Towing with a 200-series Toyota Land Cruiser (9 Viewers)

[FrazzledHunter]

I’d like that too. I’ve had too many bad experiences with Google Maps while towing to trust it. I’ve had it route me to a bridge with too low a clearance over the Ohio River, on to miles of rutted, potholed gravel roads in the pouring rain when a perfectly good paved road was nearby, through residential neighborhoods way off my route in Canada, up hills on city side streets too steep for safe towing, and into industrial sites (gravel pits, really) where there used to be a road but not anymore. Now when towing on camping trips, I always double check the route with another GPS app and look at the entire route in full detail the night before the next leg of the trip. Next summer I plan to investigate stand-alone GPS navigators dedicated to RV use.

I was unaware that dedicated GPS navigators existed for RV use - or - are you talking about specialized apps for a smart phone or PC? I have a few Garmin GPS units including one very nice nuvi that still works great. We use it when we don't want to tie up our phones with google maps.

I always thought that the best way to to address this type of problem was by using Points Of Interest (POI) data. No one knows what you're interested in so why not do it this way?

We've been a member of POI factory since its inception, I think. Here's one, for example, that tries to list fuel stations that are large vehicle friendly:

Truck/RV fuel Stations
Truck/RV fuel Stations | POI Factory - http://www.poi-factory.com/node/26860

 

[Sandroad]

I was unaware that dedicated GPS navigators existed for RV use - or - are you talking about specialized apps for a smart phone or PC? I have a few Garmin GPS units including one very nice nuvi that still works great. We use it when we don't want to tie up our phones with google maps.

I always thought that the best way to to address this type of problem was by using Points Of Interest (POI) data. No one knows what you're interested in so why not do it this way?

We've been a member of POI factory since its inception, I think. Here's one, for example, that tries to list fuel stations that are large vehicle friendly:

Truck/RV fuel Stations
Truck/RV fuel Stations | POI Factory - http://www.poi-factory.com/node/26860

This is what I’m referring to. It’s a GPS unit that allows for route customization based on your RV and your camping trip interests. There are other models and brands too, including one for RVs by Rand McNally.

https://www.amazon.com/Garmin-Navigator-High-Resolution-Satellite-Directory/dp/B09ZJXYL6W/ref=sr_1_3?crid=98V8RVSJU513&keywords=Rv%2Bnavigator&qid=1706110197&sprefix=rv%2Bnavigator%2Caps%2C112&sr=8-3&th=1

 

[GordJ]

It still surprises me that I find so much diversity on this site. I don't think that my methods are correct and have learned many things from hearing others methods. I had never thought of airing down my trailer on gravel roads but I am going to be getting a de-inflator now, for instance.
I have always found that researching my route ahead of time to be one of the steps that make the trip successful and, like Teckis, I feel that anywhere the LX goes the trailer goes so researching RV fuel sites has never occurred to me. We are gifted roads here that are truck friendly so low clearances have never come up and towing on urban streets just doesn't happen. When I'm travelling with the trailer we drive from city to city or town to town so I always know where the next fuel stop is and with very few exceptions I have never had to research fuel stops or use a mapping app. My wife would love to travel with someone as organized as you guys.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

It still surprises me that I find so much diversity on this site. I don't think that my methods are correct and have learned many things from hearing others methods. I had never thought of airing down my trailer on gravel roads but I am going to be getting a de-inflator now, for instance.
I have always found that researching my route ahead of time to be one of the steps that make the trip successful and, like Teckis, I feel that anywhere the LX goes the trailer goes so researching RV fuel sites has never occurred to me. We are gifted roads here that are truck friendly so low clearances have never come up and towing on urban streets just doesn't happen. When I'm travelling with the trailer we drive from city to city or town to town so I always know where the next fuel stop is and with very few exceptions I have never had to research fuel stops or use a mapping app. My wife would love to travel with someone as organized as you guys.

The kinds of stuff to which I am referring are some potential "gotchas". Take for example the Baltimore Harbor & Ft Mc Henry tunnel restrictions:

"Vehicles carrying bottled propane gas in excess of 10 pounds per container (maximum of 10 containers), bulk gasoline, explosives, significant amounts of radioactive materials, and other hazardous materials are prohibited from using both the Fort McHenry and Baltimore Harbor Tunnels. In addition, vehicles in excess of 13 feet, 6 inches, in height, or 96 inches (8 feet) in width; and all double trailers are prohibited from using the Baltimore Harbor Tunnel."

