Like breing the 250 as the 200 replacement. Amazing feat apparently loved by the crowds and some enthusiastWell then kudos to Toyota for building basically the same for so much less money. A truly amazing feat.
Josh’s Cars of Japan reviews the LC250
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I do have a Tundra - prior gen. The 4Runner got too small and I wanted more towing capacity. LC is the same size so it didn't really help on the space used. I bought a tundra. Did not find it bouncy, but I did put Fox suspension on. Would do the same for the 200 and had the same on my 4Runner so it's probably a wash on that front.
New tundra is a quantum leap above the prior models 200 and Tundra. Especially the power train nvh. It just has so much more power. And the new geometry in the ifs is a big improvement. But the one I had ordered in 2022 was really poorly assembled so I didn't buy it after driving it. And the body design is a big step down. Interior is significantly smaller as is the bed volume. Belt lines are high, roof is lower. Overall the body design sucks. But the chassis is much improved.
New tundra is a quantum leap above the prior models 200 and Tundra. Especially the power train nvh. It just has so much more power. And the new geometry in the ifs is a big improvement. But the one I had ordered in 2022 was really poorly assembled so I didn't buy it after driving it. And the body design is a big step down. Interior is significantly smaller as is the bed volume. Belt lines are high, roof is lower. Overall the body design sucks. But the chassis is much improved.
The lc300 is less expensive than the 250 in Japan. None of them are much different in cost.Well then kudos to Toyota for building basically the same for so much less money. A truly amazing feat.
Jetboy keeps changing direction, pushing Tundras and 4 runners and now jumping to the 250.
Regarding pricing in Japan, I does look like the 250 is sold at a premium. Good marketing and Japanese buying habits/interests can do this and/or the interest to sell more 300 series. Japanese interest in buying the latest, sense of size, familiarity with 4 bangers etc. may make the 250 something they can sell at a higher price. It remains a Prado with a 4 banger and in the US with hybrid complexity. Not something I desire or want for the long run. Less so the car enthusiast vehicle. Wish 250 owners enjoyment and the best though. Tastes and wants and financial capabilities differ.
Added the LX600 pricing in Japan for reference. Amazing the premium over the LC300. Clearly prestige and a different marketing approach. Makes the LC300 a very good value proposition in Japan.
Regarding pricing in Japan, I does look like the 250 is sold at a premium. Good marketing and Japanese buying habits/interests can do this and/or the interest to sell more 300 series. Japanese interest in buying the latest, sense of size, familiarity with 4 bangers etc. may make the 250 something they can sell at a higher price. It remains a Prado with a 4 banger and in the US with hybrid complexity. Not something I desire or want for the long run. Less so the car enthusiast vehicle. Wish 250 owners enjoyment and the best though. Tastes and wants and financial capabilities differ.
Added the LX600 pricing in Japan for reference. Amazing the premium over the LC300. Clearly prestige and a different marketing approach. Makes the LC300 a very good value proposition in Japan.
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Haven't changed position at all. The 200 was price too high North America. It wasn't a good value and people didn't buy it. That's it. It's not a bad car. Just a bad value proposition.
It was the top of the line version and a great value proposition for those who wanted her capabilities.
We would have appreciated a lower spec version for less $$$, no argument there.
It's just not much different from a high spec tundra. The early lc200s we're probably less well equipped. And the interiors haven't held up very well. Long run they're less desirable than the tundra/4Runner. Look at the condition of 200k mile versions of all 3. The LC hasn't aged well.
Your missing the point. Her capabilities weren't anything exceedingly beyond the multiple lower priced alternatives offered from the same manufacturer, that also held the same (or better) expectations of reliability, durability, and longevity.
In all actuality you mostly paid for prestige, and to a lesser extent, the perception of luxury. There's nothing inherently wrong with that. But the problem is multiple other manufacturers play that game much, much better. (Again: see 200 sales figures)
... Anyways, the best value proposition on a Land Cruiser is on the used market, purchased by an individual with at least some level of DIY mechanical ability.
Really dude
Man, when I think you've reached your limits you surprise everyone. We can clearly see what you say in the market when looking 2020/2021s LC prices way lower than similar year tundra/4Runners
(irony much).
