It didn't when it was brand new, but quickly developed rattle in the slide on the side with my fridge. No idea if others do as well, but it was a PITA to have to remove it and re-do the interior space to no longer have the tray it was meant for.
Tinker's latest brutal review of LC250 (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter rscoleman
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I come from a ultralight backpacking/bikepacking background, so it's honestly no big deal for me to delay cooking around the weather. Carrying this much cooking gear/food and having a space that is truly enclosable and climate controlled (with a DVD player!) is, in itself, a luxury
.My table was installed in September of 2021 (nearly 4 years ago) and I've experienced exactly zero downpours during a cooking event. I don't disagree that a liftgate would be preferable in a downpour, but for my application, the packaging/usability benefits of the barn door and door-mounted table vastly outweigh the risk of being inconvenienced or, at the worst, going to bed hungry due to a weather event.
I also agree on the note of a dual swingout for providing some more room, however they also add quite a bit of weight to the rear of the rig. My table weighs less than 10 pounds, and my drawers only weigh 70 pounds. Swingout bumpers or drawers with an extended cooking platform are going to weigh hundreds of pounds. I suppose a batwing awning would be the best of all worlds, yet they are also heavy and expensive.
The slide out tray is in fact a huge winner. I bought my 2013 Trail 8 years ago, with the slide out tray. It has been through 100,000 miles now of driving loaded side to side, front to back and almost to the roof. All kinds of roads including easy to extreme off-road, sometimes off-road for 6 hours straight. It has never once rattled or squeaked loaded or unloaded. I use it as my fridge slide with some improvised tie down I installed. I use it as a seat with multiple people on it sometimes and I slide it out to load groceries onto it. It's one of the most useful features I think that Toyota has ever offered. Yes the space underneath is small, but it is functional. I store gloves under there, road flares, rope, etc. Plenty of flat things fit.
The space opened up by sliding it out is a non issue for me. I pack properly and have never had anything fall in there inconveniently. The slide out tray and a few other features combined together, before they split the Trail into standard and Premium, is why I specifically bought a 2013. Also pre facelift is the way.
Even without the big diff - the LC300 is a bit of a lowrider in most trims. Has good bones. But it's more of an urban vehicle in production form - especially the LX versions. A few inches of lift makes a lot of difference. But in stock form I think it's lower than the Rav4 in most places including belly clearance. Toyota's marketing is confusing and kinda stupid IMO. Why not offer the LX with eKDSS and a rear locker like the GX if it isn't getting AHC? Seems like Toyota could mix and match the parts a bit better if they wanted to push a more offroad focused version.
Hiluxforever
SILVER Star
The shock mounts are a disaster waiting to happen.
They hang even lower than the J150, and I crumpled one on the 4th intermediate trail I did.
They hang even lower than the J150, and I crumpled one on the 4th intermediate trail I did.
IMO the ground clearance on just about every stock Toyota 4x4 kind of sucks. When I first got my GX470, our Subaru Outback had like an inch more ground clearance. I drug the skids everywhere. The stock LC250 is the same as an Outback/Forester....8.7 inches. The vaunted LC200 is only 8.9...the same as a Subie with one-size larger tires. Supposedly the GX550 OT has 9.8", which is a big improvement, but underwhelming for true wheeling and way less than one can get in a Bronco. Don't get me wrong, any stock Toyota 4x4 will absolutely out-wheel a stock Subie, but the stock Toyota will absolutely drag and it will be an annoyance (at best) and possibly damage the vehicle (at worst).
Still....it's amazing how much clearance the older 4x4s have with a lift. I'm at 13" under the front skids with the lift on my GX470! Way more clearance than a Jeep on the same tire size. I think it's around 10" under the rear diff on my rig. Hopefully the TNGA-F rigs have similar huge improvements when they are lifted.
I'm not sure where Toyota measures from. But it's hard to make heads or tails of it. The Tundra has the same size tire as the GX OT with the same 9.5" axle in the base model Tundras but lists them at 9.4". LX is 7.9-8.1. So something is around 1-1.5" below the rear diff height. I'd guess that's the low point on the front diff skid or the transmission crossmember.
hoser
SILVER Star
I come from ultralight backpacking as well. Most of my camping is in the 5-10k ft altitude and it can rain any time of the year. Certainly, our camping terrain and style is quite different. It snowed here in Tahoe last weekend too.I come from a ultralight backpacking/bikepacking background, so it's honestly no big deal for me to delay cooking around the weather. Carrying this much cooking gear/food and having a space that is truly enclosable and climate controlled (with a DVD player!) is, in itself, a luxury
My table was installed in September of 2021 (nearly 4 years ago) and I've experienced exactly zero downpours during a cooking event. I don't disagree that a liftgate would be preferable in a downpour, but for my application, the packaging/usability benefits of the barn door and door-mounted table vastly outweigh the risk of being inconvenienced or, at the worst, going to bed hungry due to a weather event.
I also agree on the note of a dual swingout for providing some more room, however they also add quite a bit of weight to the rear of the rig. My table weighs less than 10 pounds, and my drawers only weigh 70 pounds. Swingout bumpers or drawers with an extended cooking platform are going to weigh hundreds of pounds. I suppose a batwing awning would be the best of all worlds, yet they are also heavy and expensive.
