Thanks for the tip. Do you remove the assembly to lubricate it? Where do you apply the lubricant? I can't tell if it's hanging on the pivot portion or on the part that slides.
Stiff / Sticky accelerator pedal (2004)
- Thread starter Cruiserhead05
- Start date
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This is from another post here on mud. It doesn't explain why it's not a good idea. I don't know if the LX has the same accelerator assembly as the cruiser for these years.
Lexus warns that accelerator pedals on 2001-2013 vehicles do not require lubrication. DO NOT apply oil or other lubrication to the accelerator pedal assembly. If applied, the accelerator pedal assembly must be replaced.
This TSB applies to models CT200H, ES300, ES300H, ES330, ES350, GS300, GS350, GS430, GS450H, GS460, GX460, GX470, HS250H, IS F, IS250, IS250C, IS350, IS350C, LFA, LS430, LS460, LS600H, LX470, LX570, RX330, RX350, RX400H, RX450H and SC430.
Lexus warns that accelerator pedals on 2001-2013 vehicles do not require lubrication. DO NOT apply oil or other lubrication to the accelerator pedal assembly. If applied, the accelerator pedal assembly must be replaced.
This TSB applies to models CT200H, ES300, ES300H, ES330, ES350, GS300, GS350, GS430, GS450H, GS460, GX460, GX470, HS250H, IS F, IS250, IS250C, IS350, IS350C, LFA, LS430, LS460, LS600H, LX470, LX570, RX330, RX350, RX400H, RX450H and SC430.
A few drops to the spring.
- Thread starter
- #25
The '03 and newer(i think) is drive by wire so there's no oiling of a cable to help this.
I ended up getting a good deal on a brand new OEM pedal assembly. Swap it out with the original one and it still has the same stickiness a year later. I have the original one laying around the garage and have played with various lubricants to see if it would help but it does not. Seems to be an issue with the resistance the spring has against the pedal assembly.
I ended up getting a good deal on a brand new OEM pedal assembly. Swap it out with the original one and it still has the same stickiness a year later. I have the original one laying around the garage and have played with various lubricants to see if it would help but it does not. Seems to be an issue with the resistance the spring has against the pedal assembly.
Bringing new life into the thread. Unsure if @Cruiserhead05 's rig still had stickiness even after replacement. My 04'
LC is having the same issue and I don't want to drop $400 if it doesn't fix the problem.
I believe the correct assembly # is 78010-60090 (Pedal Travel Sensor)
Thanks
LC is having the same issue and I don't want to drop $400 if it doesn't fix the problem.
I believe the correct assembly # is 78010-60090 (Pedal Travel Sensor)
Thanks
So, I kinda temporarily fixed this issue but probably not the right way. Unfortunately, I did it a couple weeks after buying the LX last year and didn't take any pictures. Going off of memory, so don't expect this to be exact.
When I first got my LX, I noticed the throttle pedal was kinda notchy; it wouldn't move smoothly through its range, but rather, seemed to skip as I increased pressure. It made it so that it was kinda jerky to drive at times, especially off road.
At first, I thought it was the large spring on the outside of the unit that appears to exert return pressure on the pedal, or the pedal position sensor at the top. Greasing all that didn't do a thing, and I hadn't yet stumbled upon the post in this thread talking about never greasing it unless you want to replace it.
Regardless, since that didn't help, I pulled the whole pedal assembly out. It's constructed with a bracket that holds the pedal, and the pedal has a rod that passes through the bracket. Inside the bracket, wrapped around the pedal pivot rod, is a thing. I really don't know what to call it, but it's a thing that is shaped like a cylinder, and is responsible for the majority of the pressure you feel when you press on the gas pedal. Inside this little thing are two complimentary pieces of plastic - one is fixed in place, and the other rotates with the gas pedal rod. Behind one of these pieces is a spring that you push against when you press the pedal.
What fixed my problem for at least the last year is to disassemble the cylinder and grease the sliding surfaces between the two plastic pieces that fit together. Years of wear had made those surfaces no longer slide against each other smoothly. Here's where I probably screwed up - I doubt plastic is a big fan of moly grease, which is what I used to grease the surface. I'm imagine something like graphite would probably be a better alternative, but maybe someone can chime in on what sort of lubricant should be used between sliding plastic surfaces.
One big note is that it is quite difficult to get the cylinder to come apart. The end cap is made of plastic with multiple sets of groove cast into it, and pressed together. The only way to disassemble the thing is to use some small screwdrivers or dental picks to pry the end cap off, and you will scratch it up good. It was clearly never meant to come apart, but I didn't destroy it in the process, fortunately.
Do at your own risk - worst case you can replace the pedal, but that ain't cheap. If it works, you just saved 400$; if it doesn't, not really much worse off.
Edit: A very quick google search says moly grease is okay to use with plastic, but there's probably something better out there. Teflon paste seems like a good option.
