Radio question (1 Viewer)

[duncancsu]

Currently I use walkie talkies when off-roading with multiple people. it's not the best but it works most of the time. What are other people using for their radio solution and why? I'd like to know if people are using CB, FRS, GMRS or HAM or a combination of them. Thanks for any feedback you can provide me. Hopefully this will help me in deciding what direction to go.

Thanks
Chris

 

[TLC2013]

I use Gmrs. I have Midland radios, prices are affordable. The mxt275 is mounted in the truck and i have a few of their handhelds for friends and family to use. Ideally I'd get off my butt and get my HAM license as that is the best option with great range.

 

[CharlieS]

I use Gmrs. I have Midland radios, prices are affordable. The mxt275 is mounted in the truck and i have a few of their handhelds for friends and family to use. Ideally I'd get off my butt and get my HAM license as that is the best option with great range.

Literally the same answer!

MTX275 in the rig and a pair of handhelds.

Oh yeah, I also bought a Ham handheld for listen only at LCDC. Meed to get my license soon.

 

[TheGrrrrr]

I use a modified Yaesu FTM-400 for both FRS/GMRS (on low power) and HAM. Have multiple Midland FRS/GMRS handhelds in the truck as well.

 

[CharlieS]

One thing that seems to be pretty consistent is one or more vehicles on any given ride not having a radio, so it's nice to carry inexpensive loaners.

 

[duncancsu]

Is GMTS more universally used? HAM would only be able to communicate with HAM?

 

[CharlieS]

A lot of groups run GMRS. $35 license with no test good for 10 years (down from $70 a year ago). Ham is better, but has a set of licensing exams that are a bit of a gatekeeper. The FCC does enforce, so although you can maybe get away with using Ham unlicensed, nobody wants to be the person they make an example of. Some radios can be programmed to do both the fixed frequency GMRS and Ham, but it isn't technically legal (at least as I understand it). Oh, also, sometimes a ride will leverage Ham for listen only for unlicensed folks, and rely on GMRS for transmitting.

 

[TheGrrrrr]

FRS/GMRS is perfect for small group runs where terrain and distance aren't a limiting factor. Probably at least 80% of the time its better than good enough even with handhelds, probably goes up to 98%+ if you are using a mobile radio with 15+ watts of transmit power and an external antenna. HAM is good for 100% of those use cases, but does require passing a very easy test. If distance or terrain are an issue, HAM is the far better option. I'm licensed for both and use both. My radio can do both, but out of respect for the FCC and other GMRS users, I only transmit GMRS on the lowest power setting which is within the legal limit and I don't use the repeaters. The part that wouldn't technically comply is that the radio is not certified for GMRS. That certification is largely so that cheap manufacturers don't produce radio's that could cause problems on the bands. It hasn't stopped them and there are millions of them in use... My radio is a high-end, reputable brand and behaves well above their standard and certainly better behaved than most of the uncertified radios in use out there.

There are many sources citing conversations with FCC counsel that indicate the FCC has no way (or desire) to enforce GMRS radio certification at the user level unless they were investigating some other violation the user committed (malicious interference) and upon inspecting the equipment, added it as charge.

The point is, whatever you use, get the license. Don't transmit using more power than needed. Learn and follow radio etiquette and you will be fine.

 

[goldwater58]

Just go for your ham technician license. Finding the time to take the exam is harder than the exam itself.

 

[CharlieS]

Just go for your ham technician license. Finding the time to take the exam is harder than the exam itself.

Agree 100%. I got took and passed my technican license on Saturday. After studying for four evenings using online resources, the test itself took less than 15 minutes at an event held by a local ham club. I did one paid study site with videos (hamradioprep.com), but the free Hamstudy.org has great flashcards and practice tests. After studying for a couple of days I was getting 91%-100% on all the practice tests, and the actual test itself was an easy test to pass. The study materials are the exact questions on the test, so if you can pass a good percentage of the questions, the test itself is almost a no-brainer.

 

[joltman]

My advice is to get both ham (not an acronym) and GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) units. The reason I say this is that GMRS/FRS uses certain frequencies within the 70cm band. Depending on the number of folks on your run, they could be spread out over many miles/through trees/up a mountain. GMRS will be great between vehicles in a small group, but with the obstacles I just mentioned, 70cm can have some issues propagating through them. This is even more true when the members of your group are using GMRS HTs (hand transceivers/handy talkies). The 2 meter band (which requires at least Technician level licensure) will have the ability to break through a lot of that (due to it's lower frequency), even on an HT. My recommendation would be to get a mobile unit (a dedicated vehicle mounted unit) for each. I say for each (GMRS/ham) just so that if the FCC ever comes knocking, you can show them you're using both and be in compliance. So that you are aware, 99%-100% of mobile "dual band" ham units (2 meter and 70cm) block the ability to transmit on the GMRS frequencies. As others have said, you can modify many mobiles/HTs to transceive on those frequencies, but that isn't up to FCC regulations. However, it should work. What you actually do is totally up to you.

