GTV
SILVER Star
IMO America asked for a less expensive Land Cruiser. Toyota heard that and sent the cheap Land Cruiser instead. Very different.
Tinker's latest brutal review of LC250 (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter rscoleman
- Start date
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
IMO America asked for a less expensive Land Cruiser. Toyota heard that and sent the cheap Land Cruiser instead. Very different.
Not a fan of the range but I like the updated full size digital dash, the front locker, better skids, and it is kinda cool. Especially in Nori Green.
I would be surprised if Lexus doesn’t come out with a revised LX 600 interior over the next couple of years either to match the 700H or to have a full facelift to fix the two screen dash layout.
The front locker is really what you’re paying for, and I would think it would be easy for them to put it on a 600 overtrail version in the future.
You’re right - nori green is awesome
I understand they already have. The 2025 600 should have the full digital dash, no? They should revise the exterior and get rid of that chin. Look at the GX550 and make it bigger (to the sides - not down).
If they simply took the GX 550 grill and put it on the LX, it would fix the looks department. The headlamps on the LX looks better than the GX and I would like them to keep those though.
The 2025 600 still uses the old interior and was not upgraded quite yet.
Yet they marketed it as "The Land Cruiser is back!!" making people think they brought back something on par with what we had.
I think they could have put the Prado badge on the back and call it what it is and I wouldn't have been so disappointed.
Most Americans also buy a car based on the features and horsepower in my opinion. They care more about having heated and cooled seats rather than how big the rear axle is. Go talk to a car salesman, they can't tell you any spec about a car besides size of the engine and the wheels, yet they can name off every feature every model has.
I think they could have put the Prado badge on the back and call it what it is and I wouldn't have been so disappointed.
Most Americans also buy a car based on the features and horsepower in my opinion. They care more about having heated and cooled seats rather than how big the rear axle is. Go talk to a car salesman, they can't tell you any spec about a car besides size of the engine and the wheels, yet they can name off every feature every model has.
this.
the 250 is the zebra LC.
tried to be 'everything' to 'everyone' and missed the mark at every step.
and yea, i guess it sells. millions of morons make moronic vids for YT everyday too.
Man, that’s wild. Why would they do that? Probably costs more to produce two different type of gauges.
Yup, the LC250 is exactly what the American market wanted. Trained consumers looking features and nameplate - for a discounted price. Toyota capitalized on it, selling on perceived value with less real content, laughing all the way to the bank.
Not surprised to see the sum of all Prado tech being disappointing together with an overlay of new gen engineers departing from traditional Toyota values. On top it remains dreadful (really dishonest) marketing. Just sad we did not get the LC 300 series in the US.
Last edited:
Honest truth for us here. I restrain my complaints over the new LC offerings because I had to wait 8 years to afford my 2016, and had never been in the market for a new LC200.
Even if I had 85K for a family hauler, the tinkerer in me would've split it in to a used LC and a fun toy anyway.
You're exactly right - a low spec 300 just doesn't cut it either. I'm keeping my 200s for the long haul.
1MOA
SILVER Star
Drive the diesel 250 overseas. It's what they should of brought into the US but never will.
I don't think it's universal. I would have paid $85,000 in 2021 dollars (~$100,000 today) for a new 300 off the lot.
Hell, there is an extremely active market for low mile, late model 200s with people basically paying 2021 sticker for them (I am one of them, God help me).
If you want a new vehicle that's truly comparable you are in a LX700h Overtrail and you're paying a $15,000 premium over what a 300 theoretically *should* cost in the US. For me, that means a less desirable drivetrain (twin turbo V6 that I don't fully trust and hybrid architecture that compromises cargo space), no "Land Cruiser" nameplate (vain, but it matters) and worse aesthetics (personal preference but I really don't like the front end). The interior is awesome though, I'll give you that. Lexus massively dropped the ball on the LX600 interior IMO so glad to see them attempt to remedy it.
Hell, there is an extremely active market for low mile, late model 200s with people basically paying 2021 sticker for them (I am one of them, God help me).
If you want a new vehicle that's truly comparable you are in a LX700h Overtrail and you're paying a $15,000 premium over what a 300 theoretically *should* cost in the US. For me, that means a less desirable drivetrain (twin turbo V6 that I don't fully trust and hybrid architecture that compromises cargo space), no "Land Cruiser" nameplate (vain, but it matters) and worse aesthetics (personal preference but I really don't like the front end). The interior is awesome though, I'll give you that. Lexus massively dropped the ball on the LX600 interior IMO so glad to see them attempt to remedy it.