When I first got my LX, I noticed the throttle pedal was kinda notchy; it wouldn't move smoothly through its range, but rather, seemed to skip as I increased pressure. It made it so that it was kinda jerky to drive at times, especially off road.
At first, I thought it was the large spring on the outside of the unit that appears to exert return pressure on the pedal, or the pedal position sensor at the top. Greasing all that didn't do a thing, and I hadn't yet stumbled upon the post in this thread talking about never greasing it unless you want to replace it.
Regardless, since that didn't help, I pulled the whole pedal assembly out. It's constructed with a bracket that holds the pedal, and the pedal has a rod that passes through the bracket. Inside the bracket, wrapped around the pedal pivot rod, is a thing. I really don't know what to call it, but it's a thing that is shaped like a cylinder, and is responsible for the majority of the pressure you feel when you press on the gas pedal. Inside this little thing are two complimentary pieces of plastic - one is fixed in place, and the other rotates with the gas pedal rod. Behind one of these pieces is a spring that you push against when you press the pedal.
What fixed my problem for at least the last year is to disassemble the cylinder and grease the sliding surfaces between the two plastic pieces that fit together. Years of wear had made those surfaces no longer slide against each other smoothly. Here's where I probably screwed up - I doubt plastic is a big fan of moly grease, which is what I used to grease the surface. I'm imagine something like graphite would probably be a better alternative, but maybe someone can chime in on what sort of lubricant should be used between sliding plastic surfaces.
One big note is that it is quite difficult to get the cylinder to come apart. The end cap is made of plastic with multiple sets of groove cast into it, and pressed together. The only way to disassemble the thing is to use some small screwdrivers or dental picks to pry the end cap off, and you will scratch it up good. It was clearly never meant to come apart, but I didn't destroy it in the process, fortunately.
Do at your own risk - worst case you can replace the pedal, but that ain't cheap. If it works, you just saved 400$; if it doesn't, not really much worse off.
Edit: A very quick google search says moly grease is okay to use with plastic, but there's probably something better out there. Teflon paste seems like a good option.
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loeky
SILVER Star
loeky
SILVER Star
Thinking further after reading @krispykritter's take on the same fix - I wonder if you could drill a hole in the side of the plastic disc and pump some grease directly into the cylinder. Kind of like greasing the drive shaft, so that grease gets forced in and around the components.
Might save taking it apart - which was a total PITA as mentioned. Saved my sanity though.
Might save taking it apart - which was a total PITA as mentioned. Saved my sanity though.
loeky
SILVER Star
I tried that same thing (removing the bolt) but found i had to actually keep my foot lifted as there was so little resistance i would be flooring the gas by just resting as normal. Glad it worked for you thought - deff the easiest fix.
Based on the way its constructed, I'm not sure that would work without filling the thing completely with grease. Might work but might be a major mess, I'm not really sure! If it did work, it would save a ton of time, for sure!
For my 2006 LC I followed @krispykritter 's lead. I 49% wish I'd never done it, 51% stoked. My pedal's been what I call "ratcheting" for a year since I bought it. Always drove me crazy and no amount of lube in the general area helped.
Basically there are three springs in the whole thing. The one activated by the little bronze screw (removed by @Krispykreme) is what was causing the ratcheting I felt. Removing that screw first then actuating the pedal proved it was the source and if I wasn't dumb I would have pulled that screw and put it back in the truck. 5 minute job. Instead I was set on lubing stuff so I took the pedal shaft off and put graphite on the plastic bearings--which I could've done without pulling the lock ring and messing with the big spring.
So the 49%: There are several ways this all could've gone wrong, particularly with regard to reassembly. Take pictures so you get it back together. Prying the main spring sucks. The sensor is surprisingly delicate. And for starters, getting the two bolts off on the first place under the steering column is a major practice in patient and some acrobatics.
The good: removing that brass bolt to disable the secondary force against your foot in my case did two things, removed whatever was grinding/ratcheting from the whole process; and second, made the rig feel like a Tesla on the starting line. My wife says it feels like our old X5, less like a tired old dog. I put some graphite liquid on the plastic bearings but I'm pretty sure it didn't matter. It's whatever's inside the cylinder that needed work and I didn't bother. Another side benefit...I realized the extra backing on the new carpet I had installed was limiting the travel to the white plastic pedal stop. So now I have another half inch of unimpeded travel having cut that area out...fwiw.
The worst: On reinstall I sheered off the lower bolt. Apparently it doesn't require the torque I'd think something important like a gas pedal should need. So now I'm screwed...though it works...just not ideal and gotta get that bolt drilled out.
If one of us doesn't end up rear ending someone at the first stop light, we'll probably keep it as is--feather light touch through the first half of the stroke. Beyond half stroke, it seems way smoother but similar pressure.
Tools: 10, 8, 7mm sockets and a combination of extensions and elbows to get the top bolt out. I used a large channel lock wrench to manhandle the big spring (totally unnecessarily).