Amateur radio has 3 tests (Technician, General, Extra). For trail use, you only need the Technician license which focuses more on 2 meter bands (and 70cm). Studying for the Tech exam is really simple. Go to hamstudy.org, create a free account and you can use their flash cards to study the multiple choice questions. The site can show you just the correct answer and not the other wrong answers, which makes passing the test a breeze. The questions on the site are _exactly_ the same as the test and it's all legit. The FCC puts out the questions and all answers so there's no "cheating" with websites/books giving you the questions and answers. If you want to study from a mobile device, you can pay the $5 to your preferred phone's application store (iOS App Store/Google Play) to get the mobile app for studying. The benefit of that site/app is that once you get Technician, you can use the same app to study for General (if you like).

Sorry for the novel, but I think trail comms are extremely important. Cheap GMRS HTs are a great way to get into the comms game. Once you use them, you'll see their benefits and weakness. For me, that sent me down the path of Tech license with mobile dual band ham unit, and separate GMRS mobile unit.

 

[CharlieS]

Also, you can use the hamstudy.org website for free from your mobile device without buying an app. I used that for most of my test prep. Highly recommended. My two favorite features are 1) they explain WHY an answer is correct if you click on the corner of that flash card and 2) that when you get a question wrong on a flashcard, it shuffles it back into the deck and keeps presenting it until you get it right repeatedly, so it drills the correct answer into your head. When I took the test, since I'd seen all the correct answers, most of them I knew what the correct answer would be before I finished reading the question because I'd seen it so many times. Again, it is the _EXACT_ same question as on the test.

I also have a mobile and handheld GMRS radios, but after LCDC this year, I decided that I wanted to make sure I could use HAM legally when I needed to.

 

[LCH21]

My advice is to get both ham (not an acronym) and GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) units. The reason I say this is that GMRS/FRS uses certain frequencies within the 70cm band. Depending on the number of folks on your run, they could be spread out over many miles/through trees/up a mountain. GMRS will be great between vehicles in a small group, but with the obstacles I just mentioned, 70cm can have some issues propagating through them. This is even more true when the members of your group are using GMRS HTs (hand transceivers/handy talkies). The 2 meter band (which requires at least Technician level licensure) will have the ability to break through a lot of that (due to it's lower frequency), even on an HT. My recommendation would be to get a mobile unit (a dedicated vehicle mounted unit) for each. I say for each (GMRS/ham) just so that if the FCC ever comes knocking, you can show them you're using both and be in compliance. So that you are aware, 99%-100% of mobile "dual band" ham units (2 meter and 70cm) block the ability to transmit on the GMRS frequencies. As others have said, you can modify many mobiles/HTs to transceive on those frequencies, but that isn't up to FCC regulations. However, it should work. What you actually do is totally up to you.

Amateur radio has 3 tests (Technician, General, Extra). For trail use, you only need the Technician license which focuses more on 2 meter bands (and 70cm). Studying for the Tech exam is really simple. Go to hamstudy.org, create a free account and you can use their flash cards to study the multiple choice questions. The site can show you just the correct answer and not the other wrong answers, which makes passing the test a breeze. The questions on the site are _exactly_ the same as the test and it's all legit. The FCC puts out the questions and all answers so there's no "cheating" with websites/books giving you the questions and answers. If you want to study from a mobile device, you can pay the $5 to your preferred phone's application store (iOS App Store/Google Play) to get the mobile app for studying. The benefit of that site/app is that once you get Technician, you can use the same app to study for General (if you like).

Sorry for the novel, but I think trail comms are extremely important. Cheap GMRS HTs are a great way to get into the comms game. Once you use them, you'll see their benefits and weakness. For me, that sent me down the path of Tech license with mobile dual band ham unit, and separate GMRS mobile unit.

Very good advice. I generally use FRS - Midland units, but I always have my HAM radio with me. I upgraded to Amateur Extra (I hate trying to remember frequency boundaries) so I can use HF. With HAM radio, you can talk only with other HAMs but if I am in the middle of nowhere, no cell service, and I have a breakdown, I know I can get a message out and be able to talk with someone. Problem with 2 meter and 440 is it is line of sight only. Same with FRS and such. Also, the HAM service polices itself rather strictly and does not tolerate any violations. Caught, the penalties can be severe. The bottom line with HAM radio is when the Zombie Apocalypse comes and everything is down, the only people who will still be talking with each other will be HAM operators.
Forget CB, it has become a joke. Too many bad apples nowadays. Shame.

