New LX-470 Fiasco - Need To Vent

[jp213a]

Well, unfortunately things seem to be taking a turn for the worse.

I got a call from the general manager around 6PM tonight. The gist of it is that they're trying to back out of replacing the wiring harness. .

I bet the general manager got a price of $5,000 or more for a new SRS wiring harness and the labor hours to change it out. No wonder he is trying to back out. According to the 2002 FSM (in bold print), "NOTICE: If the wire harness used in the SRS is damaged, replace the WHOLE wire harness assembly" (page RS-50). The harness runs from the front bumper sensors to the steering wheel to the passenger side of the dash to the seat belts pretensioners to the airbag computer assembly. If you have side airbags, there is probably more. All the connectors are gold plated for low electrical resistence. There will be lots of interior dismantling involved in installing the new harness and it is dificult to get it back like it came from the factory, especially if the technician is trying to beat the flat rate. I think your case for a new vehicile is strong.

 

[SINCITY100]

I bet the general manager got a price of $5,000 or more for a new SRS wiring harness and the labor hours to change it out. No wonder he is trying to back out. According to the 2002 FSM (in bold print), "NOTICE: If the wire harness used in the SRS is damaged, replace the WHOLE wire harness assembly" (page RS-50). The harness runs from the front bumper sensors to the steering wheel to the passenger side of the dash to the seat belts pretensioners to the airbag computer assembly. If you have side airbags, there is probably more. All the connectors are gold plated for low electrical resistence. There will be lots of interior dismantling involved in installing the new harness and it is dificult to get it back like it came from the factory, especially if the technician is trying to beat the flat rate. I think your case for a new vehicile is strong.

Correct you are JP..

You are talking big $$$ to change that harness, and virtually EVERY interior panel will have to be removed or disturbed during replacement..

Many of those panels require breaking or damaging the retainers/clips when removed...You could have a serious rattle-trap on your hands !

 

[e9999]

well, pretty obvious that if he doesn't want to sign the paper, he's not sure it'd be OK. Ergo even more reason to push seriously.

Sorry to say, but I've found out in several dealings with insurances and dealers that you being a nice guy is exactly what they're banking on to screw you. Some people in these businesses count on most normal people being reluctant to play hardball and having a genuine aversion to being pushy...


Seems to me that if they are backpedaling on the wiring you are in better shape as far as getting a new one, cuz airbag safety is one potent argument.

What bothers me, though, is that if you return it, they might just sell it as is and undisclosed to somebody else... gotta be a way to make sure that doesn't happen...

 

[cary]

Just a few more comments before you contact your attorney:

1) You might remind them if they are so confident of the existing wiring harness, they should have not trouble agreeing to warrant it will work as designed.

2) You may want to remind the Dealer, you and they reached an agreement which is binding. Tell them if they want to just replace the vehicle fine, but if they want to rescind the agreement by not replacing the wiring harness, you will have no choice but to turn this over to your attorney. Tell them very simply, this isn't a threat, but they will leave you no alternative if they breach their agreement.

 

[Morty]

If they won't replace the harness, it's time to get some help. It's too bad they won't do the right thing.

 

[Gohawks63]

I wouldn't touch the vehicle unless the harness is replaced, ESPECIALLY since they don't want to sign a statement attesting to the viability of the airbags.

Good Luck.

 

[Tinkerer]

(The Worlds Longest Thread!)

Chiming in:

For such a critical vehicle system as the airbags, I'd be very unhappy with the prospect of a dealer changing the entire harness system.

Many opportunities for error. Could result in latent problems that show up later. More visits to get things fixed, more dealer lies and denials. Even beyond warranty, when they would try to charge you for their earlier mistakes.

This is in addition to the likelyhood of resulting damage and squeaks/rattles from all of the interior panels etc. being replaced.

No, this sounds like it's time to demand a new vehicle.

I can't believe they are balking. They will lose a few grand on this. That's pocket change to a healthy dealership.

 

[r3run33]

hye greyn good luck but you may be able to do this with out getting a lawyer go to the customer service rep for the area he in turn will be able to push probably for the new vehicle espec b/c yours is brand new and they can then use your old one as a demo keep stressing the safty issue and that will be your best point it may take some time ( i had a jeep grd chr that kept stalling and was done as a buy back for us a few years back it took 6months) i think if you call the 1800 25 lexus you can then find the service rep for the area. also dont pick up the lx until its fixed.

 

[r3run33]

oh i forgot to add this for all of you that think lexus is so great our sunroof rattles when you go around 70 to 80mph but under that speed it is fine the service guy said why are you going that fast anyway??????? and he was not joking around.

 

[Greg B]

oh i forgot to add this for all of you that think lexus is so great our sunroof rattles when you go around 70 to 80mph but under that speed it is fine the service guy said why are you going that fast anyway??????? and he was not joking around.

Tell that moron that the speed limit in some states is 70 mph and then ask him how often he drives UNDER the speed limit. What a tool....

 

[cruiserheadrat]

If you need to unload those sox tickets for a profit let me know.