FWIW - I had a 4Runners for 15+ years. I can't think of a single time in all of those years that I sat under the hatch to get out of the weather - be it rain, sun, snow or anything else. The only time I would say it had some value was loading groceries in the rain. I live in one of the rainiest places in the USA currently and still don't really see much utility to a hatch as a cover. A door with a drop down table? I'd use it all the time. I also use my tailgate almost every time I'm out and about on my truck. If it has to be a hatch - split hatch/gate works well too. I can make any configuration work, but it sure is nice to have a fold out table of some sort for everything from working on stuff, cooking, sitting on, etc.
For bad weather - to have a lot of value it really needs more coverage than a hatch. The sun isn't usually directly overhead. The awning is a better solution if it's easy to deploy and you plan on being out in the weather for more than a few minutes.
For bad weather - to have a lot of value it really needs more coverage than a hatch. The sun isn't usually directly overhead. The awning is a better solution if it's easy to deploy and you plan on being out in the weather for more than a few minutes.
It's a desert compared to SE Alaska.
But I agree, very little utility to the minimal coverage of a hatch.
Especially this year from what I've heard.It's a desert compared to SE Alaska.
Appreciate that take that’s actually a great idea about just keeping a fold out table in the truck.
Hiluxforever
SILVER Star
Honestly, with my barn door, there has not been a single time where a hatch would have kept me dry. Most the places I have lived where it rains it does so diagonally.
I love the barn door for storage, as a shade, or as a windbreaker.
I love the barn door for storage, as a shade, or as a windbreaker.
joseywales
Renaissance Redneck
Yeah, but she’s a great looking rig, that Monica!
All good, I think we understand what each other was saying anyway!
I prefer the split tailgate, but otherwise Toyota figured out an optimal design decades ago with the Rav4's.
Rear swingout door with the spare tire mounted on the rear door, including a paint matched cover. I bought a 3rd gen 4wd V6 Rav4 base model with cloth seats brand new and owned it for 9 years until it was totaled by a jackass running a red light. Amazing vehicle and crazy quick with the V6.
But, of course Toyota did away with this rear hatch design once the Rav4 got more mainstream, along with also eliminating the option to equip it with a 2GR-FE instead of the 4 banger.
As a Rav4 enthusiast, the LC200 -> LC250 downgrade pales in comparison to what Toyota did to the Rav4.
Rear swingout door with the spare tire mounted on the rear door, including a paint matched cover. I bought a 3rd gen 4wd V6 Rav4 base model with cloth seats brand new and owned it for 9 years until it was totaled by a jackass running a red light. Amazing vehicle and crazy quick with the V6.
But, of course Toyota did away with this rear hatch design once the Rav4 got more mainstream, along with also eliminating the option to equip it with a 2GR-FE instead of the 4 banger.
As a Rav4 enthusiast, the LC200 -> LC250 downgrade pales in comparison to what Toyota did to the Rav4.
Yup. I can't argue with this looking through an enthusiast lens. Of course mother Toyota generally knows what she's doing and tailors these trims and bumpers for the target yuppie new car buyer. Perhaps taking on a frustratingly conservative posture with tire size and equipment even as the Overlanding market is exploding.
I mean how many years did Toyota sleep on the GX until enthusiasts and aftermarket woke up to cut yards of tupperwear to realize the chassis' full potential?
Leave it to the lawyers to limit tire sizes on Toyota's. Even now, they're finally stepping up to 33s where the competitors and new EV kids on the block are into 35s and 37s.
Where the old GX460/470 only had enough core strength in diffs, suspension uprights, steering components to fit big 34 before components start becoming liabilities in hard offroading, I think the GX550 is going to be the ticket to maximize the platform with solid core strength to support 35s and hopefully 37s. Possibly enough for the bucket challenge (at least on the IFS front axle).
33s and 13" of clearance have gotten me everywhere I've ever needed or wanted to go, with the departure angle being the limiting factor. But, I wheeled for years in a Subaru with 27" tires, and got good at picking lines
. Many of the Broncos, Jeeps, EVs etc rolling around on 37s may never see dirt! Most of the ones around here certainly don't.Regardless of the clearance problem, approach and departure angles seem to be getting worse as well. Everything was "tucked up" very nicely on the old rigs, but there is only so much room when turbochargers, intercoolers, and batteries start getting added to the mix.
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joseywales
Renaissance Redneck
33s and 13" of clearance have gotten me everywhere I've ever needed or wanted to go, with the departure angle being the limiting factor. But, I wheeled for years in a Subaru with 27" tires, and got good at picking lines
Regardless of the clearance problem, approach and departure angles seem to be getting worse as well. Everything was "tucked up" very nicely on the old rigs, but there is only so much room when turbochargers, intercoolers, and batteries start getting added to the mix.
Pretty much the only Toyota with good departure angle is the fj40 lol. They all have big butts. But the 4runners do tend to be better in this regard than the Land Cruisers. Every truck I've owned has had deep scrapes and gouges or missing paint along the bottom of the bumpers and/or trailer hitch.
Hiluxforever
SILVER Star
Yup, the cost of having a nice ass is it hits everything.