OK so you might say, then well I'll take the Francis Scott Key Bridge which gets around all of those restrictions. The rules there are as follows:
"Vehicles carrying Class 1 explosives and radioactive materials require an escort at the Francis Scott Key Bridge."

Unless there's a high wind restriction in effect. Oops.

People around here know about this stuff. And it makes total sense to check ahead about tunnels. But I just HATE these kinds of surprises. In fact, when towing I don't like ANY surprises LOL!!! Maybe I just need more practice towing.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

I had never thought of airing down my trailer on gravel roads but I am going to be getting a de-inflator now, for instance.

I've always dropped trailer tires to 18-20psi the minute I left pavement. Haven't had any issues so far, and trailer contents were always better off as a result.

The one time I bought a trailer at a dealership and drove straight from there to a campsite without checking trailer tire pressure, I noticed the trailer acting like a bouncing ball in my rear view mirror. Checked pressure in camp, and the tires were over 50PSI each. Dropped pressure on the way out, night & day difference.

I've had a Staun tire deflator kit for years, but also just bought this one a few days ago. I really like that it has markings for the pressure the deflator is set to - that makes them 100x more useable IMO.

 

[GordJ]

I'm heading to Edmonton to pick up my new "camping" trailer and I'm going to pick up a deflator before I leave. I'm sure that it'll make my next trip into Jimmy Lake easier on the eggs. I can't believe that I never thought of this before.

 

[linuxgod]

I’m sure low speed gravel is fine to run low pressure in a trailer tire, but when you hit pavement don’t forget to air back up to the max tire pressure, particularly if your trailer has ST tires (like many trailers). Even though you may not need the pressure to carry the weight, ST tires should always be at max pressure to keep the sidewalls stiff to prevent trailer sway (unless your trailer manual says otherwise)

 

[eatSleepWoof]

I'm heading to Edmonton to pick up my new "camping" trailer and I'm going to pick up a deflator before I leave. I'm sure that it'll make my next trip into Jimmy Lake easier on the eggs. I can't believe that I never thought of this before.

I'm going to Calgary (actually, High River, AB) later today with the same mission. Might see you on the road, hah!

// edit: Made it to High River. 7 hour drive for me, not fun at all. On the upside, the roads are perfectly clear.

Picking up or new toy tomorrow morning.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Well, here's the new toy. Picked up a brand new old-stock, 2022 Winnibago 2108FBS this morning, drove 7 hours over the rockies to get it home.

Dealer was blowing it out about $3-4k under invoice, I negotiated it down another $5k. Winnebago isn't the quality I was initially searching for, but at this price point it'd be silly to pass it up. Local dealerships are selling the same units (2024 models) for almost twice the cost.

Drove to the dealer (7 hours one way, hotel overnight, etc.), and it turned out that the photos in the ad were of a completely different trailer. Some lot monkey used the same photos for numerous trailers, and of course this was the last trailer they had, so I had to take it. Instead of the dinette there is a fold out couch, and instead of the Dometic 8 cu/ft absorption fridge (120v / propane), it's a 10 cu/ft 12v GE fridge. The fridge appears to draw around 13a, (according to the label) so quite a high power consumption unit. Not thrilled about that, but I can make it work. Will also likely remove the couch in the future and make some sort of dinette / bunk-bed setup that I'm envisioning.

In any case, I threw up a stink about the unintentional (I hope) bait & switch, and the dealer gave me a free Anderson WD hitch + another $300 off, so I took it.

Trailer is only 7ft wide, so there's no need for tow mirrors - big plus for me, as I hate having to fiddle with tow mirrors. There's also a 60x74", walk-around north-south bed, which was similarly a must. Big sink, big stove, useable counter space, dry bath, etc. Simple, but good layout. The small size and huge ground clearance will make it easy to get the trailer to our favourite spots off the beaten path.

If this is Winnebago's interpretation of the phrase "micro minnie," I'm afraid to ask what a non-micro, non-minnie unit would look like. This thing is yuuuuuge.

Trailer is about 4200lbs dry, 400lbs tongue weight, and 5500 GVWR. The LX basically doesn't feel it. The drive home was completely uneventful. Trailer tucks in nicely behind the LX, has a very similar track width, remains stable even over huge dips and potholes at highway speeds. I did about 100-110kph for the first half of the trip, then settled in at 90-100kph for the rest. Up mountain grades, with the transmission in S4 (but possibly in third) I never saw higher than 3500 RPM. Most of the time the LX was spinning around 2200 RPM. This truck is like the honey badger, it just doesn't give a sh--. Too easy.