I did get a CEL on reinstall because I took out the sensor part and didn't get it back in exactly the same I guess. I didn't bother even checking it. I figured I didn't get the sensor perfectly back so just reset by pulling the negative battery lead for a bit and all was fine. Before reset the new idle was at 1100 and after reset the new low end was captured and idle was back to ~700.
Basically there are three springs in the whole thing. The one activated by the little bronze screw (removed by @Krispykreme) is what was causing the ratcheting I felt. Removing that screw first then actuating the pedal proved it was the source and if I wasn't dumb I would have pulled that screw and put it back in the truck. 5 minute job. Instead I was set on lubing stuff so I took the pedal shaft off and put graphite on the plastic bearings--which I could've done without pulling the lock ring and messing with the big spring.
So the 49%: There are several ways this all could've gone wrong, particularly with regard to reassembly. Take pictures so you get it back together. Prying the main spring sucks. The sensor is surprisingly delicate. And for starters, getting the two bolts off on the first place under the steering column is a major practice in patient and some acrobatics.
The good: removing that brass bolt to disable the secondary force against your foot in my case did two things, removed whatever was grinding/ratcheting from the whole process; and second, made the rig feel like a Tesla on the starting line. My wife says it feels like our old X5, less like a tired old dog. I put some graphite liquid on the plastic bearings but I'm pretty sure it didn't matter. It's whatever's inside the cylinder that needed work and I didn't bother. Another side benefit...I realized the extra backing on the new carpet I had installed was limiting the travel to the white plastic pedal stop. So now I have another half inch of unimpeded travel having cut that area out...fwiw.
The worst: On reinstall I sheered off the lower bolt. Apparently it doesn't require the torque I'd think something important like a gas pedal should need. So now I'm screwed...though it works...just not ideal and gotta get that bolt drilled out.
If one of us doesn't end up rear ending someone at the first stop light, we'll probably keep it as is--feather light touch through the first half of the stroke. Beyond half stroke, it seems way smoother but similar pressure.
Tools: 10, 8, 7mm sockets and a combination of extensions and elbows to get the top bolt out. I used a large channel lock wrench to manhandle the big spring (totally unnecessarily).
I did get a CEL on reinstall because I took out the sensor part and didn't get it back in exactly the same I guess. I didn't bother even checking it. I figured I didn't get the sensor perfectly back so just reset by pulling the negative battery lead for a bit and all was fine. Before reset the new idle was at 1100 and after reset the new low end was captured and idle was back to ~700.
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Ouch! Snapped bolt =(
Since it's not really seized in there, it should come out okay but it's going to be damn hard to get to it with a drill. Good luck!
You're correct though, the part that needs the extra application of lube is to the inside of that cylinder - remove that through-bolt just removes that whole contraption from the equation. I don't like how light the pedal is without that spring, but to each their own.
Glad to happy/sad meter is very slightly tilted to the happy side!
Since it's not really seized in there, it should come out okay but it's going to be damn hard to get to it with a drill. Good luck!
You're correct though, the part that needs the extra application of lube is to the inside of that cylinder - remove that through-bolt just removes that whole contraption from the equation. I don't like how light the pedal is without that spring, but to each their own.
Glad to happy/sad meter is very slightly tilted to the happy side!
I'm //almost// ready to spend the $400. Driving on dirt roads all weekend I alternated between loving the fine, nimble, imediately responsive throttle control and having a sore shin holding my foot up (resting on the carpet helps). I will say, this bolt trick makes burning dinosaurs easier; instead of making me earn the horsepower, it feels like the burden of acceleration has been entirely put on the rig. Though I can see Grandpa putting it through a storefront. Furthermore, I almost wonder if that spring doesn't actively contribute to fuel economy, by discouraging throttle micromanagement. My wife just walked in: "it's great, feels like the old beemer". Maybe I'll try it for a bit.
Re the bolt, turns out, looking at it in a new light, it sheared with a quarter inch to grab on account of the platform lift on the back of the pedal. So, piece of cake to unscrew.
Anyway, I'd recommend trying the bolt trick to get a totally different feel.
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Not a bad idea. It would be nice if the innards could be modified to have about 50% less low end pressure without removing the screw altogether. The 02+ LX and Toyota part numbers are the same (78010-60090). Has anyone heard of the same part number being made different between the two (referring to the comment suggesting LX might be softer).
Second day of driving without the bolt: I'll probably just buy new. But it sure makes the lumbering wagon feel almost sporty, well vaguely modern at least.
How did you get this thing apart?
I tried completely drenching it in liquid graphite. It had zero effect on the plastic-on-plastic sticking feel. Unfortunately I bought a new pedal and it has the same exact feel. I want to figure out a way to have that cylinder spring engaged but without about 75% of the associated friction.
I undid that screw there then used a couple fine screw drivers to pry the cap out. It wasn't easy.
