link]

I would have a hard time spending a dime on a 6.2/6.5 GM. They aren't horrendous, but they are a pretty crappy engine.

The 4BT's shake. It's not that they aren't "refined"- They are extremely well made engines. They are just built as no-frills, no complications work vehicle engines. They are a utility engine, not luxury or stylish. 4BT's are KISS to the extreme and frankly, I love them, but have grown to love them and wouldn't expect anyone not familiar with one to relate. A friend recently replaced his '95 K2500 6.5 turbo (aftermarket block, crank, decompressed pistons, HX40, blah, blah indestructible BS) with a pretty mild 4BT. The 4BT walks all over that 6.5 turbo. Brand new motor, not even close to broke in getting 23 average with 4.10's and 32" tires. It will do in 3rd gear what the 6.5 wouldn't do in 2nd. It's actually a nice smooth engine too, he got a nice one.

The 6BT's are pretty much the exact same physical size as the 1FZ. They weigh 300 pounds more, but the 80's don't care. There's lots of info about this swap and more to come. If you're in Portland you're kinda in the mecca of 80 series diesel swaps.

Yeah I'm really not interested in the characteristics of the 4BT. The 6BT is of interest to me though. Both my father and brother are very familiar with the 6BT (both have Dodge 2500's), and the fact they'd be more likely to help me swap one over any other engine is a big plus.

That's good to hear about lots of 80 guys around here, I guess I need to attend some of the meets? Having local support is a huge benefit. Know of anyone local with a 6BT swap I could check out? How about a 5.3/6.0? I'd be interested to know what sort of range they're capable as well, but I can search for that.

 

[gdctaco]

I would have a hard time spending a dime on a 6.2/6.5 GM. They aren't horrendous, but they are a pretty crappy engine.

The 4BT's shake. It's not that they aren't "refined"- They are extremely well made engines. They are just built as no-frills, no complications work vehicle engines. They are a utility engine, not luxury or stylish. 4BT's are KISS to the extreme and frankly, I love them, but have grown to love them and wouldn't expect anyone not familiar with one to relate. A friend recently replaced his '95 K2500 6.5 turbo (aftermarket block, crank, decompressed pistons, HX40, blah, blah indestructible BS) with a pretty mild 4BT. The 4BT walks all over that 6.5 turbo. Brand new motor, not even close to broke in getting 23 average with 4.10's and 32" tires. It will do in 3rd gear what the 6.5 wouldn't do in 2nd. It's actually a nice smooth engine too, he got a nice one.

The 6BT's are pretty much the exact same physical size as the 1FZ. They weigh 300 pounds more, but the 80's don't care. There's lots of info about this swap and more to come. If you're in Portland you're kinda in the mecca of 80 series diesel swaps.

So when is this swap kit coming out?

 

[Duiser Offroad]

THE CUMMINS MECCA!!! EVERYONE HAS TO MAKE THE JOURNEY, AT LEAST ONCE IN THEIR LIVES.....PORTLANDIA HOME OF CUMMINS POWERED LAND CRUISERS!!

 

[White Stripe]

How bout a Isuzu NPR motor and trans and used a divorced tcase? You can get a whole NPR for like 2k. And they are known for being smooth. Or you could buy a v8 100 series and just swap a solid axle under it and be done and have good power.