 

[TeCKis300]

Well, here's the new toy. Picked up a brand new old-stock, 2022 Winnibago 2108FBS this morning, drove 7 hours over the rockies to get it home.

Dealer was blowing it out about $3-4k under invoice, I negotiated it down another $5k. Winnebago isn't the quality I was initially searching for, but at this price point it'd be silly to pass it up. Local dealerships are selling the same units (2024 models) for almost twice the cost.

Drove to the dealer (7 hours one way, hotel overnight, etc.), and it turned out that the photos in the ad were of a completely different trailer. Some lot monkey used the same photos for numerous trailers, and of course this was the last trailer they had, so I had to take it. Instead of the dinette there is a fold out couch, and instead of the Dometic 8 cu/ft absorption fridge (120v / propane), it's a 10cu/ft 12v GE fridge. The fridge appears to draw around 10a, so quite a high power consumption unit. Not thrilled about that, but I can make it work. Will also likely remove the couch in the future and make some sort of dinette / bunk-bed setup that I'm envisioning.

In any case, I threw up a stink about the unintentional (I hope) bait & switch, and the dealer gave me a free Anderson WD hitch + another $300 off, so I took it.

Trailer is only 7ft wide, so there's no need for tow mirrors - big plus for me, as I hate having to fiddle with tow mirrors. There's also a 60x74", walk-around north-south bed, which was similarly a must. Big sink, big stove, useable counter space, dry bath, etc. Simple, but good layout. The small size and huge ground clearance will make it easy to get the trailer to our favourite spots off the beaten path.

If this is Winnebago's interpretation of the phrase "micro minnie," I'm afraid to ask what a non-micro, non-minnie unit would look like. This thing is yuuuuuge.

Trailer is about 4200lbs dry, 400lbs tongue weight, and 5500 GVWR. The LX basically doesn't feel it. The drive home was completely uneventful. Trailer tucks in nicely behind the LX, has a very similar track width, remains stable even over huge dips and potholes at highway speeds. I did about 100-110kph for the first half of the trip, then settled in at 90-100kph for the rest. Up mountain grades, with the transmission in S4 (but possibly in third) I never saw higher than 3500 RPM. Most of the time the LX was spinning around 2200 RPM. This truck is like the honey badger, it just doesn't give a sh--. Too easy.

Woohoo!! Congrats on the new toy. It's going to make for some great memories. Seems well matched to complement the LXs strengths.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Well, here's the new toy. Picked up a brand new old-stock, 2022 Winnibago 2108FBS this morning, drove 7 hours over the rockies to get it home.

Dealer was blowing it out about $3-4k under invoice, I negotiated it down another $5k. Winnebago isn't the quality I was initially searching for, but at this price point it'd be silly to pass it up. Local dealerships are selling the same units (2024 models) for almost twice the cost.

Drove to the dealer (7 hours one way, hotel overnight, etc.), and it turned out that the photos in the ad were of a completely different trailer. Some lot monkey used the same photos for numerous trailers, and of course this was the last trailer they had, so I had to take it. Instead of the dinette there is a fold out couch, and instead of the Dometic 8 cu/ft absorption fridge (120v / propane), it's a 10cu/ft 12v GE fridge. The fridge appears to draw around 10a, so quite a high power consumption unit. Not thrilled about that, but I can make it work. Will also likely remove the couch in the future and make some sort of dinette / bunk-bed setup that I'm envisioning.

In any case, I threw up a stink about the unintentional (I hope) bait & switch, and the dealer gave me a free Anderson WD hitch + another $300 off, so I took it.

Trailer is only 7ft wide, so there's no need for tow mirrors - big plus for me, as I hate having to fiddle with tow mirrors. There's also a 60x74", walk-around north-south bed, which was similarly a must. Big sink, big stove, useable counter space, dry bath, etc. Simple, but good layout. The small size and huge ground clearance will make it easy to get the trailer to our favourite spots off the beaten path.

If this is Winnebago's interpretation of the phrase "micro minnie," I'm afraid to ask what a non-micro, non-minnie unit would look like. This thing is yuuuuuge.

Trailer is about 4200lbs dry, 400lbs tongue weight, and 5500 GVWR. The LX basically doesn't feel it. The drive home was completely uneventful. Trailer tucks in nicely behind the LX, has a very similar track width, remains stable even over huge dips and potholes at highway speeds. I did about 100-110kph for the first half of the trip, then settled in at 90-100kph for the rest. Up mountain grades, with the transmission in S4 (but possibly in third) I never saw higher than 3500 RPM. Most of the time the LX was spinning around 2200 RPM. This truck is like the honey badger, it just doesn't give a sh--. Too easy.

