Stuck - mo powa baby

[zeroecco]

Hello Mud!
1st thread post and a bit about me:

grew up on a farm with a corvette swapped fj40 on mudders, and got carted around in an fj70/80 most of my childhood. I turned gig rotary guy in college from the past, high boost 4-cylinder stuff later, and settled in high powered volvo's today (2023 v60 polestar 455hp 523tq). Never forgot my love for the land cruiser though. I tried a subura outback wilderness, lifted it, etc and hated it. So I bought a 1994 Toyota FZJ80 w/ 244K on the clock.

I bought this FZJ80 locally off a mud link . Mechanically she was in bad shape when I got my hands on it. hard shifting, bad idle, gas smell etc. you know the drill. One baseline, three engine flushes, and some good synthetic oil later and the rig is stable. Under powered... but stable. My plan has been to outfit this rig for full adventure mode with the family while my kid is still young enough to want to really road trip with dad.

/history

This topic is done to _death_ I know, BUT I am doing it again anyway FML...

engine status:
Engine as far as I can tell is healthy for miles and age. In order of cylinder:
compression:
178, 168, 168, 165, 170, 170
leak down:
16%, 20%, 19%, 22%, 19%, 20%

I am faced with a dilemma. This truck can't hold 60MPH without feeling like it is going to tear itself apart. Could be mounts etc but foot to the floor going uphill at sea level this truck struggles.

All I really want is to cruise on the freeway at freeway speeds with this thing at 7-8K pounds. I do not need more hard accel. I have more in my other car. I just need to be able to cruise comfortably at modern speeds. I am so stuck that I have been spreadsheeting everyday since I bought this truck. Where to go from here... I am not sure what to do.

My options as I see them:
- stroke the engine ($10K in parts including computer)
- turbo ($12-16K if using a kit from various shops)
- Supercharged (if I can find one for an OBD1 truck) $???
- swap v8 ($13-60K depending on how hands on I am)
- swap diesel ($?????)

Advice always welcome and thanks for reading.

 

[zeroecco]

Oh right since buying this rig:
Orikawa door panels
uv blocking tint all the way around
upgraded stereo w/ wireless carplay
solve function mirror fix
solve function door tweeters
upgraded to ironman foam cell since this thing is already done up in full ironman as is

 

[bhsdriller]

Sell it and buy a 100 series

 

[zeroecco]

nah, I love this rig too much to sell it.

 

[TXMeatball]

This truck can't hold 60MPH without feeling like it is going to tear itself apart

These trucks are slow but they're not that slow. Mine is lifted 3" on 35"s with bumper/winch/sliders and I usually cruise around ~70-75. MPG is as expected, but I keep up. You sure something isn't wrong with it?

 

[zeroecco]

it's possible. it's very possible. the OBD1 says everything is a-ok (blinky light no stops), baseline had a ton of things done.
I reset the computer
calibrated the transmission cable, throttle cable and cruise cable
cleaned injectors
new ignition minus the coil and distributor itself, 3 degrees btdc
checked air flow meter per fsm
new tps
new iac
replaced all vacuum hoses
new radiator and hoses
transmission flush
transfer case flush
zerked all fittings under the car
checked new plugs after 1000 miles and they are a beautiful brown... except 5 and 6, they look like they have never been used... not wet, just very very clean
no coolant leaks, no air bubbles in radiator during leakdown
no loss of coolant

 

[jpoole]

This truck can't hold 60MPH without feeling like it is going to tear itself apart.

Unless this is happening at relatively high elevation, with a stiff headwind, substantial load and/or particularly steep hills then I'd lean towards there being a problem.

It's a rare situation when my 80 can't hold 60. My 80 does struggle at elevation but I only see elevation when I travel out West. Around here I drive in the hills/mountains a good bit and often tow a 3k lb popup camper w extra gear. While I'll concede that the 80 is slow compared to most modern vehicles I also think that the performance is adequate and safe in these conditions. If I was diving at elevation more regularly (Rockies, etc.) I could see taking steps to bump the power up but for tooling around near sea-level, not in a rush, the 80 does just fine and can safely keep up with traffic in my experience. I've sold vehicles that I felt were too slow and I think it's important to be able to keep up with traffic, for safety reasons, but beyond that I'm not in a hurry and I really like driving the 80 in stock form.

