Yes, I am sorry for not including that. I had the intake and exhaust machined together. Cost me a lot, but I was tired of chasing the leak. Remflex is good for taking up mismatches, but treat it carefully, it is fragile. I had two damaged in shipping.
SOR Header Flaw?? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter dirtyjobs
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Yes, I am sorry for not including that. I had the intake and exhaust machined together. Cost me a lot, but I was tired of chasing the leak. Remflex is good for taking up mismatches, but treat it carefully, it is fragile. I had two damaged in shipping.
I had headers on my 60....never again. They were a constant pain and after fooling with trying to get them to seal I just went back to a stock.
shipmag
Hagler Technology LLC. Aka Shipmag
Back in the early 80's i had a cracked stock exhaust manifold and installed a header on the 74 fj40. That was before the internet and it was all trial and error. I lucked out after maching both the manifolds so the nut surface of the flange on both manifolds was the same thickness.
everyone knows aftermarket parts are built to such tight tolerances they don't need gaskets....right?
Most jigs take at least 6 beers to finish
Most jigs take at least 6 beers to finish
But a good header manufacturer shouldn't ever force you into having to perform such a "fix".
- Thread starter
- #26
Depending on SOR's response, I'm happy to have everyone's advice on this. I may need it all. My 40 is going to be my primary 4 wheeled vehicle for a bit, so I especially don't want to redo work in the future-if it's avoidable.
After seeing the second batch of photos of the flanges I’d like to retract my comment on “hand twisting” them straight.
All though my Land Cruiser experience is limited I’m a retired pipefitter after 45yrs and am very familiar with weld pipe fabrication and the effects of weld heat pulling, pushing, and warping fabrications in all sorts of directions. Even with the perfect jig setup, when the fabrication is released from the jig it can react to stresses put in from the welding and distort out of shape. The jig may be perfect but the human welder is often inconsistent. One welder may put one, two or four tacks on each pipe. Another welder might tack the outside pipes and work inward. Or vice versa. And the same goes for welding it out. Then throw in coffee and lunch breaks in the middle of the weld out and who knows what will happen when it’s released from the jig. But I guess how it happened doesn’t really matter. Yours is out of whack! So if SOR doesn’t replace it with one that’s true, I would (before machining) attempt to cold bend it back to true as possible. I would start with maybe C-clamping or bolting it down to a flat surface like a welding table or a section of stout steel and get a feel for how much force it takes to flatten it out. If it takes more force then you feel comfortable with then you could add spacers (flat washers) to the opposite side and over flex it, bending it in the right direction. With patience I think you could get it close to perfect and may minimize or eliminate machining. Sorry for the long post.
All though my Land Cruiser experience is limited I’m a retired pipefitter after 45yrs and am very familiar with weld pipe fabrication and the effects of weld heat pulling, pushing, and warping fabrications in all sorts of directions. Even with the perfect jig setup, when the fabrication is released from the jig it can react to stresses put in from the welding and distort out of shape. The jig may be perfect but the human welder is often inconsistent. One welder may put one, two or four tacks on each pipe. Another welder might tack the outside pipes and work inward. Or vice versa. And the same goes for welding it out. Then throw in coffee and lunch breaks in the middle of the weld out and who knows what will happen when it’s released from the jig. But I guess how it happened doesn’t really matter. Yours is out of whack! So if SOR doesn’t replace it with one that’s true, I would (before machining) attempt to cold bend it back to true as possible. I would start with maybe C-clamping or bolting it down to a flat surface like a welding table or a section of stout steel and get a feel for how much force it takes to flatten it out. If it takes more force then you feel comfortable with then you could add spacers (flat washers) to the opposite side and over flex it, bending it in the right direction. With patience I think you could get it close to perfect and may minimize or eliminate machining. Sorry for the long post.
- Thread starter
- #28
No need to apologize, that's good information that may be invaluable in the near future. Thanks.
Stumpalama
Forum Junkie
I've had SOR (or MAF) - it's been so long ago, I can't remember which- headers on my rig for close to 15 years with zero issues. They didn't need any shims and fit with only ultra copper on both sides of the gasket as insurance.
shipmag
Hagler Technology LLC. Aka Shipmag
After he bends them back while bolted down could he add head to the critical temp on the flange and let it cool by itself? Or is that like chasing a snake.
That would help but I'd be concerned about damaging the finish. All though the finish isn't going to last long anyway when in use. I think the fabrication is lightweight enough that cold bending would do it. Even if it springs right back it'll give him a feel for how much force is needed to pull them true and will help with any machining decisions. My choice would be a piece of 2 x 2 x 1/4 steel square tube and a heavy C-clamp.
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My concern is that the warpage shown in the first pic is on a corner of the flange that does not receive any direct clamping force. Trying to draw down a different part of the header until that corner follows...that much...is dubious.
Honestly, I would ask the SOR tech if you can do a dry fit and torque on that one piece to test it without voiding a warranty return. It could eliminate the concern without having to go thru a full install.
Honestly, I would ask the SOR tech if you can do a dry fit and torque on that one piece to test it without voiding a warranty return. It could eliminate the concern without having to go thru a full install.
- Thread starter
- #33
Paul with SOR called me today.
Essentially, a degree of imperfection is going to be normal with the manufacturing process (its a jig thing). They also said that if these do not workout, I can return it for new one, but I should know upon install if there is going to be a gap problem. Paul was very confident that the gap will be pressed out without too much torquing.
So my next question:
Is this the best gasket I can get? Along with the KW copper coat gasket compound?
Amazon.com: Remflex 7009 Exhaust Gasket for Toyota L6 Engine: Automotive
Thanks again guys....looks like I need to renew my Silver Star Membership
Essentially, a degree of imperfection is going to be normal with the manufacturing process (its a jig thing). They also said that if these do not workout, I can return it for new one, but I should know upon install if there is going to be a gap problem. Paul was very confident that the gap will be pressed out without too much torquing.
So my next question:
Is this the best gasket I can get? Along with the KW copper coat gasket compound?
Amazon.com: Remflex 7009 Exhaust Gasket for Toyota L6 Engine: Automotive
Thanks again guys....looks like I need to renew my Silver Star Membership
FWIW, Remflex does not recommend copper coat or any other sealant with their gasket.
Personally, I would recommend taking the header and intake to a machine shop and see if they can match the header to the intake. Or you may want to see if SOR will swap them now and see if another one is better.
Personally, I would recommend taking the header and intake to a machine shop and see if they can match the header to the intake. Or you may want to see if SOR will swap them now and see if another one is better.
To try to bend something you have to overbend to account for spring back. Set it on a flat table see what you have. Shim the low spots and draw the high spots down to the table with clamps. Keep increasing shim thickness until everything starts to flatten out. It will take time and effort but it will work.
I would want it relatively flat before trying to clap it to the head.
I would want it relatively flat before trying to clap it to the head.
I used Remflex with my Downey headers and no more problem. While your at it get an extra sheet of blank gasket material to put under the carb.
shipmag
Hagler Technology LLC. Aka Shipmag
Downey was an excellent company to do business with. They were a valuable resource. Glad he is on mud and helps with technical issues.
thebigredrocker
SILVER Star
Clearly SOR priced these header's such that a couple might get returned due to manufacturing defects. It's obvious one is way out of plane. Ask for the sharpest cookie at SOR to please pick you the truest set they've got. Time is money. Don't waist either when you suspect you are about to. They'll make it right.