Best of luck to you! Sounds like you got a great deal.

 

[GordJ]

January must be the time to buy in Alberta, the 20’er that I’ve been looking at dropped $14 grand CAD and they just bumped it back up before i bought it at the cheaper price. For you people south of the border the exchange calculation is the same as miles to kilometers, multiply by 5/8’s. Or, at least, that’s what it feels like.
I’m waiting a while before I pick mine up so enjoy yours in the cold. Nice looking rig.

 

[Dunbar]

Rear bumper for towing
I am trying to decide between the Slee and Dissent rear bumper for my 2020 LC. I do not want swing outs and I do have a 12.5 gallon LRA tank because I plan to keep the spare below. With the stock tupperware bumper access is limited to the receiver area for pinning on the ball mount and for safety chain hooking. With the Slee aluminum unit I am worried about access to the same area. I do like the overall look of the rear bumper but don't like the cut down reflectors.

The Dissent rear bumper can be purchased without swing outs and the access to the receiver looks much better. The Slee is cosmetically more appealing but I tow many different trailers on a regular basis. The Dissent putting the 7-pin plug in the bumper is also a big plus. The area where the reflector used to be could be mounts for rear facing lights and they would hide the 4 bolts showing on both sides. Beyond towing and off-roading I want protection from minor rear impacts from other vehicles and backing into crap. I like the look of the Slee better but think I would like using the Dissent when towing. Has anyone had a look at both? I know I can't go wrong with either and I might be wrong about receiver access on the Slee but it sure looks tight.
Thoughts?

 

[Polecat]

Rear bumper for towing
I am trying to decide between the Slee and Dissent rear bumper for my 2020 LC. I do not want swing outs and I do have a 12.5 gallon LRA tank because I plan to keep the spare below. With the stock tupperware bumper access is limited to the receiver area for pinning on the ball mount and for safety chain hooking. With the Slee aluminum unit I am worried about access to the same area. I do like the overall look of the rear bumper but don't like the cut down reflectors.
View attachment 3544984
The Dissent rear bumper can be purchased without swing outs and the access to the receiver looks much better. The Slee is cosmetically more appealing but I tow many different trailers on a regular basis. The Dissent putting the 7-pin plug in the bumper is also a big plus. The area where the reflector used to be could be mounts for rear facing lights and they would hide the 4 bolts showing on both sides. Beyond towing and off-roading I want protection from minor rear impacts from other vehicles and backing into crap. I like the look of the Slee better but think I would like using the Dissent when towing. Has anyone had a look at both? I know I can't go wrong with either and I might be wrong about receiver access on the Slee but it sure looks tight.
Thoughts?

View attachment 3544988

@bigronthe200 has personal experience with both. Not sure how much towing he does, but I know he has opinions.

 

[linuxgod]

Rear bumper for towing
I am trying to decide between the Slee and Dissent rear bumper for my 2020 LC. I do not want swing outs and I do have a 12.5 gallon LRA tank because I plan to keep the spare below. With the stock tupperware bumper access is limited to the receiver area for pinning on the ball mount and for safety chain hooking. With the Slee aluminum unit I am worried about access to the same area. I do like the overall look of the rear bumper but don't like the cut down reflectors.
View attachment 3544984
The Dissent rear bumper can be purchased without swing outs and the access to the receiver looks much better. The Slee is cosmetically more appealing but I tow many different trailers on a regular basis. The Dissent putting the 7-pin plug in the bumper is also a big plus. The area where the reflector used to be could be mounts for rear facing lights and they would hide the 4 bolts showing on both sides. Beyond towing and off-roading I want protection from minor rear impacts from other vehicles and backing into crap. I like the look of the Slee better but think I would like using the Dissent when towing. Has anyone had a look at both? I know I can't go wrong with either and I might be wrong about receiver access on the Slee but it sure looks tight.
Thoughts?

View attachment 3544988

For towing the Dissent setup is better. Better access to the hitch pin, especially if you use a locking one. And the wire harness moves into the bumper where it's much more easily accessible.