Let’s agree to disagree and move on
That's specific to the interiors. The LC interiors have not aged well. The fake wood print wears off quickly and looks dingy. The leather also ages much quicker than the softex in the 4Runners. Incidentally the tundra leather also seems to wear better although it's harder and lower grade. By the 15 year mark the softex wins easily.Man, when I think you've reached your limits you surprise everyone. We can clearly see what you say in the market when looking 2020/2021s LC prices way lower than similar year tundra/4Runners
If you want I can show you pictures of 200,000 mile 4Runner versus Land Cruiser interiors. It's not close.
That's probably better.
Well, when you are good with a bland basic looking dash and seats with softex then the Tundra and 4 Runner is your choice and may hold up better. They have gone cheap utilitarian there for my taste. Perhaps the 250 with cloth seats will do the same. I agree with Josh that is odd for a $60k or so vehicle and would not be my preference.
The LC200 here in the US uses more upscale materials. I have not seen noticeable cases of fake wood trim damage yet. I must say I am not a fan of the LX570 wood in the pre and post 2016 models or the pre 2016 LC200's. I have seen driver seat wear from (fat) people who slide in and out of their cars instead of using the A-pillar handle and the running boards. Replacing the seat cover and or cover and cushion is simple and not a big cost if that really bothers you, or go seat covers like many will do in 4 Runners and Tundras as well.
So what is the point here? Jetboy liking Tundras or 4 Runners more. OK, I get that and understand what you are saying. I remain that the LC200 is a great value for money vehicle better than many other vehicles I have owned based on experience from new.
Just curious Jetboy, what are you actually driving at the moment? And perhaps what do you plan to buy? If there is no further coms from you however just more points I am considering using the ignore button. Feel free to do the same.
I've been shopping for an older model 200 (pre 2016) lately and I agree about the interior. I'm not sure if it's just the lack of care from the previous owners or quality of material used (probably a combination of both) but man is it hard to find a nice, clean interior on really any Land Cruiser that's not a 20-21 model year and even then you can find some that look a bit battered on the inside.
I'll also fess up and say that coming from both a 2nd Gen Tundra with the 5.7 and a 5th Gen 4Runner before getting wrapped up in LC enthusiast forums you are right in saying that either of them could also handle the majority of the same duties someone here in North America would have with their Land Cruiser. I straight up bought my 200 because I did drink the kool aid and wanted to see what the LC was all about. Toyota didn't need to market for my lizard brain, I just came here to Mud for my confirmation bias. It's a hell of an SUV, the best to do it IMO and yes, I wish they weren't so damn expensive.
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You can ignore me if you want. I'm pretty sure the sales numbers support my opinion.
I currently have a 2016 crewmax Tundra limited, an fj40, and an rx350. Prior to the tundra I had a 5th gen 4Runner and a powerstroke F-250 that I sold both of before buying the tundra and moving to Alaska for a couple years. Consolidating to one truck/4x4 made sense. And I bought side by side for off-road exploring here.
I looked a number of times during the 8 years that I had my 4runner at switching over to a 200 and at gx460 including when I bought the tundra. I intended to buy a 22 Tundra, but after test driving it I didn't think it was good enough for $70k given significant fit and finish issues on a new truck. The early 22s we're pretty crude. Lc200 is the same size as a 4Runner and my main reason for changing was room for 4 people and gear. So I bought the cleanest Gen 2 tundra I found about a week after not buying the 3rd Gen.
I don't have anything against the 200. A 2021 LX570 at $58-62k isn't a bad value. There's a bunch in that range right now. They're coming off lease now. The secondary market values them about where they should be. About $5-10k premium over a tundra or 4Runner of similar year and miles/condition. If Toyota had priced them at that price new - I think we'd see the 300 on showroom floors.
This confirms what I suspected. You have never actually owned a 200 and used on a daily basis. That is probably the reason you think a 4Runner and a 200 series are the same size. That’s absolutely not true. I own both of these vehicles and there is a sea of difference between the two. Quality of construction, quietness, comfort, engine, SIZE, on and on. At least now we know the source of our disagreement and why you have made various statements here that are simply unreal IMO.
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The ignore feature does wonders