 

[SWUtah]

Anyone know what the repair procedure is from Lexus for a wiring harness, if the harness has been breached? If the Lexus repair manual states that it must be replaced then I would think contacting the regional rep. would be all that would be required for either a repair or vehicle replacement. I would do this before the Lawyer was brought into the case. But as other are stating if they replace the entire harness, odds of having a vehicle that might rattle is increased. I would think from a expense standpoint the dealer would have recourse agains't the subcontractor that screwed up the install. Ever wonder how many people are driving around with defective airbag systems? I've also heard that Lexus has alway had some problems with airbags not working when needed.

 

[ace10]

...I've also heard that Lexus has alway had some problems with airbags not working when needed.

what you're saying is pretty serious and i'd love to see the support.

 

[r3run33]

hey thanks for the support whe the guy said that i laughed and he just looked at me anyway i have to take my truck in they are gonna work on it. Now i learned my lesson from the gr cherk have everything documented and they have 3 tried to fix (this applies to both pa and nj where we live) and even though this is not a safty issue as is the air bag is; it is a defect!

 

[kcdude]

After I got off the phone with him, I put a call into Lexus Customer Satisfaction. I'm sure they'll get in touch with the dealer, but have no idea how helpful they can or will be.

Have you been contacted by the regional rep yet? I would demand that the regional rep be involved in any discussions moving forward. I think you would be suprised with the dealer's change of attitude with the rep involved.

Not to be too personal....did you finance it through lexus/TFS? If so, I would contact them as well and indicate that you are returning the vehicle and expect the loan to be voided. I would have everyone under the sun giving the dealer grief over this.

Lastly, call a friend, call in a favor, or just pay the man....have an attourney draft a nice little letter to the dealer....and demand complete replacement of the airbag harness.

Hang in there!

 

[ShottsUZJ100]

At this point, I think it's time to get a lawyer involved - until now I really didn't see the point as the dealer seemed to be willing to do the right thing and make things right. I honestly think I've been more than reasonable up till now, but my patience has it's limits and has run out at this point. This is a major purchase for me and has been the 2nd least pleasant car ownership experience of my life (and is fast heading to be the least pleasant).

Sorry for the bad news. Some goode news? You already have a written record to supply to your lawyer...this thread! Good luck!

 

[e9999]

not to rub it in, but *even* if the dealer were to agree to sign some sort of lifetime warranty / promise of good functioning with the airbags, I'd *still* be having that in the back of my mind as a potential hazard for my family. After all how do you know they'd repaired it right? That'd make it somewhat uncomfortable.

I'd can the deal myself.

 

[greynolds]

not to rub it in, but *even* if the dealer were to agree to sign some sort of lifetime warranty / promise of good functioning with the airbags, I'd *still* be having that in the back of my mind as a potential hazard for my family. After all how do you know they'd repaired it right? That'd make it somewhat uncomfortable.

Well of course. My whole point in all of this is that the dealer has to do SOMETHING here. I actually think that getting something in writing is the least likely option as if they did that and the air bags ever malfunctioned, they would have a huge liability on their hands.

I'd can the deal myself.

Well yeah, but I have to be prepared for other possible outcomes. They do have a 4th choice - give me a full refund and let me go to another dealer, but they wouldn't want to do that as it would cost them money ...

 

[tabraha]

Being that the FSM has "replace entire harness" in bold pretty much shows where this dealership stands since they think splicing it is satisfactory.

Yet further proof of deceit/ineptitude on their part is that the dealership will not assume any responsibility in writing after they fail to follow Factory specified procedures. Lexus corporate would SMOKE them for not changing out the harness. Especially since it took the customer bringing it to their attention and they still tried to skirt around it. The interior of that vehicle will never be the same after being taken apart to that level. You WILL have rattles/fit/finish problems sooner than would be acceptable now. Not to mention the devaluation of the vehicle.

Get a lawyer. Get a new vehicle. Get a new dealership.

I would also caution against picking the vehicle up. The more you "use" the vehicle, the more you are "accepting" it. I think it is a ploy on their part and you should have legal counsel before taking the keys to that puppy.

Again though, hang in there!

 

[greynolds]

Well it's another day and another story .

I just got a call from the always friendly service consultant. The deal for today is that the bumper has been dealt with (parts replaced, repainted), the vibration problem is mostly taken care of (they still aren't quite happy with it, so want to keep it another day), and they have ordered a replacement wiring harness. Supposedly, the harness will take a couple of weeks to get.

He said I should probably be able to pick up the vehicle tomorrow and then bring it back in when the harness arrives. He didn't say it, but I got the impression I could choose to just keep the loaner vehicle until the replacement harness is installed. Keeping the loaner is probably the smart choice, but I'd also really like to get a chance to drive my own vehicle a bit before I have to make my first car payment and I just don't like the RX-330 very much - I'm not really comfortable in it (I'm 6'1" and a big guy), it's not really fun to drive, and the radio sucks compared to the Mark Levinson system in the LX. The plus side for keeping the loaner is that it costs them money every day and it drives the point home that I'm dead serious (no pun intended) about having the wiring problem resolved.

I called a lawyer's office today, but haven't heard back yet - I just got their answering service.