 

[TeCKis300]

Rear bumper for towing
I am trying to decide between the Slee and Dissent rear bumper for my 2020 LC. I do not want swing outs and I do have a 12.5 gallon LRA tank because I plan to keep the spare below. With the stock tupperware bumper access is limited to the receiver area for pinning on the ball mount and for safety chain hooking. With the Slee aluminum unit I am worried about access to the same area. I do like the overall look of the rear bumper but don't like the cut down reflectors.
View attachment 3544984
The Dissent rear bumper can be purchased without swing outs and the access to the receiver looks much better. The Slee is cosmetically more appealing but I tow many different trailers on a regular basis. The Dissent putting the 7-pin plug in the bumper is also a big plus. The area where the reflector used to be could be mounts for rear facing lights and they would hide the 4 bolts showing on both sides. Beyond towing and off-roading I want protection from minor rear impacts from other vehicles and backing into crap. I like the look of the Slee better but think I would like using the Dissent when towing. Has anyone had a look at both? I know I can't go wrong with either and I might be wrong about receiver access on the Slee but it sure looks tight.
Thoughts?

View attachment 3544988

Good question and I've wondered this as well.

I can jack knife my trailer pretty tight against the stock tupperwear where they can touch. Aftermarket bumpers seem to project a bit more, including the harness mounted on the face of the bumper in the Dissent. This would require a ball to be projected out another couple inches to make room, and that wouldn't be great with a tongue heavy trailer. I guess it's part of the reason that I probably won't ever get into an aftermarket steel bumper with my current trailer.

 

[linuxgod]

Good question and I've wondered this as well.

I can jack knife my trailer pretty tight against the stock tupperwear where they can touch. Aftermarket bumpers seem to project a bit more, including the harness mounted on the face of the bumper in the Dissent. This would require a ball to be projected out another couple inches to make room, and that wouldn't be great with a tongue heavy trailer. I guess it's part of the reason that I probably won't ever get into an aftermarket steel bumper with my current trailer.

I bought a longer drop shank because my spare on my swingout would contact the propane tanks when turning tight. The extended length doesn't have a huge impact on weight distribution and handling, IMO, even with my trailer where the tongue is 900#.

 

[TeCKis300]

I bought a longer drop shank because my spare on my swingout would contact the propane tanks when turning tight. The extended length doesn't have a huge impact on weight distribution and handling, IMO, even with my trailer where the tongue is 900#.

View attachment 3545148

Yeah, it's all incremental and everyone will have to choose what they're trading.

I would offer that the ball distance from the rear axle is critical and one of the primary geometries to optimize. Weight transfer is only one aspect. It's about managing how much leverage is given to the trailer and it's potential to induce sway, porpoising, and overall control. I've said this before but for the sake of others joining this conversation, wheelbase is emphasized in towing. That's a simplification as it's really about the ratio of wheelbase to rear overhang (distance of rear axle to ball). We have a roughly 2:1 ratio, so an increase of 7" rear overhang, is the equivalent to giving up 14" of wheelbase.

My trailer is 1200lbs tongue and granted well overweight. To offset that, I try to optimize elsewhere. I cut 2" off the drop hitch to optimize this geometry and it was worth the incremental improvement.

 

[Dunbar]

I see the logic of the shorter distance between ball and receiver. I didn't get it before digesting the content of this thread, which read to other study. I have some nice solid steel ball mounts that I'm going to drill new holes to tighten that distance. i have not kissed this taller to the bumper endcap but sure watch close

 

[linuxgod]

Yeah, it's all incremental and everyone will have to choose what they're trading.

I would offer that the ball distance from the rear axle is critical and one of the primary geometries to optimize. Weight transfer is only one aspect. It's about managing how much leverage is given to the trailer and it's potential to induce sway, porpoising, and overall control. I've said this before but for the sake of others joining this conversation, wheelbase is emphasized in towing. That's a simplification as it's really about the ratio of wheelbase to rear overhang (distance of rear axle to ball). We have a roughly 2:1 ratio, so an increase of 7" rear overhang, is the equivalent to giving up 14" of wheelbase.

My trailer is 1200lbs tongue and granted well overweight. To offset that, I try to optimize elsewhere. I cut 2" off the drop hitch to optimize this geometry and it was worth the incremental improvement.

Agreed. In fairness I'd shorten it if I could, but like everything it's a tradeoff between performance and practicality (needing to sometimes haul the trailer and sometimes overland without it) and as it stands I STILL had to move the tank mount and tanks back about 2" in order to clear. Yeah it's that close. I'm just pointing out that if you need to make that tradeoff, it's probably not a huge impact by itself.

I will say that I've noticed no difference in handling in most circumstances. That's not to say there isn't a difference, just that if I feel at all squirrely (which may only happen if someone blows by me in the adjacent lane at 20+mph faster) it's absolutely because my trailer weight distribution is off... either too much tongue weight or more often too much stuff (bikes, cooler, firewood) in the far rear of the trailer lightening the tongue.