Three Phase Garage Wiring? (1 Viewer)

[GLTHFJ60]

I'm starting to get more three phase equipment in the shop and plan to buy a decent size rotary phase converter in the not-too-distance future. Instead of wiring the phase converter directly to one machine, I'm considering having the phase converter power a three phase circuit breaker, then wiring from that out to my machines with THHN or other suitable wire.

The reason why I'm posting this was to ask; does anyone have experience setting up a system like this? I'm in the process of googling, but looking for direct experience.

For context: I have experience with three phase wiring systems as they apply to machinery, VFDs and plenty of experience with single phase house systems. I have a 100a sub panel and a second 30a 220v circuit in the garage, either of which I could use to power this system.

Thanks everyone!

EDIT - Seems pretty straightforward, and along the lines of what i was thinking. Maybe this thread was unnecessary.

 

[Bob Morazes]

I'm interested in the answer to this one.
3ph in our area of VA is very expensive per month, even if we dont use it, so having a converter would be terrific.
Bobmo

 

[Waorani]

I installed an American Rotary ADX20 earlier this year. Separate wall mount panel/idler. Works great, wish I'd done it years ago. Biggest thing I'm running is 5hp but went with the 20hp in hopes of scoring a bigger lathe at some point. 50a single phase feed into control panel and 3ph out to a 3ph subpanel. Also added a 3ph breaker/plug in control panel using available knockouts and added an hour meter which seems like something easy enough that AR should add to their systems. Only surprise was cost of 3ph breakers but easy enough to find for a bargain on ebay.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Very Very cool @Waorani, sounds like exactly what I'm doing, but with an ADX10.

Do you have any pics of your setup? Specifically interested in the 3ph panel you used, where you mounted your idler/control panel in relation to the 3ph panel, and the hour meter. Hadn't even thought of the hour meter.

 

[Waorani]

Crappy pics due to location but in the full pic - existing subpanel top right, ADX panel top left, 3ph subpanel bottom left, and idler way bottom right. The instructions could be simplified but connections are all labeled so it's pretty easy to hook up. IIRC, basically it's just:

- 1ph feed + ground from existing panel to ADX panel
- 3 hot + ground from ADX panel to idler (3rd "hot" becoming your generated leg)
- 3ph feed + ground from ADX panel to 3ph subpanel.

My wiring is overkill mostly because I already had it and what I didn't have I was able to order in short lengths off ebay. I used SQUARE D QO312L125G 3 PHASE 125A MLO PANEL (only holds 4 3ph breakers but that's more than I need) and I think SQUARE D QOC16US Cover (but I changed existing panel cover at same time so may have them mixed up). Hour meter was this one https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B077VRCNWX/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and it's wired to the ON light on the ADX panel. Thought I was being clever and got a Greenlee 2" "conduit" punch for cheap off ebay only to realize it was actually 2 3/8" after punching a hole. AR sold me another panel cover for only $25 + ship and I got an actual 2" punch. It's got just over 20hrs on it and I haven't had any problems out of it. It's pretty quiet but where I have the idler amplifies the sound a bit.

 

[Waorani]

One thing to remember is the two legs of your 1ph feed straight through the ADX panel whether it's running or not so be sure to turn that off anytime working downstream of your 1ph panel. Seems easy enough to remember but it's not - at least for me!

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Super cool!!! It really is that simple. Thank you sir!!
EDIT: Just ordered my ADX10. Will get started in the new year.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

@Waorani thanks again for your help! Got the phase converter all wired up and tested. Video overview for now if you're interested.

 

[Hojack]

We have an add a phase at work. They work really well. Main breaker feed to add a phase then to 3 phase panel. Feed your equipment accordingly.
What size 3 phase panel are you looking at?
Remember your taking single phase and adding a leg so your amps are going to be higher on your single phase side so you’ll need to oversize the wire.
Our VFD well pump controllers have the single phase to 3 phase feature already built into them. We have line wire size and load wire size. Single phase line wire size is larger due to the single phase draw to add the third leg for the 3 phase load.
Yaskowa is an industrial leader in the VFD world. We use them for well pumps but they are made for just about anything.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Yup, thanks Hojak. Read and followed the American Rotary install and wiring guides. Gave myself some extra room on the single phase side.

More detail:

100a sub panel with 30a breaker feeding the rotary phase converter via 8ga THHN. Neutral and ground are also fed in.

Phase converter is grounded, then ground sent from phase converter down to the 3 phase sub panel. Neutral passes through.

8ga THHN is fed through from the output terminals of the phase converter to the 100a (overkill) three phase breaker panel. Neutral bar is bonded to connect both sides, ground bars are bonded together, and to the case.

Idler motor is mounted up above to get it away from grinder s*** and keep noise away. The idler is fed with 12ga THHN cable. Thing is stupid quiet

Single phase sub panel:

Three phase breaker panel (without runs for machines yet)

Idler motor:

Mostly finished pic:

Time to send runs for machines so I can give them my attention!! Thanks again for the advice @Waorani

 

[Waorani]

Excellent!

 

[Hojack]

I’d put a surge protector in your single phase feeder panel. A little protection can go a long way in the event of a power surge.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I’d put a surge protector in your single phase feeder panel. A little protection can go a long way in the event of a power surge.

Interesting idea. To protect the phase converter specifically or the loads in the single phase panel?

 

[Hojack]

This is my house main 200Amp panel. This protects everything in my house and shop sub panel. If you have room in your house main I’d install it there.
It’s best to be installed as close to the service entrance as possible.

 

[PAToyota]

I've got the Square-D version of that in my panel. Where others in my area complain about electronics not lasting, I've got stuff that is two decades or more without issues.

 

[Hojack]

I like in the rural foothills in Oregon. Many trees and power outages. The worst are the line bumps. These surge protectors are cheap insurance.