I wonder if you can get a probe on the rear injectors (long screwdriver, pointy end on injector, handle against ear) to confirm they are firing, test the header temps with an IR thermometer on all cylinders to see if they are pretty close, etc. to confirm all cylinders are pulling their share.

I'm also curious what your average MPG is across a few full tanks of fuel (accurately corrected for tire size) since if it's out of range it could help you identify that there are tune issues.

Other items to consider checking/rechecking would be timing (some folks advance timing a bit), knock sensor health, fuel pressure at the rail (I'd consider setting this up to test while driving in case of intermittent pressure issues), O2 sensor health, compression test, etc.

The earlier 80s seem to be harder to dial in and can suffer from fuel and/or ignition system issues that allow relatively smooth but anemic operation. Your 80 wouldn't be the first ODB1 rig that I've heard of suffering from low power while otherwise running smooth.

Beyond finding easy ways to rule out possible tune / operation issues I also wonder if it would be easy for you to get behind the wheel of a known health 80 to compare. It's always possible that your 80 is fine and just too slow for your tastes and I'd be looking to find that out with the least amount of work possible.

Ultimately how much power your 80 "should" have is up to your preferences in your driving conditions. Given your history, if you need to throw larger sums of $$ at the rig I'd vote for an LS swap as it seems consistent with some of your past rigs, would give you a boost in power and MPG and plenty to tinker with

 

[doc_random]

Some have reported cracked intake hoses that flex on acceleration. Arrow in this picture. I didn't see where you mentioned this. This is after the airflow meter so it can be a large vacuum leak.

 

[zeroecco]

Thanks so much for this feedback.
I live in Portland Oregon, so hills are a thing for me daily.
Fuel economy is right around 10-11 mpg.
I actually do not know anyone in the LC/4x4 world so getting behind the wheel of a known healthy rig would be hard for me.

 

[zeroecco]

I haven't replaced that hose specifically. I did wrap the whole thing in electrical tape when I was chasing idling issues (see attached video's). It _does_ sound like a diesel a bit because the exhaust is pretty rotten, please ignore that part at least:

start:
idling:

 

[mudgudgeon]

stroke the engine ($10K in parts including computer)

You might have a completed bottom end for $10k
I don't believe you'd come close to having a running stroked version of these engines for $10k.
If you can, I want your parts list, and contacts.

3 degrees btdc

Try advancing static timing to 6-10⁰ BTDC

Some are happy at 10⁰, some won't tolerate more than 6⁰.

My original engine was really happy at 10⁰, and smoother power delivery. Probably no additional power, it just got there quicker.

Current, used engine, I stopped at about 7⁰

Mine is 5 speed manual, on 33"s but it will happily sit at 120+ km/hr which is about 80 mph.
Hills definitely slow it down. To drop it to 60mph, it's gonna take a decent long hill

 

[Roketdriver]

My loss of power issue was resolved with a new catalytic converter - might be worth checking for clogs in the exhaust.

 

[zeroecco]

I will push the timing up today and let people know

 

[zeroecco]

My loss of power issue was resolved with a new catalytic converter - might be worth checking for clogs in the exhaust.

That is a very real possibility for me. Previous owner said they did the cats, but they get hot enough to make the passenger area concerningly hot to the point my partner asked if something was on fire

 

[voodu3]

X2 on the cats and timing. Also on the low power are using the ECT switch on the dash? It holds the shifts to higher rpms. When you’re pulling a hill and can’t go any faster does the O/D light flash on the dash? It could be it’s not downshifting properly.
If the cats were replaced they could be missing the heat shields. They make a big difference in the temp of passenger side floor

 

[zeroecco]