 

[80seriesnut]

My advice is to get both ham (not an acronym) and GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) units. The reason I say this is that GMRS/FRS uses certain frequencies within the 70cm band. Depending on the number of folks on your run, they could be spread out over many miles/through trees/up a mountain. GMRS will be great between vehicles in a small group, but with the obstacles I just mentioned, 70cm can have some issues propagating through them. This is even more true when the members of your group are using GMRS HTs (hand transceivers/handy talkies). The 2 meter band (which requires at least Technician level licensure) will have the ability to break through a lot of that (due to it's lower frequency), even on an HT. My recommendation would be to get a mobile unit (a dedicated vehicle mounted unit) for each. I say for each (GMRS/ham) just so that if the FCC ever comes knocking, you can show them you're using both and be in compliance. So that you are aware, 99%-100% of mobile "dual band" ham units (2 meter and 70cm) block the ability to transmit on the GMRS frequencies. As others have said, you can modify many mobiles/HTs to transceive on those frequencies, but that isn't up to FCC regulations. However, it should work. What you actually do is totally up to you.

Amateur radio has 3 tests (Technician, General, Extra). For trail use, you only need the Technician license which focuses more on 2 meter bands (and 70cm). Studying for the Tech exam is really simple. Go to hamstudy.org, create a free account and you can use their flash cards to study the multiple choice questions. The site can show you just the correct answer and not the other wrong answers, which makes passing the test a breeze. The questions on the site are _exactly_ the same as the test and it's all legit. The FCC puts out the questions and all answers so there's no "cheating" with websites/books giving you the questions and answers. If you want to study from a mobile device, you can pay the $5 to your preferred phone's application store (iOS App Store/Google Play) to get the mobile app for studying. The benefit of that site/app is that once you get Technician, you can use the same app to study for General (if you like).

Sorry for the novel, but I think trail comms are extremely important. Cheap GMRS HTs are a great way to get into the comms game. Once you use them, you'll see their benefits and weakness. For me, that sent me down the path of Tech license with mobile dual band ham unit, and separate GMRS mobile unit.

@joltman like to thank you for suggesting hamstudy.org. I used an app to study for my technician license over the summer and took the test in September and passed. And while the app did help me study and pass the test I found it to be lacking. After reading your above post just this morning I've been on the hamstudy.org website and can say I already think this website is 10 fold better then the app. As a matter of fact I feel so confident in the website that I have already signed up to take an upgrade test on November 12th. Thanks again

 

[rlynch356]

I have been using a Retevis GMRS handheld lately (the RA85) and have been impressed with the out of the box range it has. and it is out of the Box USB-C rechargeable so no iffy cables to deal with (Ala beofang, Midland, etc)

the USB-C port is what I consider its main advantage.

Couple of things though.. They program these with custom tones that need to be removed to use them with other GMRS radios... It's a simple process to fix with a little google action.
It comes and stays pre-programed for GMRS channels - but unlocking it you can also use UHF channels (for receive/monitoring uses only without a license of course).

I may install one of their mobile units as well, always nice to run both a GMRS dedicated radio (and have a hand held when needed), and a HAM radio... easier to keep everything separate and legal. (I use both depending the group)

 

[varun bhargava]

I use Gmrs. I have Midland radios, prices are affordable. The mxt275 is mounted in the truck and i have a few of their handhelds for friends and family to use. Ideally I'd get off my butt and get my HAM license as that is the best option with great range.

Can you provide pictures of where you mounted the main unit and the mic?

 

[DesmoPilot]

Can you provide pictures of where you mounted the main unit and the mic?

I located the head unit of the MXT275 in the dash under the center channel speaker. Then ran a CAT cable extension down to the left side of center console. The handheld unit then just plugs in there. Cable Extension

I am considering moving to the MXT575. If I do, I will place the head unit under the passenger front seat and run the CAT cable to the same location I have it now. The 575 is bigger, so would be a tighter fit underneath the center channel speaker.

 

[varun bhargava]

Looks great. I was looking at the MXT275 myself. Are you stepping up due to range or something else?

 

[DesmoPilot]

Looks great. I was looking at the MXT275 myself. Are you stepping up due to range or something else?

I am not getting great range, so thinking I will move to the higher power option. Range isn't horrible, just not as good as I would like.

 

[varun bhargava]

I am not getting great range, so thinking I will move to the higher power option. Range isn't horrible, just not as good as I would like.

What is your antenna setup, and any quantifiable range you can pass along?

I was thinking about the below setup w/the 3dB antenna mounted using the KOAN.

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