Sticker? Much more. Just a couple days ago a 2021 LC200 Base with 5k miles sold at BAT for $106k. Let that sink in for a minute. This is only one example of many in that site and others.
Nobody can convince me that if Toyota brought the 300 enter or mid-trim to the US and charged $70k to $80k (today's money), it would not sell like hotcakes and, I dare to say, more than the Prado fully loaded First Edition which was in the same range. That would have slotted right in where the Prado is now and would have just kept the 4Runner as the lighter duty entry level offroader, as opposed to now where it competes with the Prado.
I bet Toyota ran the numbers and found out the profit would be 2x or 3x more with the solution of bringing the 4 banger Prado as the "new Land Cruiser" and that's what we got.
Yeah I mean 5k miles is basically a new car. That's a garage queen. But even then, $106,000 when adjusted for inflation is right around the base 200's MSRP in 2021.
0% chance the 300 would be selling in the US with a 7 handle. If they followed the 200 playbook, there would be 1 or 2 trims available that are both essentially fully loaded. I'm certain they'd be asking six figures given inflation and current tariff uncertainty.
I don't disagree about this being some profit maximizing sleight of hand. And quite frankly it's working given the sales numbers. Disappointing but you can't blame Toyota for maximizing their profits in the US market.
IIRC, part of why they ax'd the LC was overall fleet fuel economy regardless of how few they sold. Or am I mis-remembering this little gem? I know our 200s are cool and all, but efficient they are not. I wouldn't trade it for any sort of hybrid/turbo as they bring their own issues, but I do know MPG averages are what those in the corporate suite like to point to and tout along with overall cost of ownership (read: maintenance intervals, fluids, filters, etc) compared to other OEM's.
Total models sold go into the calculation. I don't think that was a huge factor, but becomes more of one when you look at high volume selling models. The 250 makes no sense to me when you roll out a 4Runner that is basically the same thing. And at that level, it is not bad. I like it more than a GX460 personally. A 200/300 replacement it is not. I wonder how the combined 250/4R sales will compare to 5th gen 4runner sales as well as their total suv segment compared to prior years.
I'll roll my 200 into the ground and hope it doesn't get totaled or stolen before another car company comes out with a no frills high quality off roader.
I thought Ineos may have been the one, but they veered far from the original vision with too much tech and nanny crap carried over from EU requirements. Maybe a future model will be in my driveway if they expand their footprint. My closest dealer is a 4 hr drive one way.
Becoming the #1 car company has changed Toyota's focus, and as we have seen with the TTV6, issues with R&D and/or quality control as they spit out vehicles at a fast speed. Their refusal to include the hybrids in the TTV6 recall shows their focus is on profits vs customer satisfaction/safety. And some 25 Tundra engines are still seizing, including a guy on the Tundra forum that after his 25 seized, they replaced with a long block and it seized too. Not the same Toyota company that build a strong reputation on reliability.
I have only purchased Toyotas during my adult life other than a barn find Nova, and most of them were new. I don't think that will be the case going forward.
I really like Honda engines. It would be awesome if they would seize the opportunity and build a reasonable cost (or at least reasonable based on current insane sticker pricing) offroader. I could see Hyundai or Kia also pushing into the segment, and they both seem to do well with QC, at least based off of the experiences of friends and family with them.
I would have 100% bought a SR trim 300 series if it came with the TTV6 and 10 speed.
The 200 is still bigger. The stretched the wheelbase and track width of the 4Runner/LC/GX to be the same as the LC200, but the bodies are narrower with larger fender flares to cover up the extra 3-4" of track width.
One of the big complaints I have been hearing about the new 4R is that the 2nd row leg room is pretty bad, worse than the 5th gen.
Look at the LX600. Its the same track and wheelbase too but the body is pretty slab sided whereas the GX/LC/4R have decent flares.
100% most wont. Its still odd that they didnt put the upgraded CV's and axle in the LC250 but did put it in the 4Runner and Tacoma.
600 OT would be ideal imho. And 100% the TTV6, especially in the LX with the 400hp tune, is stout.
I had a similar 2.8L I4 diesel for years with almost identical HP/TQ ratings to the 1GD. I would not own the Toyota version. Especially in a US vehicle with our emissions requirements. The juice is not worth the squeeze AT ALL for the diesel with that little power. If they put the 3.3L in it then I would take a look.