X2 on the cats and timing. Also on the low power are using the ECT switch on the dash? It holds the shifts to higher rpms. When you’re pulling a hill and can’t go any faster does the O/D light flash on the dash? It could be it’s not downshifting properly.
If the cats were replaced they could be missing the heat shields. They make a big difference in the temp of passenger side floor

not using ECT, O/D doesn't blink, car downshifts to I think 2nd and 4K RPM @ 55mph on speedo. When at 4K RPM, engine feels like it is about to throw a rod. Lots of audible stumbling and light bucking

 

[zeroecco]

well... I say "bucking" but it could be in my head, need another car person in the car to say "yes" or "no"

 

[zeroecco]

alright, exhaust inspection coming. will update when I have it done

 

[BILT4ME]

Hello Mud!
1st thread post and a bit about me:

grew up on a farm with a corvette swapped fj40 on mudders, and got carted around in an fj70/80 most of my childhood. I turned gig rotary guy in college from the past, high boost 4-cylinder stuff later, and settled in high powered volvo's today (2023 v60 polestar 455hp 523tq). Never forgot my love for the land cruiser though. I tried a subura outback wilderness, lifted it, etc and hated it. So I bought a 1994 Toyota FZJ80 w/ 244K on the clock.

I bought this FZJ80 locally off a mud link . Mechanically she was in bad shape when I got my hands on it. hard shifting, bad idle, gas smell etc. you know the drill. One baseline, three engine flushes, and some good synthetic oil later and the rig is stable. Under powered... but stable. My plan has been to outfit this rig for full adventure mode with the family while my kid is still young enough to want to really road trip with dad.

/history

This topic is done to _death_ I know, BUT I am doing it again anyway FML...

engine status:
Engine as far as I can tell is healthy for miles and age. In order of cylinder:
compression:
178, 168, 168, 165, 170, 170
leak down:
16%, 20%, 19%, 22%, 19%, 20%

I am faced with a dilemma. This truck can't hold 60MPH without feeling like it is going to tear itself apart. Could be mounts etc but foot to the floor going uphill at sea level this truck struggles.

All I really want is to cruise on the freeway at freeway speeds with this thing at 7-8K pounds. I do not need more hard accel. I have more in my other car. I just need to be able to cruise comfortably at modern speeds. I am so stuck that I have been spreadsheeting everyday since I bought this truck. Where to go from here... I am not sure what to do.

My options as I see them:
- stroke the engine ($10K in parts including computer)
- turbo ($12-16K if using a kit from various shops)
- Supercharged (if I can find one for an OBD1 truck) $???
- swap v8 ($13-60K depending on how hands on I am)
- swap diesel ($?????)

Advice always welcome and thanks for reading.

View attachment 3696566

I'm going to suggest a couple things.

1) New plugs, Plug Wires, Cap, Rotor. All of these should be Toyota, not NGK or anyone else. Yes, it can seriously make a difference.
2) While the engine is running, remove the oil cap (710 cap if you're standing on the other side). If the engine nearly dies, then you don't have any major vacuum leaks. If it makes almost no difference, you have a LOT of vacuum leaks. I would start at replacing the spark plug tube seals and the Valve Cover gasket, the PCV valve, grommet, and hose and the VC to throttle body hose.

3) Brakes
I have been fighting a brake issue for years that one rear set of pads or the other was always wearing our early. I finally replaced BOTH rear calipers with NEW Toyota calipers and I gained 2 MPG and my brakes work MUCH better now. (I also replaced the LSPV) Basically, my rear brakes were constantly dragging causing low power and poor mileage. I average 11.5 MPG for the last several years. This is my DD (15K-20K miles/year) I also found that one of my banjo bolts had machining debris in the cross-hole. This was enough to cause one side to be slow and to allow more dragging. I cleaned it out with a drill bit and it fixed it.

4) Check your wheel bearings to make sure they are properly lubed and adjusted. Having loose wheel bearings will cause brakes to drag, bearings to drag, and poor performance.

5) Fix all vacuum leaks. Replace all hoses on the intake and around it.

 

[PNWGERMAN]

That is a very real possibility for me. Previous owner said they did the cats, but they get hot enough to make the passenger area concerningly hot to the point my partner asked if something was on fire

You should look into this. When cats get that hot its a very positive sign that they are clogged up. If your engine cant breath, it wont go.